Pat Tillman's death ressurected- Testimony of Brother, Family and Jessica Lynch. - Page 4 - U.S. Politics Online: A Political Discussion Forum

jviehe · #46 (**permalink**) 04-25-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lil

Did you hear Mrs. Tillman say that a colonel told her she couldn't get over her son's death because she wasn't a Christian? Takes one breath away, doesn't it...in the United States of America. These kind of people are the right wingers, the flag waving patriots who lie to a soldiers family, and use his death as propaganda for their immoral ideological war. At least with Tillman, their lies were plausible, but to think that the American people couldn't see through the story of Jessica Lynch fighting her way single handedly rambo style out of an ambush was an example of the arrogant, demeaning attitude they have for all of us.

Why do you assume Tillman is telling the truth? That is called hearsay. I also dont recall any rambo style accounting of Lynchs ambush by the military. Perhaps we could do we a dose of fact here. One such fact is that Lynch has made a lot of money and fame off this controversy and her hero status.

TheLastBoyScout · #47 (**permalink**) 04-25-2007

They Lied because of the PR game. The military should not be in the PR business.

Unfortunately, politics is intertwined with today's military. Our military is micromanaged by a political agenda.

Even our active generals are now spinning...(once they retire they seem to tell the straight truth)

This needs to change. I don't blame the military... It's definitely the politicians applying pressure to spin from the top down. They need to back off and let the Generals lead. The Bush administration publicly defers to the Generals while at the same time ties their hands and tells them exactly what they can and cannot do. The Generals need to be put in a position to fight the war, not be coerced to sell the war.

Lil · #48 (**permalink**) 04-25-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by jviehe

Why do you assume Tillman is telling the truth? That is called hearsay. I also dont recall any rambo style accounting of Lynchs ambush by the military. Perhaps we could do we a dose of fact here. One such fact is that Lynch has made a lot of money and fame off this controversy and her hero status.

One such fact is that Pat Tillman is dead...fact. Fact...the military (and we don't know how high up the chain) lied to his family about his death. Fact...they had a national memorial, and awarded him a silver star, knowing the real circumstances of his death. These are FACTS. Are you seriously faulting Jessica Lynch who will deal with the disabilities from multiple surgeries for making money by telling the truth? As far as Mrs. Tillman is concerned, is there no one that you won't malign by insinuation to defend the lies told, and lives lost by this corrupt administration. Get your head out of Fox News, and educate yourself on some FACTS.

BlackAsCoal · #49 (**permalink**) 04-25-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by MattLarson

Then don't bother. I wouldn't want you to strain yourself.

Matt

Indicative of why it ain't easy.

ViolaLee · #50 (**permalink**) 04-25-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by jviehe

Why do you assume Tillman is telling the truth? That is called hearsay. I also dont recall any rambo style accounting of Lynchs ambush by the military. Perhaps we could do we a dose of fact here. One such fact is that Lynch has made a lot of money and fame off this controversy and her hero status.

Really, you don't remember? Everyone else does.

Rambo image was based on lie, says US war hero Jessica Lynch | Iraq | Guardian Unlimited

She wrote a book to set straight the lies the government told about her. If she made a lot of money off that, you can blame the US government for telling the lies in the first place.

Quote:

At the hearing, the chairman of the House panel, Henry Waxman, accused the government of inventing "sensational details and stories" about Tillman's death and Lynch rescue. After she arrived home, Lynch set the record straight in a book called "I Am a Soldier, Too."

"At first I didn't even realize … the stories that were being told," she said. "It was quite a while afterwards, and then I found out. It was a little disappointing. And I knew that I had to get the truth out there because, one, I wouldn't be able to live with myself ... knowing that these stories were portraying me to do something that I didn't."

Jessica Lynch Sets Record Straight, The Former POW Discusses Her Testimony In Pat Tillman Probe - CBS News

ViolaLee · #51 (**permalink**) 04-25-2007

Here you go jviehe, here's an account from 2003. Here you can see for your self the Rambo style rescue and gunfight lies made up by the US military.

Quote:

During the raid early Wednesday, members of rescue team fought their way into the hospital, found Lynch and fought their way out.

Green-cast night scope video provided by U.S. Central Command showed troops carrying Lynch from the hospital and onto an Black Hawk helicopter

A man taken into custody during the assault led U.S. troops to 11 corpses -- nine in a "grave area" and two in a morgue -- said U.S. Central Command briefing officer Brig. Gen. Vincent Brooks in Doha, Qatar.

Officials have not yet confirmed whether any of the bodies were those of soldiers from Lynch's unit, said Central Command spokesman Capt. Frank Thorpe.

Despite the barrage of hostile gunfire entering and leaving Saddam Hospital, there were no coalition casualties among the rescue team, Brooks said.

"It takes a brave bunch of people to risk their own lives to go in and free a hostage," said Gregory Lynch Sr. "We didn't even know she was captured, you know. Last we knew she was just missing in action."

