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Abortion, Civil Rights, Healthcare and other Social Issues Abortion, Civil Rights, Homosexuality, Education, Healthcare and other such issues

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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 09-12-2007
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Re: Should Human's strive for DNA perfection ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Trips View Post
Agreed.

Lets trust time to do what it's always done and have faith that it will lead us down a healthy "path".

Are we so narcissistic that we believe we have a sort of "wisdom of the gods" and should mess around playing tiddlywinks with our genetics ?

That is the question.
Finally, a person who actually thought about and understands the question being posed.

Quote:
should mess around playing tiddlywinks with our genetics
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 09-12-2007
Captain Trips Captain Trips is offline
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Re: Should Human's strive for DNA perfection ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Owl Mirror View Post
Finally, a person who actually thought about and understands the question being posed.
Maybe.

And to this:

Are we so narcissistic that we believe we have a sort of "wisdom of the gods" and should mess around playing tiddlywinks with our genetics ?

That is the question.


I would say; It's very possible.

I hope it doesn't happen, because I beleive it will only cause big trouble(s) in MANY different ways.

Those likely troubles might be something to harangue each other about :-)
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 09-14-2007
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Re: Should Human's strive for DNA perfection ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by partofme View Post
I don't think "perfect D.N.A." exists. Different genetics thrive in different environments. None would be perfect in any possible change in our environment or in another one entirely.
Of course, whch is a very ggod reason against anything that would reduce overall genetic diversity. Our diversity as a species is out insurance against a changing environment.
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 09-16-2007
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Re: Should Human's strive for DNA perfection ?

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Originally Posted by Owl Mirror View Post
Why do you arrogantly suggest that I do not know the criteria of that ideal ?
You mean aside from the fact that you've been unable to define that criteria?
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  #35 (permalink)  
Old 09-16-2007
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Re: Should Human's strive for DNA perfection ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve View Post
You mean aside from the fact that you've been unable to define that criteria?
I posed the question regarding the act of striving for 'perfection' and who among us should be in control of that criteria which would form any results of the act of striving for perfection.

All you have contributed to this thread is a strawman argument over the symantic use of the term 'perfection'

You have attempted to derail and take this thread off-topic rather than participate in a debate.
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old 09-16-2007
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Re: Should Human's strive for DNA perfection ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Owl Mirror View Post
I posed the question regarding the act of striving for 'perfection' and who among us should be in control of that criteria which would form any results of the act of striving for perfection.

All you have contributed to this thread is a strawman argument over the symantic use of the term 'perfection'

You have attempted to derail and take this thread off-topic rather than participate in a debate.
And no one in the scientific community is even "striving" for DNA "perfection" either, for several reasons, some of which have been posted.
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 09-16-2007
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Re: Should Human's strive for DNA perfection ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Owl Mirror View Post
I posed the question regarding the act of striving for 'perfection' and who among us should be in control of that criteria which would form any results of the act of striving for perfection.

All you have contributed to this thread is a strawman argument over the symantic use of the term 'perfection'

You have attempted to derail and take this thread off-topic rather than participate in a debate.
Of, for Christ's sake, quit your whining.

The question asks about "DNA perfection". As soon as I asked someone to define exactly what that would be, the hissy-fits start.

You can either define it or you can't. I submit that you cannot...
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 09-16-2007
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Re: Should Human's strive for DNA perfection ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Owl Mirror View Post
I posed the question regarding the act of striving for 'perfection' and who among us should be in control of that criteria which would form any results of the act of striving for perfection.

All you have contributed to this thread is a strawman argument over the symantic use of the term 'perfection'

You have attempted to derail and take this thread off-topic rather than participate in a debate.
Of, for Christ's sake, quit your whining.

The question asks about "DNA perfection". As soon as I asked someone to define exactly what that would be, the hissy-fits started.

You can either define it or you can't. I submit that you cannot...
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  #39 (permalink)  
Old 09-16-2007
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Re: Should Human's strive for DNA perfection ?

By Captain Trips

I hope it doesn't happen, because I believe it will only cause big trouble(s) in MANY different ways.

Oh My God ... I can’t believe I am agreeing with Captain Trips. It feels kind of Icky.

But Captain is so very right. I have weighed in on this one before ( lightweight that I am ).

My greatest concern is Evolutionary Inertia. When we start messing with DNA we are dealing with perhaps around 600,000 years of evolutionary selection matrix.

That is an UNIMAGINABLE inertial weight - the tinkering of which could be catastrophic.

Tell you what - Success would be the very worst outcome in our initial meddling. Our current technology and understand of DNA is analogous to removing a fly from ones nose with a sledgehammer. Weak theory followed by unpleasant results ( yet in a certain perspective successful - no fly ! ).
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  #40 (permalink)  
Old 09-17-2007
Captain Trips Captain Trips is offline
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Re: Should Human's strive for DNA perfection ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Owl Mirror View Post
Finally, a person who actually thought about and understands the question being posed.


