Sorry, I was just picking nits. It's not really that important. I guess my main point was that some classrooms are going to be full of students that all perform below standards, and others the opposite.

And I fear I came off too harshly. I do absolutely agree that ADD and ADHD are overdiagnosed, often as an excuse. They're symptoms of a culture that is changing to one where people can't concentrate on anything for more than 5 or 10 minutes. Those people fortunate enough to have some real parenting and training on patience and attention span will be very well prepared for the future!


Absolutely, that makes sense. I don't know how much of that decrease in entitlements can come from the schools alone, though. I (maybe because of where I taught) really have to blame the parents for a lot of the problems.

Bottled guacamole? Blasphemer!



As an aside: have you read Freakonomics? I'm just finishing the book; it has some interesting things to say.

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The BIGGEST issue I have with my son's school teaches to the test (Texas Assessment of Knowledge and Skills (TAKS™) ). His favorite classes are the ones that are not on the TAKS test because there is more of a challenge for him. Every week his school work is sent home and it's a packet full of 105s, 100s, 99s, and then there will be a 53 - why...because he gets to the point of bordom and he really don't give a rat's ass that day and the teacher is lucky he even bother to write his name on the paper before he turned it in. He's a straight A student although the 3rd six weeks his reading grade did drop from an A to a C because he was bored and decided he wasn't doing the work. We talked about it and of course the next six weeks it was back of to his usual A. It drives me nuts that my son has to sit through classes where the teachers teach to the dumbest kid and he has to listen to the same thing repeatedly. This is our first year in this school district since we moved last summer. He was in GATE classes in his previous school, but the new school wouldn't place him in the classes this year and after talking with other parents I think it's because the school is so small the don't have the funds to fully support GATE classes even though I was told the classes were offered I really don't think they are.

I live in an area where the teachers will flat out tell you the parents don't care and the students lack motivation. It's very sad, because that's not how I've been raising my son and now he's surrounded by it. We've discussed home schooling him.

This is how I would fix it:
- Do away with state standardized testing like the TAKS
- Seperate the bright kids and let them advance with the lesson instead of making them sit there until the dumb kid gets it
- Get parents involved and find a way to motivate the kids

I recently had to go to an attendance hearing at the school because my son was below the mandatory 90% attendance law. Alec has severe allergies and asthama and he had missed 13 out of 127 days of school. The Vice Principal was giving me the usual speech he gives at these hearings about absences effecting grades and the student's ability to do well on the TAKS test. When I informed him that Alec is a straight A student and recieved near commended results on his TAKS test the meeting was quickly over and he then told me that as long as Alec passes all portions of the TAKS and his absences are medical related, then he'll be promoted to the next grade even if he falls below the 90%. If the school even tries to give me anymore grief over it, I will yank my boy out of school so fast and home school him. BTW, my son attends the only exemplary school in the area, which is the highest rating the state gives based on their stupid TAKS test.

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Oh, don't even get me started. NCLB is really working to destroy what's left of education here. High-stakes testing is a pointless waste of time and resources.

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Thoughts awe hame tak awa ma fear
Sweat an bluid hide ma veil awe tears

Half of the work he brought home last week was TAKS related. Half! The math portion of the test is coming up April 17. In the couple weeks leading up to TAKS the amount will increase from 50% to near 100%. Since the math portion of the test is what's coming up his math work is already near 100% TAKS related. Several worksheets on various math skills makes up one grade - one math packet is one grade. His TAKS grades last week - 97 and 100. From the weeks before we have 100, 100, 100, 100, and 97. Does it sound like he needs to do more stupid TAKS math worksheets? Oh, but wait...we also have a workbook that was sent home that we're supposed to make sure he does - not for any grade, just to help him with the test material. Needless to say, we haven't done a single page in that workbook. It was the same thing when he was preparing for the reading portion of the test a few weeks ago. He was one question short of a commendable score. What a huge waste of time! Do away with that stupid test and let my kid move on. I'm very happy my kid makes such good grades, but when he's completed so many worksheets over the same material he should be making 100s on them. I'm more proud of a "B" on a science (something not on TAKS) worksheet, then I am of a 100 on a TAKS worksheet.