CNN.com - Rescued soldier arrives in Germany - Apr. 3, 2003

Fidei Defensor · #52 (**permalink**) 04-25-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by jviehe

I also dont recall any rambo style accounting of Lynchs ambush by the military.

Neither do I re: Pvt. Lynch. I do remember hearing about a fellow soldier who fought off ambushers, killing a few, until he ran out of ammo and was captured. I never heard about any similar heroics by Pvt. Lynch. I do believe the Army left out the part of the story about getting help finding Lynch from friendly Iraqi medical personnel, but that doesn't seem like such a big deal.

As for the handling of the Tillman matter ... That is completely fucked up. His family deserved to know the truth.

conformfailure · #53 (**permalink**) 04-25-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by jviehe

Why do you assume Tillman is telling the truth? That is called hearsay. I also dont recall any rambo style accounting of Lynchs ambush by the military. Perhaps we could do we a dose of fact here. One such fact is that Lynch has made a lot of money and fame off this controversy and her hero status.

and it is one such fact irrelevant to what we're discussing. Although, it is a degree shy of calling her a media whore like you do to Cindy Sheehan. Is that your point? Is Lynch a money-grubbing media whore? If not, discontinue this line of argument.

Tillman is telling the truth and we don't have to assume anything. What you claim is hearsay is actually a documented comment.

Please, bring yourself up to par before you blindly defend the lying liars.

Jihad4Beer · #54 (**permalink**) 04-25-2007

Partisian bickering.....

jviehe · #55 (**permalink**) 04-25-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lil

One such fact is that Pat Tillman is dead...fact. Fact...the military (and we don't know how high up the chain) lied to his family about his death. Fact...they had a national memorial, and awarded him a silver star, knowing the real circumstances of his death. These are FACTS. Are you seriously faulting Jessica Lynch who will deal with the disabilities from multiple surgeries for making money by telling the truth? As far as Mrs. Tillman is concerned, is there no one that you won't malign by insinuation to defend the lies told, and lives lost by this corrupt administration. Get your head out of Fox News, and educate yourself on some FACTS.

What does FOX have to do with this? It is obvious The Tillman family and Lynch have their own political agendas. I dont see why we should beleive them any more or less than the military. I seem to recall it was the media that built these stories up more than anyone else. That the public eats it up is no the fault of the Pentagon.

Agentorange · #56 (**permalink**) 04-25-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by jviehe

What does FOX have to do with this? It is obvious The Tillman family and Lynch have their own political agendas. I dont see why we should beleive them any more or less than the military. I seem to recall it was the media that built these stories up more than anyone else. That the public eats it up is no the fault of the Pentagon.

Perhaps their political agenda is that they object to the lies that have been spread about what happened by the military and by extension the currrent US administration ?

Diuretic · #57 (**permalink**) 04-25-2007

The loyal party members applauded with tears in their eyes when Pat Tillman joined up. Ann Coulter almost orgasmed on tv in declaring Tillman a wonderful example of American manhood.

Strange how things turn out.

Tillman was indeed a fine example of American manhood, a man of rare courage and principle. Speaking only for myself of course I have to admit that if I had a contract with an NFL team (pref the Rams) there is no way on this Earth that I would have quit and joined the Army.

But now the loyal party members have their orders. It's Hate Week for all things Tillman. Lynch-Tillman...lynch Tillman...the orders have gone out through the shockjock network. Ditto...ditto...ditto...ditto....dot. Hate Tillman! Hate Lynch! The party demands it. And the band played on.

BlackAsCoal · #58 (**permalink**) 04-26-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by jviehe

What does FOX have to do with this? It is obvious The Tillman family and Lynch have their own political agendas. I dont see why we should beleive them any more or less than the military. I seem to recall it was the media that built these stories up more than anyone else. That the public eats it up is no the fault of the Pentagon.

And the fact that some of the American public eats all the crap they feed them in spite of the truth right in front of their blind faces is no fault of the Pentagon.

The only reason this has come out now, although the truth of this fraud has been known for years, is because the republican congress kept any and all oversight of the Bush Administration from happening.

The toppling of Saddams statue was also another of the plethora of frauds by this administration .. was that the medias fault too?

Was it the media's fault that the Pentagon consulted a Hollywood director to film this staged "rescue"? How often do you think soldiers film "rescues"? Have you seen any other "rescues"?

After "rescuing" Lynch, how difficult do you think it was to determine that she had not been shot and there were no stab wounds on her? You think that took like weeks to determine?

Was it the medias fault that the "Special Forces" were using blanks?

Where do you think the media got the story from?

How difficult would it have been for anyone at the Pentagon to pick up the phone and tell the press that none of this bullshit was true ..

