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I'd say thats right to a large extent, he was a spilot, a junior officer. Does he have the military experience of a Clarke, Petraeus Powell no way. I think one may be missing the boat on understanding what some mean when they say he has "military" experience.
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People are using his military experience in Vietnam as a justification that he's better on national security issues. The question then has to become, does he have any experience LEADING military operations. No. Does he have experience formulating national security policy. No. So in and of itself "experience" can't be used as an argument for McCain on national security. The media and National Security Voters should be challenging McCain on the rationale behind his national security platform rather than merely accepting because he was in the military and was tortured that somehow means he knows anything about the military.
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To me it means he has served, as to his service and what it implies regards his feelings afterward and how he realtes to such, for instance as he was a victim of torture, he is against it, a state of mind I, not a victim but a veteran still finds hard to understand.
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He has flip flopped on torture and presently is in favor of Bush Administration interrogation tactics. I know it's hard to keep up with the guys flip flops, but yup, that's another one.
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Kerry served, well done, but and heres were many of you might want to sit up and listen a bit, it WAS NOT the swift boat adds per se’ that really did him in, i.e the other sailors in the grp shots etc. it was the winter soldier hearings, the lies he told at them and the dishonor he attempted to shed on the military.
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Not sure how Kerry became part of this discussion. However, if you think that anyone was thinking about John Kerry and the Winter soldier hearings during the swift boat controversy you are sorely mistaken. Those guys flat out lied about John Kerry. Everyone who was on the boat WITH John Kerry says they were under enemy fire. Period. Perhaps you're feeling guilty and you believed them and that's why you bring it up?
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Its one of those things that registers with people accross the spectrum. It speaks to Kerrys (and maybe obamas we’ll see) lack of understanding regards what people here feel on a visceral level towards the military; Kerry thought it was a winner, he could not be made to be seen as hostile to the military, he dragged it out, he thought he was going to get a free ride regarding all the crap he did in the past regarding the service, that was delusional imho.
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Miscalculated the willingness of veterans to lie, for months and on every channel about what happened in Vietnam? Sure I guess he did.
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It never occurred to him that when you attempt to pull the structure down or berate in that fashion people are going to be upset. The military in this country is one of the very few institutions across the board that is seen as truly a meritocracy sans bias, honorable, above the rest of the gov. regards political machinations and the like, AND a reflection of the country as a whole. You fuck with that at your peril, veteran or not.
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None of this has to do with John McCain. I was hoping you'd actually have some evidence that John McCain has experience on leading on national security. You don't.
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Old roman saying, Juvenal I believe; “It is easier to find a witness bearing false evidence against a citizen
, than it is to find one who will bear true testimony against the interest and honor of a solider”.
Soldiers raping looting in scenes reminiscent of ghengis khan? Yea well we are right back to the McClellan issue, why then especially as on Officer, did he not report these violations when they occurred? He never did have any Names, dates places..etc. Sol he was seen as jackal, true or not.
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Oh so you're applying some kind of standard to John Kerry because he didn't have the specific names of people who he saw committing atrocities. Atrocities every hsitorian of the Vietnam war knows existed and which few would discount. But you don't care at all that "swift boat" veterans lied, and lied and LIED about John Kerry. Just got on television and lied and were supported by the RNC. OK.
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That being said McCain has been accrued military "experience" that is more of a reflection of his service and platform as a whole, the guy spent 5 1/2 years in a pow camp treated harshly etc. He understands the military mindset better than obama thats for sure,
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Can you explain how being a POW translates into qualifications to formulate national security strategies? I'm fascinated to find out.
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he has been a senator or in congress for 27 years, he has heard a lot seen a lot and with his limited hands on experience can I think make a claim to be more aware or experienced regards such, but hes no Ike, or Powell thats for sure. Lie it or not people are averse to critique of soldiers and they think better of one who has served honorably and speaks well of the organization, call it patriotism blind or not, that’s a reality. And this will accrue to him the term “experienced ” ala military matters whether real or imagined.
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So we're in agreement that basically people want to believe that McCain has experience simply because they want to believe it. Isn't this EXACTLY my point about Right Wing Media MYTHS. A myth is something that people "blindly" believe and will suffer no one pointing out how false it is. This is my argument, thanks for making it for me.