ADMINISTRATION NOTE: this thread is created to discuss smoking bans. The first 66 posts were cut from another thread to restore its topic and keep this other avid debate going.

The smoking ban issue sure wasn't put on the ballot in Louisiana! It was just enacted without the consensus of the voters.

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"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways - Chardonnay in one hand - chocolate in the other - body thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and screaming "WOO HOO, What a Ride!"

Here, the city passed them. The states passing bans sort of did their own thing. I don't agree with that either, but I think a majority of people did.

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I want to change the world but they won't give me the source code.

I could have lived with it a little easier if it had been a city thing but for the state to decide what we do in our city really pissed me off. Take a city like New Orleans, for example...the French Quarter has many bar/restaurant combinations and now, we're not allowed to smoke in them, even though they had smoking areas! Ideally, I think it should have been left up to the restaurant owner though because since the ban took place, many like myself quit eating out. I used to go to the Outback at least once a month and since the ban took place in Jan. 2007, I've gone there three times and didn't stay for an after dinner drink or coffee.
The day the state tries to pass a smoking ban in bars, though, I'm afraid they'll be in deep shit! They'll have just about every bar owner in the state on their asses!!!

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"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways - Chardonnay in one hand - chocolate in the other - body thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and screaming "WOO HOO, What a Ride!"

In MA, to legally allow smoking in your establishment a certain percent of your profit has to be from tobacco (don't recall the exact number, but it was pretty high, 80%?) so this pretty much excludes all bars

These kinds of referenda also show how majorities can tyrannise too. 75% percent of the public (including those non-smoking smokers who 'only smoke when they drink' or bum smokes, etc) doesn't smoke whilst 25% do. So, the math guarantees the result.

A good number of those who don't like smoking are nowhere to be found in the late night corner bars and private clubs where the smoking population often dominates the scene. For many people who don't like smoke, though, they just want the mere privilege to say they can go into such places on their own personal terms--the profitability or desired clientele and atmosphere of the owners be damned--just on selfish 'principle' of how one wants others to behave around them. It's not their money or property at stake or even their real desire to be in such places--they just want to throw their weight around.

There's a good reason why the average Joe/Jane voter doesn't have the power to decide whether I should be exposed to harmful toxins in the workplace.

Hey, I have an idea: Don't work there.

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There can be no bystanders in the battle for survival. Anyone who will not fight by your side is an enemy you must crush.

We are at war with forces too terrible to comprehend. We cannot afford mercy for any of its victims too weak to take the correct course. Mercy destroys us; it weakens us and saps our resolve. Put aside all such thoughts. They are not worthy of those in the service of country.

It should be up to the restaurant owners as to whether to allow smoking and up to you as to whether you're willing to work there or not. Last time I checked, no on forced people to work where they didn't want to.

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"Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways - Chardonnay in one hand - chocolate in the other - body thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and screaming "WOO HOO, What a Ride!"

You live in one of the warmest places in North America and you can't get off your ass to step outside to have a cigarette? And this prevents you from enjoying an evening out for a nice dinner? That's fairly pathetic.

Toronto has one of the highest rates of restaurants per capita in North America and our smoking ban did cause some problems at first, but even living in a cold place like this, people for the most part got over bitching and complaining about having to step outside for a smoke.

I guess sucking cancer out of a white tube is more important to some people than stepping out of their house to enjoy life. Seems odd.

Because it takes a ruling elite to carry out your desire to be everyone's mother?

Edit: As long as you're acting as their representative, can you pass a law requiring house arrest for people that are sick? I think it's a lot more practical to worry about people infecting me in public than about getting lung cancer from making a choice to work in a smoky environment.

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"Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have... The course of history shows that as a government grows, liberty decreases."

-Thomas Jefferson

You are missing the whole fucking point danno. This isn't about health. This is about government coming in and telling people what they can and can't do on their private property. I don't smoke. Never have and never will. However, I am fully against the smoking ban in my state.

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There can be no bystanders in the battle for survival. Anyone who will not fight by your side is an enemy you must crush.

We are at war with forces too terrible to comprehend. We cannot afford mercy for any of its victims too weak to take the correct course. Mercy destroys us; it weakens us and saps our resolve. Put aside all such thoughts. They are not worthy of those in the service of country.

hmm... maybe you're missing the point, which is a God-given right to impose your personal preferences on other people.

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"Government big enough to supply everything you need is big enough to take everything you have... The course of history shows that as a government grows, liberty decreases."

-Thomas Jefferson

Really? So we should allow any industry to pump cancer causing toxins into the workplace and simply state, "Hey, if you don't like it, don't work here."

Yes, the wisdom of your words is overwhelming. Did you just travel through time from the industrial revolution to the present? Hey, you don't like sucking all that coal and soot into your lungs? Too bad, don't work here.

Yes, let's revert back to those glory days of such high standards for clean working environments.

In the case of cigarettes, I agree. We are not talking about contraband here. It's a lawful product that society taxes to the hilt, something rarely the ban crowd complains about given the revenue and job creating industry. Private establishments should therefore be allowed to cater to allowing it, especially in the leisure market and especially the vice trade markets like bars, casinos, and strip joints that cater especially to entertaining vices. If you work with vices, they are occupational hazards. I don't see the same groups crowing about alcohol in the public. Lots of innocent people would be saved if alcohol was restricted to the home with no drinking in restaurants and bars, zero tolerance public drinking, zero blood alcohol drunk driving laws being passed, etc.

If it is a private business, then yes. The state has no right to come in and tell someone what they can and can't do on their private property. If you, as an employee, do not like what your employer chooses to allow you are free to leave. A good employer will adjust his/her standards in order to maintain a productive workforce. He/she, however, should not be forced.

__________________
There can be no bystanders in the battle for survival. Anyone who will not fight by your side is an enemy you must crush.

We are at war with forces too terrible to comprehend. We cannot afford mercy for any of its victims too weak to take the correct course. Mercy destroys us; it weakens us and saps our resolve. Put aside all such thoughts. They are not worthy of those in the service of country.