US News
Lynch kept firing until she ran out of ammo
Thursday, April 03, 2003
Lynch kept firing until she ran out of ammo

Quote:

WASHINGTON -- Pfc. Jessica Lynch, rescued Tuesday from an Iraqi hospital, fought fiercely and shot several enemy soldiers after Iraqi forces ambushed the Army's 507th Ordnance Maintenance Company, firing her weapon until she ran out of ammunition, U.S. officials said yesterday.

Lynch, a 19-year-old supply clerk, continued firing at the Iraqis even after she sustained multiple gunshot wounds and watched several other soldiers in her unit die around her in fighting 11 days ago, one official said. The ambush took place after a 507th convoy, supporting the advancing 3rd Infantry Division, took a wrong turn in the southern city of Nasiriyah.

"She was fighting to the death," the official said. "She did not want to be taken alive."

Lynch was also stabbed when Iraqi forces closed in on her position, the official said, noting that initial intelligence reports indicated that she had been stabbed to death. No official gave any indication yesterday, however, that Lynch's wounds had been life-threatening.

Several officials cautioned that the precise sequence of events was still being determined, and further information would emerge as Lynch is debriefed. Reports thus far are based on battlefield intelligence, they say, which comes from monitored communications and from Iraqi sources in Nasiriyah whose reliability has yet to be assessed. Pentagon officials said they had heard "rumors" of Lynch's heroics but had had no confirmation.

There was no immediate indication whether Lynch's fellow soldiers killed in the ambush were among 11 bodies found by Special Operations forces who rescued Lynch at Saddam Hussein Hospital in Nasiriyah, although U.S. officials said that at least some of the bodies are believed to be those of U.S. servicemen. Two of the bodies were found in the hospital's morgue, and nine were found in shallow graves on the grounds outside.

A total of seven soldiers from the 507th are still listed as missing in action following the ambush. Five others, four men and a woman, were taken captive following the attack.

Video footage of the five has been shown on Iraqi television, along with grisly pictures of at least four soldiers killed in the battle.

Lynch, from Palestine, W.Va., arrived yesterday at a U.S. military hospital in Germany. She was in stable condition, suffering from broken arms and a broken leg, in addition to the gunshot and stab wounds, sources said.

One military officer briefed on her condition said that while Lynch was conscious and able to communicate with the U.S. commandos who rescued her, "she was pretty messed up."

Lynch's rescue at midnight local time Tuesday was a classic Special Operations raid, with U.S. commandos in Blackhawk helicopters engaging Iraqi forces on their way in and out of the medical compound, defense officials said.

Acting on information from CIA operatives, they said, a Special Operations force of Navy SEALS, Army Rangers and Air Force combat controllers touched down in blacked-out conditions. An AC-130 gunship, able to fire 1,800 rounds a minute from its 25mm cannon, circled overhead, as did a reconnaissance aircraft providing real-time overhead video imagery of the operation as it unfolded.

"There was shooting going in, there was some shooting going out," said one military officer briefed on the operation. "It was not intensive. There was no shooting in the building, but it was hairy, because no one knew what to expect. When they got inside, I don't think there was any resistance. It was fairly abandoned."

Meanwhile, U.S. Marines advanced in Nasiriyah as a diversionary tactic to preoccupy whatever Iraqi forces might still have been in the area.

The only question left is "how dumb does one have to be not to recognize this obvious-rright-in-your-face-fraud"?

The good news is that it doesn't matter how dumb or blind they are, this is another Bush fraud, in a LONG ASS line of frauds, that has been exposed to the American people and all the world.

As the democrats continue to investigate, exposure of more frauds are on the way.

BlackAsCoal · #59 (**permalink**) 04-26-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diuretic

The loyal party members applauded with tears in their eyes when Pat Tillman joined up. Ann Coulter almost orgasmed on tv in declaring Tillman a wonderful example of American manhood.

Strange how things turn out.

Tillman was indeed a fine example of American manhood, a man of rare courage and principle. Speaking only for myself of course I have to admit that if I had a contract with an NFL team (pref the Rams) there is no way on this Earth that I would have quit and joined the Army.

But now the loyal party members have their orders. It's Hate Week for all things Tillman. Lynch-Tillman...lynch Tillman...the orders have gone out through the shockjock network. Ditto...ditto...ditto...ditto....dot. Hate Tillman! Hate Lynch! The party demands it. And the band played on.

That is truly amazing.

Next you'll be hearing Coulter call Tillman a liberal bastard who jumped into the line of fire only to embarass the Bush Administration for the "jihadists" he was working for .. and the goosesteppers will quack quack right along with her.

And Limbaugh, in his drug-induced never served a day in the military life, will be calling Lynch a communist who was converted to Islam during her visit with the "terrorists" .. and the lemmings will shout "ditto', "ditto", RushGod.

Amazing

jviehe · #60 (**permalink**) 04-26-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Agentorange

Perhaps their political agenda is that they object to the lies that have been spread about what happened by the military and by extension the currrent US administration ?

No doubt that is how they view it.

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