Chavez uses racist epithet referring to Bush - Page 2 - U.S. Politics Online: A Political Discussion Forum

3.14 · #16 (**permalink**) 03-10-2007

Quite typical ...

Quote:

Originally Posted by MattLarson

You are mistaken, sir. I just edited the quote "Gringo go home" to "Oh, ho, ho. Gringo go home" on the page.

Regardless, the fact remains that others thought the word wasn't racist. Or are you saying your word prevails, no matter what others think?

Quote:

Originally Posted by MattLarson

Seems to be mental gymnastics trying to avoid the connotations of Chavez's choice of words.

Seems to be jumping to untrue conclusions on your part in order to make a big deal out of nothing, simply because you dont like Chavez.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MattLarson

Gosh, sorry to be offended by a racist epithet without your approval.

Matt

Golly, that wasn't the point now Matt was it?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pi Jiu
Anyway, the point is you are making a mountain out of a molehill - I dont believe the term was used in a racist way. Condescending, but thats it - you are reading too much into it.

3.14 · #17 (**permalink**) 03-10-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mrs. M

One of Wikipedia's editors is under scrutiny for falsifying his credentials! Do you really trust that site over The American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language?????

I see you have conveniently ignored my point about words sometimes being used in a different sense other than the dictionary meaning. Do you have any comment at all there?

You have also dodged the point that your source didnt' say nigger was a racist term. You trust that to be true, too?

Last, The "American Heritage dictionary of the English language" is, well, an American version of English ... If you really want to go by dictionary meanings, go by the Oxford.

moon · #18 (**permalink**) 03-10-2007

Is 'gringo' worse than 'filho da puta' ? 'cos that's what they call him in Brazil.

Angry crowds hunt Bush as protests mark start of Latin American tour | Special reports | Guardian Unlimited

Lol.

I have some neologisms, if anyone is interested.

3.14 · #19 (**permalink**) 03-10-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by moon

Is 'gringo' worse than 'filho da puta' ? 'cos that's what they call him in Brazil.

Angry crowds hunt Bush as protests mark start of Latin American tour | Special reports | Guardian Unlimited

Lol.

Another good word would be "econ de puta".

MattLarson · #20 (**permalink**) 03-10-2007

Sorry, Pi Ju, but as a "statesman", Hugo is held to a higher standard. If Bush had called him a "spic", there would (rightly) be hell to pay.

Chavez expressly chose the word "gringo". You have acknowledged that some people consider this a racial term, correct?

That being the case, it was a vary unwise choice of words - unless the intent was to offend.

Matt

3.14 · #21 (**permalink**) 03-10-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by MattLarson

Sorry, Pi Ju, but as a "statesman", Hugo is held to a higher standard. If Bush had called him a "spic", there would (rightly) be hell to pay.

Sure, I never said he should be using those words - I am simply saying it wasn't used in a racist sense.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MattLarson

Chavez expressly chose the word "gringo". You have acknowledged that some people consider this a racial term, correct?

You do, so I'm guessing some others also probably do ...

Quote:

Originally Posted by MattLarson

That being the case, it was a vary unwise choice of words - unless the intent was to offend.

Matt

Sure the intention was to offend. Why do you think he said it?

MattLarson · #22 (**permalink**) 03-10-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pi Jiu

Sure the intention was to offend. Why do you think he said it?

OK, so now you are saying he used the term in it's offensive connotation, on purpose.

He succeeded - he used a racial epithet to offend. A shining moment in his career.

Matt

3.14 · #23 (**permalink**) 03-10-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by MattLarson

OK, so now you are saying he used the term in it's offensive connotation, on purpose.

Actually, I am also implying you twist my words and purposefully quote only those parts of my argument which you can succesfully put a spin upon.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MattLarson

He succeeded - he used a racial epithet to offend. A shining moment in his career.

Matt

Where did I say he used a racial epithet? A quote would come in handy here.

MattLarson · #24 (**permalink**) 03-10-2007

You acknowledged - or at least I thought you did - that some people consider "gringo" to be an offensive racial epithet.

It seems unlikely, given the relative ease with which we each found sources debating the racial nature of "gringo", that Chavez could be unaware of the connotations some people consider it a racist term.

And yet he specifically chose to use it.

Matt

bigTlilODD · #25 (**permalink**) 03-10-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pi Jiu

You could, but it would have to be approved. Contrary to what people think, you cannot just change Wiki willy nilly - it has to be approved after your edit if I am not mistaken.