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I didn't expect my "suggestions" would be taken very seriously (trying to be humorous) but there is some validity to them. Some students do absolutely nothing but disrupt classes. How does keeping them in school help either them (they aren't learning anything) or the other students they are preventing from learning? It also discourages good people from getting into or remaining in teaching as they have to spend all their time trying to keep order.

A legal class of serfs? Anyone who doesn't get at least a high school education today is voluntarily making themselves into a "serf". Giving them a high school diploma when they can't even read or write, as is done today, doesn't do them any favors. It simply degrades the diploma and makes it meaningless. Employers soon find out the truth!

Learning disabilities definitely should be dealt with, but I am sure there aren't as many kids with disabilities as are diagnosed with them these days. While some really do have these conditions, the real reason so many are diagnosed with them is that schools get much more money from the government for a kid with disabilities than for a normal kid - and working in a school I know for a fact this has a big influence on diagnosis.

I agree with some here that vocational education and hands-on training would be a solution for some. But there are also some that need to be forced to learn to work and to submit to discipline. And some that would be better off away from dysfunctional homes.


What I actually see happening in the schools from working there is there are a lot of good kids who are working hard, but there is a minority of "bad apples". The teachers have gotten tired of dealing with them and simply ignore their behavior, because the administration does nothing when the teacher refers a problem student to them. They are too afraid of the parents or that a parent might go to the school board. (And of course "sports kids" always get preferential treatment and are usually the biggest troublemakers.) Also, when you meet some of the parents you realize why the child is a problem.

Another problem not mentioned is that the educational system is run by educational "professionals" (not teachers), most of whom haven't set foot in a classroom in many years. They come up with these "brilliant" ideas and force them to be adopted by schools (NCLB is the latest). By the time they prove to be a disaster a new crop of "professionals" with a new idea is waiting in line, so we get an endless succession of political educational fads rather than a good basic education. State Education Departments are loaded with these people.

Getting the politics out of education will be necessary to turn education around, but this means getting the government out of education and just the opposite is happening at present. I'm not sure that turning education over to business leaders is a good idea, though. Most of them are no better than educational administrators, both having risen to their level of incompetence. I am for privately run schools and school choice, with minimal government involvement.

As for Jesus' teachings, he was always willing to forgive and to teach, but He never forced anyone to listen to Him. He also didn't waste much time on those who chose not to. The Bible also sets up a chain of command and never advocates disorder and anarchy. It definitely teaches personal and parental responsibility.

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The problem is that the teachers really don't have any choice. Their jobs are on the line. NCLB has made it so that the test is all that matters. Who can blame them for only focusing on the test?

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1. Abolish Public Education and expend private schools where teachers can be fired because her class isnt passing.

2.Make parents pay the bills to send kids to school.

3.non Unionized teachers!

Steveox, perhaps you should either work in education, or at least have received one before commenting on the issue?

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Staun ma groon al nae be afraid
Thoughts awe hame tak awa ma fear
Sweat an bluid hide ma veil awe tears

Parents not raising their kids to give a damn would account for the bulk of educational deficits and problems, in my humble opinion. However, I've not ever taught or worked for a school district. But, judging from the kids I know and knew growing up, I would guess this isn't a far off bet.

Pram is dead on with the assesment of most parents screwing and dropping their kids off, at least IMO.

The good Dr. is dead on with "Your kid has this" instead of saying "The kids a dunce". I also like the idea of separating the kids based on their speed of learning, though pram has a point in that it would require more classrooms and training.

I'll post more later, just wanted to make these comments now before I forgot them. : )

Did Steve just say...ABOLISH public education? Oh geez...

We don't grade - but we do go for 90% mastery - so the lowest grade you could get would be an A. We find other ways to teach a subject, until the child learns, rather than categorize them.

