White Privilege and Male Privilege - U.S. Politics Online: A Political Discussion Forum

Crystal · #1 (**permalink**) 07-06-2007

I feel ignorant, although my eyes have been opened to some things regarding race. I'm still trying to take it all in and figure out how my daily experiences and my particular circumstances compare with the author's. I am wondering how much of this essay is true and how much of it would apply to different countries - both male privilege and white privilege. When comparing myself to males, I can't say I've ever felt disadvantaged, even though people tell me I am. When comparing myself to blacks (or any other race), I've never felt like I have the advantage, even though others tell me I do. Are the situations listed below really "privileges" and things white people and/or males take for granted?

White privilege

Quote:

White Privilege and Male Privilege by Peggy McIntosh
Through work to bring materials and perspectives from Women's Studies into the rest of the curriculum, I have often noticed men's unwillingness to grant that they are over privileged in the curriculum, even though they may grant that women are disadvantaged. Denials that amount to taboos surround the subject of advantages that men gain from women's disadvantages. These denials protect male privilege from being fully recognized, acknowledged, lessened, or ended.

Thinking through unacknowledged male privilege as a phenomenon with a life of its own, I realized that since hierarchies in our society are interlocking, there was most likely a phenomenon of white privilege that was similarly denied and protected, but alive and real in its effects. As a white person, I realized I had been taught about racism as something that puts others at a disadvantage, but had been taught not to see one of itscorollary aspects, white privilege, which puts me at an advantage.

I think whites are carefully taught not to recognize white privilege, as males are taught not to recognize male privilege. So I have begun in an untutored way to ask what it is like to have white privilege. This paper is a partial record of my personal observations and not a scholarly analysis. It is based on my daily experiences within my particular circumstances.

...

1. I can, if I wish, arrange to be in the company of people of my race most of the time.
2. If I should need to move, I can be pretty sure of renting or purchasing housing in an area that I can afford and in which I would want to live.
3. I can be pretty sure that my neighbors in such a location will be neutral or pleasant to me.
4. I can go shopping alone most of the time, pretty well assured that I will not be followed or harassed.
5. I can turn on the television or open to the front page of the paper and see people of my race widely represented.
6. When I am told about our national heritage or about "civilization", I am shown that people of my color made it what it is.
7. I can be sure that my children will be given curricular materials that testify to the existence of their race.
8. If I want to, I can be pretty sure of finding a publisher for this piece on white privilege.
9. I can go into a music shop and count on finding the music of my race represented, into a supermarket and find the staple foods that fit with my cultural traditions, into a hairdresser's shop and find someone who can deal with my hair.
10. Whether I use checks, credit cards, or cash, I can count on my skin color not to work against the appearance of financial reliability.
11. I can arrange to protect my children most of the time from people who might not like them.
12. I can swear, or dress in second-hand clothes or not answer letters without having people attribute these choices to the bad morals, the poverty, or the illiteracy of my race.
13. I can speak in public to a powerful male group without putting my race on trial.
14. I can do well in a challenging situation without being called a credit to my race.
15. I am never asked to speak for all the people of my racial group.
16. I can remain oblivious of the language and customs of persons of color, who constitute the worlds' majority, without feeling in my culture any penalty for such oblivion.
17. I can criticize our government and talk about how much I fear its policies and behavior without being seen as a cultural outsider.
18. I can be sure that if I ask to talk to "the person in charge" I will be facing a person of my race.
19. If a traffic cop pulls me over, or if the IRS audits my tax return, I can be sure I haven't been singled out because of my race.
20. I can easily buy posters, postcards, picture books, greeting cards, dolls, toys, and children's magazines featuring people of my race.
21. I can go home from most meetings or organizations I belong to feeling somewhat tied in rather than isolated, out of place, outnumbered, unheard, held at a distance, or feared.
22. I can take a job with an affirmative action employer without having coworkers on the job suspect that I got it because of race.
23. I can choose public accommodations without fearing that people of my race cannot get in or will be mistreated in the places I have chosen.
24. I can be sure that if I need legal or medical help my race will not work against me.
25. If my day, week, or year is going badly, I need not ask of each negative episode or situation whether it has racial overtones.
26. I can chose blemish cover or bandages in "flesh" color that more or less matches my skin.

