Originally Posted by segep soch

Well you sure don't fit the stereotype.

Originally Posted by chathamfarmer

Depends on the sterotype. I do fit the rural hayseed sterotype. There are several gay and lesbian couples in the area that farm. Here is a poem I wrote about it. A little off topic but I think it might make people laugh .

Wally and Joe live together on the farm
Gun rack in thier truck tattoos on thier arms.
Card bearin' members of the NRA
Got a target set up on a bale of hay.
Wally re-enacts with the Rebel flag
Joe knocks 'em dead with his Dolly Parton drag.

Wearin' Carhart and Wrangler and drivin' old wrecks
They're down home Southern country queer redencks.

Then there's Sally and Susy right next door
Two bio-diesel dykes with a 4X4
They grow organic Angus and free-range bird
Got every Indigo album and sing every word.
They read Backwoods Home with Massad Ayoob.
They're boat Boudicca's got an Evinrude.

Wearin' Carhart and Wrangler and drivin' old wrecks
They're down-home Southern country queer rednecks.

We live in trailers we got big dogs.
We shovel horse shit and we slop the hogs.
No champagne brunch with the HRC
A long-neck bottle's good enough for me.
Can't shove me in a closet gotta understand
I got a 12 guage Mossberg and a steady hand.

Wearin' Carhart and Wrangler and drivin' old wrecks
We're down-home Southern country queer rednecks.

Originally Posted by chathamfarmer

Depends on the sterotype. I do fit the rural hayseed sterotype. There are several gay and lesbian couples in the area that farm. Here is a poem I wrote about it. A little off topic but I think it might make people laugh .

Wally and Joe live together on the farm
Gun rack in thier truck tattoos on thier arms.
Card bearin' members of the NRA
Got a target set up on a bale of hay.
Wally re-enacts with the Rebel flag
Joe knocks 'em dead with his Dolly Parton drag.

Wearin' Carhart and Wrangler and drivin' old wrecks
They're down home Southern country queer redencks.

Then there's Sally and Susy right next door
Two bio-diesel dykes with a 4X4
They grow organic Angus and free-range bird
Got every Indigo album and sing every word.
They read Backwoods Home with Massad Ayoob.
They're boat Boudicca's got an Evinrude.

Wearin' Carhart and Wrangler and drivin' old wrecks
They're down-home Southern country queer rednecks.

We live in trailers we got big dogs.
We shovel horse shit and we slop the hogs.
No champagne brunch with the HRC
A long-neck bottle's good enough for me.
Can't shove me in a closet gotta understand
I got a 12 guage Mossberg and a steady hand.

Wearin' Carhart and Wrangler and drivin' old wrecks
We're down-home Southern country queer rednecks.

Originally Posted by Benjamin

While I support equal rights, I have some concerns about the legal recognition of gay unions. I personally think it's too big of a change right now, and I don't want the defnition of the family to continue to be changed up. It's a losing issue right now, although I think the eventual application of the 14th to gays will happen.

Originally Posted by Thane

No, it won't. The minority status they think they can acheive won't happen either.

Because, Minority status has been determined by the U.S. supreme court on three criteria:

1. Economic deprivation: No. Those engaged in the homosexual "lifestyle" are among the most advantaged people in the U.S. On average, they have a higher per capita income than heterosexuals and higher household incomes. [ Wall Street Journal, Feb. 10, 1989, and New York Times, Aug. 22, 1990 ]

2. Political powerlessness: No. Homosexuals demonstrate great influential political power far beyond their actual numbers. The human rights campaign fund has annually donated millions of dollars to candidates, more than most other non-corporate PACs [The Economist, Apr. 24, 1993]. Media news and entertainment coverage is overwhelmingly favorable.

3. Immutable characteristics: No. Minority groups share unchangeable, benign, non-behavioral traits such as race, ethnicity, disability, or national origin. Homosexuals are the only group to claim minority status based on behavior. SEXUAL behaviour.

Forget it. Not going to happen for "them".

Originally Posted by MareTranquility

Lack of research coupled with a weakness in reading comprehension complicated by an tendency towards echolalia makes your arguments seem even more ignorant and bigoted than even you probably intend them to be.

Originally Posted by Thane

Ahhhh. Is THAT it.

Glad you could straighten that out for me. Guess I better work on my "reading comprehension".

Guess what buddy ? You won't get what you want with this persistent attack on my "reading comprehension". Yes, it's very obvious what you're trying to get.