Further, I believe wiki over the dictionary in this case, since often times, a word is used in a different sense than it's dictionary meaning in real life. For instance, the word "nigger" is not referred to as a racial slur in the dictionary when it clearly is.

Anyway, the point is you are making a mountain out of a molehill - I dont believe the term was used in a racist way. Condescending, but thats it - you are reading too much into it.

Yes it would have to be approved, but you know about the persoon that got fired from there for falsifying hiw credentials, right?

But here you go Pi, Here's the diefinition for gringo from dictionary.com...

Quote:

grin·go (grĭng'gō) Pronunciation Key
n. pl. grin·gos Offensive Slang
Used as a disparaging term for a foreigner in Latin America, especially an American or English person.

So there we go, it is offensive and it always has been used that way. I don't think I've ever heard anyone hispanic greet a white person, with "gringo", happily. Unles they were friends using it the way "rappers" call each other nigger.

BlackAsCoal · #26 (**permalink**) 03-10-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by MattLarson

Imagine the outcry if Bush had said something like "wetback go home" in response to Chavez's antics here in the US.

Of course, while old Hugo wants the "Gringo" to go home, he sure doesn't mind selling oil for "gringo" money....

Matt

WHAT????

RACIST????

You're REEEAAALLLYYY reaching here Matt.

So "Old Gringo" was a "racist" movie about white people .. made by white people.

John Wayne and a bunch of other "cowboys" called themselves "Gringo" in hundreds of movies. "Cowboy" sounds more like a derogatory name than gringo.

Dude .. you should be ashamed of yourself.

3.14 · #27 (**permalink**) 03-10-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigTlilODD

Yes it would have to be approved, but you know about the persoon that got fired from there for falsifying hiw credentials, right?

Yes, but just because one person got fired from there does not mean wiki in itself is not a credible source for anything or that the information contained within is wrong.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigTlilODD

So there we go, it is offensive and it always has been used that way. I don't think I've ever heard anyone hispanic greet a white person, with "gringo", happily. Unles they were friends using it the way "rappers" call each other nigger.

Where did I say it wasn't offensive? I said it wasn't racist. There is a difference between the two.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MattLarson

You acknowledged - or at least I thought you did - that some people consider "gringo" to be an offensive racial epithet.

Correct, I did ... I dont think it is necessarily racist though.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigTlilODD

It seems unlikely, given the relative ease with which we each found sources debating the racial nature of "gringo", that Chavez could be unaware of the connotations some people consider it a racist term.

And yet he specifically chose to use it.

Matt

Unlikely, but possible?

Anyway, I guess neither one of us will change his opinion on the matter. lol.

3.14 · #28 (**permalink**) 03-10-2007

By the way, for those that think gringo is racist, I'm still waiting upon a dictionary definition that says it is (since apparently those folks say wiki is not credible enough).

mpd8488 · #29 (**permalink**) 03-10-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pi Jiu

By the way, for those that think gringo is racist, I'm still waiting upon a dictionary definition that says it is (since apparently those folks say wiki is not credible enough).

No dictionary defines any language as specifically racist or offensive. The word gringo is a derogatory term for a specific group (read: racist) and I don't see why you would argue over that point. If you really must know for sure I'm sure that you could go to urbandictionary.com and look it up. I'm not going to bother because that is another website that has no place in intelligent discusion, but it will answer your question. Hugo Chavez used language that he knew full and well was racist and chose to use it anyways. Or if it was a freudian slip it still shows his true nature.

3.14 · #30 (**permalink**) 03-10-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by mpd8488

No dictionary defines any language as specifically racist or offensive. The word gringo is a derogatory term for a specific group (read: racist) and I don't see why you would argue over that point. If you really must know for sure I'm sure that you could go to urbandictionary.com and look it up. I'm not going to bother because that is another website that has no place in intelligent discusion, but it will answer your question. Hugo Chavez used language that he knew full and well was racist and chose to use it anyways. Or if it was a freudian slip it still shows his true nature.

All the web sites which would show the slang for what it is have no place in true discussion?

And sorry, but derogatory and racist are not the same thing, no matter how much you may think it is or want it to be.

Hugo Chavez used language that was offensive, I agree - whether or not it was meant in a racist sense is up to how you interpret it.

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