chathamfarmer · #2 (**permalink**) 07-06-2007

This is something to think about. The music store thing is a bit of a wash, though. Seems I go in a music store and they have 90% rap and 10% everything else lumped together. The food thing reminded me of an editorial I read in a local paper a few years ago. A feller was griping because the local Ethiopian restaurant wasn't getting very much business. He said the black community should respect thier heritage and eat there. I remember thinking,
"Maybe they aren't getting any business because the food is lousy. I am proud my my German and Scottish roots but I hate saurkraut and the idea of eating haggis frightens me."

pramjockey · #3 (**permalink**) 07-06-2007

Haggis isn't too bad.

erikvv · #4 (**permalink**) 07-06-2007

I started my first decent job at a bank office a few weeks ago. The group of people I work with most closely are mainly female. And what I've noticed is that women expect you to be more of a leader than themselves. I do not have more relevent skills nor experience than them (maybe a bit more understanding of the world) yet they ask me to make decisions for them.

Maybe I have some natural leadership. I doubt that though because it didnt show up when I was studying electronics for a year at a university of technoloy or when I was participating in sports clubs and student organizations. In these three enviroments I worked mainly with males.

pramjockey · #5 (**permalink**) 07-06-2007

That's a completely different experience than I have had with women in the professional world. I wonder how much of that is culture.

Helene · #6 (**permalink**) 07-06-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by erikvv

I started my first decent job at a bank office a few weeks ago. The group of people I work with most closely are mainly female. And what I've noticed is that women expect you to be more of a leader than themselves. I do not have more relevent skills nor experience than them (maybe a bit more understanding of the world) yet they ask me to make decisions for them.

Maybe I have some natural leadership. I doubt that though because it didnt show up when I was studying electronics for a year at a university of technoloy or when I was participating in sports clubs and student organizations. In these three enviroments I worked mainly with males.

We grow up with a lot of deferential behavior towards men. Perhaps it's just the fact that they tend to have lower voices, as higher voices are associated with insecurity and stress. Perhaps it's some natural cause, perhaps it's cultural. Perhaps it's just easier to behave towards men in such ways, because it will make them more amenable?

Who knows?

I've noticed it by the repercussions of not showing deferential behavior when it was expected, eventhough I saw no (f)actual grounds for it.

Helene · #7 (**permalink**) 07-06-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by pramjockey

That's a completely different experience than I have had with women in the professional world. I wonder how much of that is culture.

Probably a lot. People tend to behave in ways that work for them in getting what they want. Our (the Dutch's) entire work ethic is very different from the one in the US.

erikvv · #8 (**permalink**) 07-06-2007

Quote:

That's a completely different experience than I have had with women in the professional world. I wonder how much of that is culture.

Theres no doubt that the feminist movement in the US is stronger than it is around here.

I am not sure if this attitude I see is harming the chances of induvidual women to get higherup in bussiness. Frankly I dont think so. I can however say with near certainty that relatively more women than men behave more submissive in the group where I work with. Its not a night-over-day difference but it is there.

Helene · #9 (**permalink**) 07-06-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by erikvv

Theres no doubt that the feminist movement in the US is stronger than it is around here.

I am not sure if this attitude I see is harming the chances of induvidual women to get higherup in bussiness. Frankly I dont think so. I can however say with near certainty that relatively more women than men behave more submissive in the group where I work with. Its not a night-over-day difference but it is there.

Perhaps they are flirting with you

?

I've heard that in the financial sector, by and large men don't like their women too strong. So women will adapt their behavior accordingly. I'm not saying they are targetting you specifically, but that deferential behavior will increase/or has increased their chances of finding a mate.

pramjockey · #10 (**permalink**) 07-06-2007

Fascinating. I'm not sure what I'd do if I were confronted with behavior like that.

Maybe it's because I've grown up with strong women, and thereby am accustomed to only viewing them as equals?

Helene · #11 (**permalink**) 07-06-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by pramjockey

Fascinating. I'm not sure what I'd do if I were confronted with behavior like that.

Maybe it's because I've grown up with strong women, and thereby am accustomed to only viewing them as equals?

Maybe you don't even notice it? I mean, you'd have to be aware of when people are being deferential, and if it's normal, you wouldn't pay attention as it would be ordinary behavior.