My "arguments" may seem "ignorant and bigoted" to you. I'm sorry, I can't help you. Take it up with the Supreme Court. See what gains you attain by calling THEM "ignorant and bigoted"

Originally Posted by MareTranquility

The Supreme Court outlawed slavery eventually, ratified women's right to vote and own property, acknowledged that racial discrimination was wrong, ended bans on interracial marriage, and declared sodomy laws unconstitutional. Despite George the Monkey's attempts to pack the Court with religious crazies, I suspect that they will get around to us eventually. It's instructive that the upcoming generation of kids overwhelmingly supports homosexuals having full legal rights--you and your ilk are dinosaurs dying out slowly and all the crap you are bleating about is nothing more than the death rattle of another generation of ignorant, fearful people.

Originally Posted by Thane

Ya, ok

The venom you continue to display with your use of fancy words and language meant to impress, shows how pissed you are that society continues rejecting your perverse ideas and "lifestyle".

Continue being pissed or move on buddy. You don't always get what you want in life, that's just the hardcore reality. If you still haven't learned this I certainly can't help you, you'll learn it in your own time.

Originally Posted by SMadsen

Marriage is surrounded by its own set of requirements that can be seen as forms of discrimination simply by being defined (age, kinship or consanguinity (sp.?), number of partners, citizenship and residency, mental capacity, veneral diseases in some cases etc.).

Originally Posted by thane

3. Immutable characteristics: No. Minority groups share unchangeable, benign, non-behavioral traits such as race, ethnicity, disability, or national origin. Homosexuals are the only group to claim minority status based on behavior. SEXUAL behaviour.

Originally Posted by offspring13

Age and mental capacity are subject to entering into any contract. Of course citizenship counts because non-legals cannot enter into a contract of our country. Veneral diseases? I've never heard of this and don't see legal grounds for banning this either. Incest? I see no legal reason for banning it. Number of partners? By the nature of the contract, it cannot sustain more than 2 partners unless altered dramaticly. This shows why government shouldn't get involved in the situation to begin with.


...

Originally Posted by offspring13

Age and mental capacity are subject to entering into any contract. Of course citizenship counts because non-legals cannot enter into a contract of our country. Veneral diseases? I've never heard of this and don't see legal grounds for banning this either. Incest? I see no legal reason for banning it. Number of partners? By the nature of the contract, it cannot sustain more than 2 partners unless altered dramaticly. This shows why government shouldn't get involved in the situation to begin with.

Originally Posted by offspring13

Being gay, or being attracted to the same sex, is an immutable characteristic. Unless of course, you want to claim that you made the choice at some point to be heterosexual. Behavior, or actual sex, doesn't enter into the situation.

Originally Posted by Thane

"There are a lot of studies out that show 66% of homosexuals that desire to change have done so. And yet there are a lot of psychiatrists who will not treat a person who comes in saying, `I'm a homosexual, and I don't like it and I want to change,' and they will not treat them. And there are some in fact who will tell them that you just need to adjust to the fact that you're a homosexual, and I'll help you adjust to it." [ Dr. James Mallory in ."Coming Out: Breaking Free from Homosexuality" ]
[b]Hmmmm... So "being gay" ISN'T an immutable characteristic. No, it isn't.B]
Just because some character on the internet who calls im/herself "offspring13" says it IS doesn't make it so."If homosexuality were a trait determined entirely by a person's genes, one would expect 100 percent of the identical (monozygotic or MZ) twins of homosexuals to also be homosexual. Yet this is not the case; indeed, `what is most intriguing' about the twins studies to Byne and Parsons `is the large proportion of MZ twins who were discordant for homosexuality despite sharing not only their genes but also their prenatal and familial environments." [ William Byne and Bruce Parsons, "Human Sexual Orientation: The Biologic Theories Reappraised," Archives of General Psychiatry, March 1993, 50:230, cited in Peter Sprigg and Timothy Dailey, Getting it Straight: What the Research Shows About Homosexuality (Washington, DC: Family Research council, 2004), 9 ]
"Virtually all of the evidence argues against there being a determinative physiological causal factor, and I know of no researcher who believes that such a determinative factor exists." [ Steven Goldberg, When Wish Replaces Thought: Why So Much of What you Believe is False (Buffalo, N.Y.: Prometheus Books, 1992), quoted in NARTH Bulletin, Volume 2, Number 3, Dec. 1994, 5 ]