Every Monday my kids grab a workplan - essentially a list of assignments they're expected to get done over the week. This is basic skills stuff - grammar (we still diagram sentences!), math, geometry, writing, word attack and content reading. They know how much time they have available - usually 4 three hour morning blocks. They have freedom of choice - what work they want to do and when, and with whom - as long as they use the freedom responsibly (get their work done, and don't interfere with others getting work done). I routinely let kids go sit on the porch and work unsupervised, in small groups. Since there are no grades, cheating isn't an issue. And we believe in peer tutoring, so they know to give clues to each other to help each other. They often check each other's work - or check their own work. (I tell them they should be making a few mistakes - no mistakes means no challenge, and too many is just frustrating.)

Lessons, in the morning, are usually small - 4-6 kids sitting on the floor with me - while the rest go about their business. There is a large rug in the center of the room where we can all sit, and I do occasional large group lessons there - usually grammar or writing - which they follow up with the appropriate levelled practice work. I add or take off work as individuals need - and I'm more likely to get asked for harder work than anything else - Montessori kids hate boredom. Montessorians regard learning as a natural function - we believe in a prepared (enriched) environment and following the child (essentially removing their roadblocks to learning.) I can take away freedoms, assign seats, do what I need to maintain order - but in essence I'm not expected to be in charge of the kids - the kids are expected to be in charge of themselves.

Afternoons are when we do cultural subjects - science, geography and history. Lower elementary students learn history from the big bang through evolution to the appearance of humans on earth. Upper El (what I teach) starts with australopithicus, and goes through history up until around 1776. Science is usually experiment centered - I tend to drop the workplan and do science immersion weeks. We teach cell theory (prokaryotic and eukaryotic) , 5 kingdoms, timeline of life, and a few other things yearly. Geography (physical, political, economic, etc is usually centered on two continents a year, so we can cover the earth in the 3 year cycle. Of course, now that the state has decided content testing as well as skills is needed, it's going to be harder. But frankly, state standards are so low, they can be given as homework.

We're doing our three weeks training before state exams - which happen next week - then I loosen the workplan and start doing big projects. The kid's favorite is to take everything we've learned (biology, physiology, ecology, biomes, social systems, etc - and build a workable alien species with their own biome and social systems. I give them a week, and they do it in small groups, then present to the larger group. They come up with some amazing stuff.

And, since we're a charter, there's no tuition.

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And there is distrust in Washington. I am surprised, frankly, at the amount of distrust that exists in this town. And I'm sorry it's the case, and I'll work hard to try to elevate it." --George W. Bush, Jan. 29, 2007

Actually, I think ADD and ADHD may well be symptoms of how the brain adapts to a high stress multi-media culture. How many screens are there on the average news show, nowadays? You have to split your attention to survive - and the brain is a very adaptable organ.

Having said that, I usually find ADD kids to be really bright ones. The pitiful ones are the really slow kids who can't contribute much academically. The best you can do is teach them good work habits - help them make the best of what they have. I've worked with kids with retardation, ADD, ADHD, OCD, ODD, Aspergers and autism. At least one of my students had 3 diagnoses - an incredibly smart kid, but not a happy one. His mother refused to get help for him - didn't want him labelled.

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And there is distrust in Washington. I am surprised, frankly, at the amount of distrust that exists in this town. And I'm sorry it's the case, and I'll work hard to try to elevate it." --George W. Bush, Jan. 29, 2007

I half suspect that NCLB is a plot to dummy down america by focusing all attentionon the lowest order thinking operations - memorization and regurgitation.

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And there is distrust in Washington. I am surprised, frankly, at the amount of distrust that exists in this town. And I'm sorry it's the case, and I'll work hard to try to elevate it." --George W. Bush, Jan. 29, 2007

Yes i did!

Well, you'd probably get the kid vote, but I suspect a few weeks of all the rugrats running free and causing havoc would be enough. Or should we abolish child labor laws, and put them to work in factories?

Even in the 3rd world most countries try to provide a rudimentary education for the kids. And the US would be a 3rd world country within a few years of this proposal being enacted.

__________________
And there is distrust in Washington. I am surprised, frankly, at the amount of distrust that exists in this town. And I'm sorry it's the case, and I'll work hard to try to elevate it." --George W. Bush, Jan. 29, 2007