E.g. you could pay attention to who listens to who during meetings, and when two people try to speak at once, who gives in. Or you could see which people are given more credence as an authority on subjects. See if you notice anything?

kramer · #12 (**permalink**) 07-06-2007

Quote:

1. I can, if I wish, arrange to be in the company of people of my race most of the time.
2. If I should need to move, I can be pretty sure of renting or purchasing housing in an area that I can afford and in which I would want to live.
3. I can be pretty sure that my neighbors in such a location will be neutral or pleasant to me.
4. I can go shopping alone most of the time, pretty well assured that I will not be followed or harassed.
5. I can turn on the television or open to the front page of the paper and see people of my race widely represented.
6. When I am told about our national heritage or about "civilization", I am shown that people of my color made it what it is.
7. I can be sure that my children will be given curricular materials that testify to the existence of their race.
8. If I want to, I can be pretty sure of finding a publisher for this piece on white privilege.
9. I can go into a music shop and count on finding the music of my race represented, into a supermarket and find the staple foods that fit with my cultural traditions, into a hairdresser's shop and find someone who can deal with my hair.
10. Whether I use checks, credit cards, or cash, I can count on my skin color not to work against the appearance of financial reliability.
11. I can arrange to protect my children most of the time from people who might not like them.
12. I can swear, or dress in second-hand clothes or not answer letters without having people attribute these choices to the bad morals, the poverty, or the illiteracy of my race.
13. I can speak in public to a powerful male group without putting my race on trial.
14. I can do well in a challenging situation without being called a credit to my race.
15. I am never asked to speak for all the people of my racial group.
16. I can remain oblivious of the language and customs of persons of color, who constitute the worlds' majority, without feeling in my culture any penalty for such oblivion.
17. I can criticize our government and talk about how much I fear its policies and behavior without being seen as a cultural outsider.
18. I can be sure that if I ask to talk to "the person in charge" I will be facing a person of my race.
19. If a traffic cop pulls me over, or if the IRS audits my tax return, I can be sure I haven't been singled out because of my race.
20. I can easily buy posters, postcards, picture books, greeting cards, dolls, toys, and children's magazines featuring people of my race.
21. I can go home from most meetings or organizations I belong to feeling somewhat tied in rather than isolated, out of place, outnumbered, unheard, held at a distance, or feared.
22. I can take a job with an affirmative action employer without having coworkers on the job suspect that I got it because of race.
23. I can choose public accommodations without fearing that people of my race cannot get in or will be mistreated in the places I have chosen.
24. I can be sure that if I need legal or medical help my race will not work against me.
25. If my day, week, or year is going badly, I need not ask of each negative episode or situation whether it has racial overtones.
26. I can chose blemish cover or bandages in "flesh" color that more or less matches my skin.

I didn't read all of these but many of them are quite frankly, stupid because some of them are generic in that they apply to any race. I started to rebut each one of them but I couldn't take it after about the 9th or 10th one...

The author should read this NYTimes article (link) where she'll learn that black people who came here from the West Indiess area are in general, doing very well. The article smashes the theory that racism is the reason that blacks or any race aren't doing well.

Kramer

Helene · #13 (**permalink**) 07-06-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by kramer

I didn't read all of these but many of them are quite frankly, stupid because some of them are generic in that they apply to any race. I started to rebut each one of them but I couldn't take it after about the 9th or 10th one...

The author should read this NYTimes article (link) where she'll learn that black people who came here from the West Indiess area are in general, doing very well. The article smashes the theory that racism is the reason that blacks or any race aren't doing well.

Kramer

She's not speaking of black disadvantages, but white advantages. I was a bit wary when starting to read the article, but by and large, these are indeed advantages that white people have. That doesn't mean that that no other races have any of these advantages. At least, that's how I interpreted it.

But you are right that your background, and your attitude can make a world of difference in how well you do in the world.

timj219 · #14 (**permalink**) 07-06-2007

I think the essay missed an easy one regarding male privilege.

27. In a social situation I can dress the way I like, drink as much as I want, and flirt or even have sex with anyone I please (and as many as will have me) without being considered "easy" or called a slut. And I'll never have to worry that if someone assaults me I will be blamed for "asking for it".

Beer · #15 (**permalink**) 07-06-2007

I have difficult time calling these things priveleges because it is not as if something is earned - skin color and gender are largely immutable. they cannot be changed. society should value the qualities each provides. these qualities are not immediately apparent but they are realized to a large extent as differences become the backbone of a functioning society.
know what i mean?

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode