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Abortion, Civil Rights and other Social Issues Abortion, Civil Rights, Homosexuality, Education, and other issues except health care.

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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 2 Weeks Ago
Jefe's Avatar
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Re: Would taking the word "marriage" out of the debate help LGBTs?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jviehe View Post
Because marriage is a religious tradition, between a man and a woman. The govt recognized marriage to make it legally convinient to have certain assets transfer and such. A civil union is legally allowed between any two human anywhere in the country, and has no automatic rights assigned to it that are standard.

Yes its semantics. The issue is religious people want to keep the word marriage as their own, and so they cant have the govt recognizing forms of marriage which the religion doesnt agree with. So, remove govt from it, and problem solved. Religions can officially only endorse their form of marriage, gay people can call themselves married if they want, but neither religion or govt will recognize it, and govt will only recognize civil unions.
OK, this is what I thought you meant. "Marriage" would be kept for religious unions, with civil unions being recognized by govt.

My guess is that we would all just keep using the word "marriage" like we always have... which makes this whole thing incredibly stupid.
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old 2 Weeks Ago
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Re: Would taking the word "marriage" out of the debate help LGBTs?

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Originally Posted by Jefe View Post


I sometimes refer to my gf as my "lady friend", but she's not crazy about it.
I could see why. For some reason, "girlfriend" works for almost any age (well, maybe if you are in your sixties it wouldn't). "Lady friend" kind of connotes someone who breezes by your house on Saturday night for a little action.
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old 2 Weeks Ago
Joint Chiefs of Staff Member

 
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Re: Would taking the word "marriage" out of the debate help LGBTs?

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Originally Posted by lug-nut View Post
You speak of logic, but have none. Those described above can still procreate.

Nope. I just went to the 8th grade. You must have gone to one of those "progressive" schools.

Ooooh, showing off now. Must not have been long ago that you learned all this.



You really should read the chapter on natural selection.

Guess you also missed the smiley....further proof that liberals got no sense of humor.

but do they? Honestly when was the last time you heard about the mentally handicapped doing the dew?

Ah see theres your problem. Youre a 14 yr old dumbass wetnose kid. come back in say.. o.... how about 4 years huh champ?

about 7 years ago. its called memory, and learning. Want me to quote some bible passages about not judging people straight from the mouth of Jesus Christ? Cause i memorized those too chief. Got alot of philosophy and history knocking around in the ole noggin as well, as well as literature, both classical and contempory, as well as a decent basis in Law. Know what they tell me? Government intervention in personal affairs is not a great idea.
Its called an education. Perhaps you should get one? I hear theyre all the rage this season.

Also not a liberal. Or a conservative. I'm a moderate (oooooooooooo scary)
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old 2 Weeks Ago
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Re: Would taking the word "marriage" out of the debate help LGBTs?

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Originally Posted by leighredf View Post
I could see why. For some reason, "girlfriend" works for almost any age (well, maybe if you are in your sixties it wouldn't). "Lady friend" kind of connotes someone who breezes by your house on Saturday night for a little action.
i believe the word youre searching is denotes. pay more attention in english class
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  #35 (permalink)  
Old 2 Weeks Ago
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Re: Would taking the word "marriage" out of the debate help LGBTs?

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Originally Posted by reality View Post
i believe the word youre searching is denotes. pay more attention in english class
Given the (probably intentional) horrific punctuation, I'm sure you were quasi-trolling.

That said, you are incorrect.

Connotes: 2 a : to convey in addition to exact explicit meaning <all the misery that poverty connotes> b : to imply as a logical connotation

Denotes: 1 : to serve as an indication of : betoken <the swollen bellies that denote starvation>


"Lady friend" denotes that the poster has a friend who is a lady.

"Lady friend" connotes that the lady friend comes by late at night for an occasional rogering.
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old 2 Weeks Ago
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Re: Would taking the word "marriage" out of the debate help LGBTs?

Seems that we can all agree that semantics won't solve the fundimental issue.
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old 2 Weeks Ago
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Re: Would taking the word "marriage" out of the debate help LGBTs?

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Originally Posted by Jefe View Post
OK, this is what I thought you meant. "Marriage" would be kept for religious unions, with civil unions being recognized by govt.

My guess is that we would all just keep using the word "marriage" like we always have... which makes this whole thing incredibly stupid.
Maybe, but thats political correctness for you. The real issue is that homosexuals want to be accepted. Thats not going to happen.
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-Thomas Jefferson
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old 2 Weeks Ago
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Re: Would taking the word "marriage" out of the debate help LGBTs?

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Originally Posted by jviehe View Post
Maybe, but thats political correctness for you. The real issue is that homosexuals want to be accepted. Thats not going to happen.
I don't know whether homosexuals will ever be accepted, but if they ultimately are, it won't be because of some legislation. In fact, any group that pushes for acceptance risks backlash if they push too hard.
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  #39 (permalink)  
Old 2 Weeks Ago
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Re: Would taking the word "marriage" out of the debate help LGBTs?

