Solutions you don't like or do not understand do not mean "no solution". Please, try to look past the "cut and run" hyperbole and actually examine what other people are proposing. I'm not advocating that I agree with other solutions, just that making the blanket statement "cut and run" is just plain wrong.

So, everything out of Iraq, outside from the rosy reports from the military is incorrect, yes?

What media? Can you put some context to that stat? Don't just tell me "everybody knows it"...

Conditions in Iraq go waaaay beyond human fascination with death and mayham. Can you look at daily reports of executions and other violent deaths, for example in Baghdad and say this is a normal situation in a stable country? But I guess if you don't believe anything that the media says, then none of that can be true either, is that right?


Do you realize I am talking about Iraq, and not the war on terror when I say Iraq is not going well? Also, do you realize that the perception of the people in that part of the world has as much to do with the war on terror as killing as many terrorist/insurgents in Iraq? Do you think that killing terrorists is the only thing that will win the war on terror? If you do, then you are sadly mistaken and it is you that doesn't see the whole picture. Read the NIE snippet that this thread is about and tell me that Iraq is producing expected results.


And thus the disconnect between the west and the middle east continues...


Actually, I'm just more liberal than you. Which would still make me far from a liberal. I get a kick out of people that have to frame EVERY single issue within the liberal/conservative context. It is sooo helpul and leads to such a higher level of discussion on issues. [sarcasm off]


No, but it appears that you are buying into your sources of information more than you should. There must be some nice bridges in Iraq for sale. Since things are going so well there, you better get in while land is cheap there. Toursim is bound to pick up anytime and you'll make a bundle!


Huh? What are you talking about? Read any freakin' poll about what people think about Iraq and how it's being handled. What does that have to do with dems or reps??? Pay attention to what I post a little better, ok?


Well, there you go. Let's nuke'm all. If I don't agree with this mentality, I'm a liberal? And you presume to tell me what a liberal is?

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Fortunatus sum! Pila mea de gramine horrido modo in pratum lene recta volvit!

Do you even realize we've just about turned complete control over to the iraqi military? They have open elections. H*ll Dc is a rougher place to live than bagdad.

Do you honestly believe the us military is engaged in no good works in Iraq? This is what I mean by bias in the media. They know that a car bomb that kills 5 is a bigger sell for their push to label Iraq a failure than the reporting of a hospital opening.


[quote]What media? Can you put some context to that stat? Don't just tell me "everybody knows it"...[quote]

It's well documented that the media leans left; http://www.mediaresearch.org/biasbasics/biasbasics3.asp

You can try to hide behind sarcasm but your confusion is obvious. Most of the nation disagrees with what you're saying; as evidenced by the last presidential and congressional elections. Polls don't mean sh*t no matter how much radical liberals want them to.

Sill relying on polls from patently liberal sources

Are you implying we shouldn't do all that is within our capability to defeat a known threat to the american people? Statements like the one you just made are the reason people think you're a radical liberal.

Varus

Meaning what? What does this have to do with stability and security? It seems to me if this had anything to do with making Iraq secure and stable, we would be in the process of packing our bags and humvees?


What does this mean? Can you give me some kind of context for this kind of statement? Just by reading this, it makes me wonder if you pay attention at all. Where there 2000+ violent deaths in DC in every month? How many IED attacks where there in DC this year? Statistics on torture bodies showing up in empty lots or rivers? Headless bodies? Suicide bombers? How about percentage of hours with electricity to the entire city? Is there a green zone in DC too? Are there military convoys shooting warning shots at motorists tht get too close? Provide stats that backup your statement.


Do I believe there are no positive things going on in Iraq. I have posted my opinion on this topic many times. There HAS to be positive things going on in Iraq. We have the most professional/best military in the world. I personally know people that have served there and have nothing but admiration for them and our military. But, in the bigger context of where the country is headed under our occupation, it's not a pretty picture. Btw, positive stuff does get reported in the big, bad, 'liberal' media. You just have to actually bring yourself to read it once in a while.


When you quote a number like 94%, please mention it in context, ok? That was in 1964. Did you look at the end of the page where it shows key findings from the last study mentioned in 2004? The number goes down to 52%. But following that logic, does that then mean that 48% is doing conservatively biased reporting? Bias is bias, no? Your argument of media bias is weak and the numbers in context show it.



And when were those elections? What were the polls on Iraq back then? Again, you need to learn to put some context when you say things like that. Talk about selective reading!



Ok, then show me polls from conservative sources that show different.


You are trying to build a strawman. I think that Iraq is going badly so therefore I think " we shouldn't do all that is within our capability to defeat a known threat to the american people". ???
Yep, you sure got me pegged...

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Fortunatus sum! Pila mea de gramine horrido modo in pratum lene recta volvit!

Actually, I support jailtime for their crimes.

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A federal judge ruled today that graphic pictures of detainee abuse at Iraq's Abu Ghraib prison must be released over government claims that they could damage America's image.

Someone should tell them that bad press can be prevented by not abusing prisoners in the first place. Censorship is only needed to preserve the good reputation of those who have tortured and/or murdered already.

Hey varrus why don't you answer my post, too?

Iraq War Worsens Terror Threat

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A federal judge ruled today that graphic pictures of detainee abuse at Iraq's Abu Ghraib prison must be released over government claims that they could damage America's image.

Someone should tell them that bad press can be prevented by not abusing prisoners in the first place. Censorship is only needed to preserve the good reputation of those who have tortured and/or murdered already.