Maybe.

And to this:

Are we so narcissistic that we believe we have a sort of "wisdom of the gods" and should mess around playing tiddlywinks with our genetics ?

That is the question.


I would say; It's very possible.

I hope it doesn't happen, because I beleive it will only cause big trouble(s) in MANY different ways.

Those likely troubles might be something to harangue each other about :-)


Since we're doing repeats :-)
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  #41 (permalink)  
Old 09-18-2007
EvilGenius EvilGenius is offline
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Re: Should Human's strive for DNA perfection ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Si modo View Post
For now, it is forbidden. You are correct that people do break laws and do things that are forbidden. If a scientist starts research in germ line alteration, then their funding will be cut immediately. As scientific research is costly, s/he'll need good luck continuing in her/his basement or garage.
Perhaps this would occur in the United States but that doesn't mean that someone, somewhere, will not perform genetic alteration. Being a person of a somewhat transhumanist mindset I am all for genetic modification. Since I consider myself to be an evil genius I would say that I am even more in favor of genetic modification of human and animal genetics. Where else would one be able to find minions.
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  #42 (permalink)  
Old 09-18-2007
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Re: Should Human's strive for DNA perfection ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilGenius View Post
Perhaps this would occur in the United States but that doesn't mean that someone, somewhere, will not perform genetic alteration. Being a person of a somewhat transhumanist mindset I am all for genetic modification. Since I consider myself to be an evil genius I would say that I am even more in favor of genetic modification of human and animal genetics. Where else would one be able to find minions.
Any ideas how to control mutations after you have acquired your genetic "perfection"?
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I am an American. That's the way most of us put it, just matter of factly. They are plain words, those four: you could write them on your thumbnail, or sweep them clear across this bright autumn sky. But remember too, that they are more than just words. They are a way of life. So whenever you speak them; speak them firmly, speak them proudly, speak them gratefully. I am an American. ...a tradition
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  #43 (permalink)  
Old 09-18-2007
EvilGenius EvilGenius is offline
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Re: Should Human's strive for DNA perfection ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Otter View Post
Of course, whch is a very ggod reason against anything that would reduce overall genetic diversity. Our diversity as a species is out insurance against a changing environment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amadeo View Post
My greatest concern is Evolutionary Inertia. When we start messing with DNA we are dealing with perhaps around 600,000 years of evolutionary selection matrix.

That is an UNIMAGINABLE inertial weight - the tinkering of which could be catastrophic.

Tell you what - Success would be the very worst outcome in our initial meddling. Our current technology and understand of DNA is analogous to removing a fly from ones nose with a sledgehammer. Weak theory followed by unpleasant results ( yet in a certain perspective successful - no fly ! ).
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Trips View Post
Agreed.
Lets trust time to do what it's always done and have faith that it will lead us down a healthy "path".

Are we so narcissistic that we believe we have a sort of "wisdom of the gods" and should mess around playing tiddlywinks with our genetics ?

That is the question.
Why should we modify the genetic code? I say because we can. When has the consideration of the morality (defined as a religious ideal) stopped people from changing human nature and civilization. In the same way that nanotech could be used drastically so can genetic modification. Will progress in either one be stopped because some people are afraid of the results? Not a chance.

Personally, I am looking forward to all of the above because that is where the greatest chance for godhood comes from.
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"People are stupid. [...] They will believe a lie because they want to believe it's true, or because they are afraid it might be true."

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  #44 (permalink)  
Old 09-18-2007
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Re: Should Human's strive for DNA perfection ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by EvilGenius View Post
Why should we modify the genetic code? I say because we can. When has the consideration of the morality (defined as a religious ideal) stopped people from changing human nature and civilization. In the same way that nanotech could be used drastically so can genetic modification. Will progress in either one be stopped because some people are afraid of the results? Not a chance.

Personally, I am looking forward to all of the above because that is where the greatest chance for godhood comes from.
On the topic of the morality you bring into the conversation, there is no morality (which you equate to religious ideals) in science, only ethics.
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I am an American. That's the way most of us put it, just matter of factly. They are plain words, those four: you could write them on your thumbnail, or sweep them clear across this bright autumn sky. But remember too, that they are more than just words. They are a way of life. So whenever you speak them; speak them firmly, speak them proudly, speak them gratefully. I am an American. ...a tradition
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  #45 (permalink)  
Old 09-18-2007
Captain Trips Captain Trips is offline
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Re: Should Human's strive for DNA perfection ?

For "evil" -wanna be god- "genius"
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