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Originally Posted by Porras View Post
I'm of the opinion that it should be civil unions all around. People want marriage to only be what their religious leader tells them it is, it can stay out of government. You get a civil union which is legally identical to what marriage currently is for the legal aspect, and you get married by your priest, rabbi, swami, etc. for the religious aspect.
Couldn't have said it better myself.
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  #40 (permalink)  
Old 2 Weeks Ago
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Re: Would taking the word "marriage" out of the debate help LGBTs?

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Originally Posted by jviehe View Post
The real issue is that homosexuals want to be accepted. Thats not going to happen.
Actually, I've found that a lot of my most conservative friends are accepting homosexuality, even - especially? - the Evangelicals and the Rabid Romans.*

*Don't kill me. That's what they call themselves.
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  #41 (permalink)  
Old 2 Weeks Ago
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Re: Would taking the word "marriage" out of the debate help LGBTs?

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Originally Posted by Hafke View Post
I'm just wondering, because I've recently heard a lot of people express opposition to gay marriage, but not to civil unions. Also, I found some interesting blog posts on the topic:

Wednesday Open Thread: November 4th HillBuzz

Thursday Open Thread: November 5, 2009 HillBuzz

Frankly, I'm a little sick of straight people claiming that dropping the word marriage or compromising in any way would be terrible, mainly because they're not the ones who have to live with the consequences. That said, I have no idea if it would work.

What say you?
First, the problem is not "marriage," the problem is bigotry.

Second, "seperate but equal" has been tried. Perhaps, learn from history.

Third, bigots are not only wrong, but on the wrong side of history. While they may enjoy further victories along the way, when the "dust settles", they will have lost. Progress by it's nature can't be stopped.
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  #42 (permalink)  
Old 2 Weeks Ago
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Re: Would taking the word "marriage" out of the debate help LGBTs?

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Originally Posted by leighredf View Post
I don't know whether homosexuals will ever be accepted, but if they ultimately are, it won't be because of some legislation. In fact, any group that pushes for acceptance risks backlash if they push too hard.
Danmed right, just look at the blacks, 50 years ago we still had segregation in the South, anti-miscegaenation was the law in most states and the best a black coulld hope for was to become a college professor or a prosperous business owner dealing with "his own kind" Things had been that way was since the Civil War too. Then they started all that uppity protesting and demanding their "rights" and now look what's happened to them.

You guys are a fucking TRIP. I remember my GRANDFATHER saying that, and I'm not a young man.
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  #43 (permalink)  
Old 2 Weeks Ago
Secretary of State

 
Member Since: Jun 2006
Location: US, California - federalist
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Re: Would taking the word "marriage" out of the debate help LGBTs?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hafke View Post
I'm just wondering, because I've recently heard a lot of people express opposition to gay marriage, but not to civil unions. Also, I found some interesting blog posts on the topic:

Wednesday Open Thread: November 4th HillBuzz

Thursday Open Thread: November 5, 2009 HillBuzz

Frankly, I'm a little sick of straight people claiming that dropping the word marriage or compromising in any way would be terrible, mainly because they're not the ones who have to live with the consequences. That said, I have no idea if it would work.

What say you?
I am not sure why this is an issue since there is a difference between a religious marriage and a civil marriage. Purely religious marriages are usually private sector social transactions in the US.

The First and Ninth Amendments only ensure that natural and civil rights are protected by due process when necessary.
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  #44 (permalink)  
Old 2 Weeks Ago
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Re: Would taking the word "marriage" out of the debate help LGBTs?

Quote:
Originally Posted by leighredf View Post
I don't know whether homosexuals will ever be accepted, but if they ultimately are, it won't be because of some legislation. In fact, any group that pushes for acceptance risks backlash if they push too hard.
I still think any two consenting adults should be able to easily have a civil union. It doesnt have to be called marriage.
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"To take from one, because it is thought his own industry and that of his father has acquired too much, in order to spare to others who (or whose fathers) have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, "to guarantee to everyone a free exercise of his industry and the fruits acquired by it."

-Thomas Jefferson
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  #45 (permalink)  
Old 2 Weeks Ago
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Re: Would taking the word "marriage" out of the debate help LGBTs?

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Originally Posted by Hafke View Post
Actually, I've found that a lot of my most conservative friends are accepting homosexuality, even - especially? - the Evangelicals and the Rabid Romans.*

*Don't kill me. That's what they call themselves.
Thats anecdotal. Most dont.
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"To take from one, because it is thought his own industry and that of his father has acquired too much, in order to spare to others who (or whose fathers) have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, "to guarantee to everyone a free exercise of his industry and the fruits acquired by it."

-Thomas Jefferson
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