Heh... (I actually read through that whole thing!)

Strange as it is its believed that drilling off FL would effect tourism but at least we can all laugh and say that's never gonna be the case in Alaska!

I don't neccessarily get how or why it would effect tourism but there's pretty much nobody who has argued with it; something about natural habbiats and stuff off-shore and the clean watersand god knows what else.

While I dont know enough about the shale oil deposits in the lower 48, one big selling point about ANWR is much of the infastructure is already in place. Extending pipelines would be minimal. The Trans-Alaska Pipeline and Valdez tanker terminal make the notion much more economical for everyone.

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Abstinence Education at its finest:

Yup. That's pretty much my understanding of the ANWR situation as was GWB's. This is just more reason to be really hacked of at Muslim extremists.

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I am an American. That's the way most of us put it, just matter of factly. They are plain words, those four: you could write them on your thumbnail, or sweep them clear across this bright autumn sky. But remember too, that they are more than just words. They are a way of life. So whenever you speak them; speak them firmly, speak them proudly, speak them gratefully. I am an American. ...a tradition

While I wont speak for the arguments against offshore development in Florida or elsewhere, but as I mentioned before there is considerable offshore reserves off several shores in AK. I would say that the proposed leases in the Bristol Bay region is a horrible idea. You have the largest fisheries certainly in America and potentially the world in the Bering Sea/Bristol Bay region.

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Abstinence Education at its finest:

That was part of his platform originally. I would agree that priorities changed after 9-11. Clinton vetoed at least one bill that would have opened the refuge. Now realistically, considering the breakdown in Congress that this bill has any legs, is a long shot.

But to blame ANWR being closed on terrorists entirely is also a stretch. There are plenty of people who have some hard-on for a region they will never go to, and if they did, would want to leave ASAP. Cold and dark all winter, tremendous mosquito populations in the 6 weeks of summer.

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Abstinence Education at its finest:

Oh, I'm not saying that at all. GWB's approach to reduce our need on Mideast oil is one of the main reasons I voted for him (I also liked his views on getting an American Union (North and South)...priorities got in the way of that, too). The priorities changed, and rightly so, IMO. No blame...just the facts.

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I am an American. That's the way most of us put it, just matter of factly. They are plain words, those four: you could write them on your thumbnail, or sweep them clear across this bright autumn sky. But remember too, that they are more than just words. They are a way of life. So whenever you speak them; speak them firmly, speak them proudly, speak them gratefully. I am an American. ...a tradition

Wouldn't it be simpler to require a certain amount of new executive branch vehicles be alternative fuel capable?

Hypothetically, we could eventually end our dependence on foreign oil if alternative fuel transportation technologies become cost effective for the average consumer.

I am still of the opinion, that a more perfect Union of States at the UN level would be more compatible with our form of federal statism.

Thanks for the clarification. Interesting to note, that I voted for him(GWB) in 2000. That was the last time I punched the ticket for the GOP and probably ever will. I just get a sick feeling in my stomach when his intention was to reduce middle east oil and the current policy moves have embroiled us into that region for a generation at least.

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Abstinence Education at its finest:

Hey you don't have to convince me that we need to drill in the refuge up there! I can't believe we got it passed in the budget so it couldn't be fillibustered out and then it was taken out (by choice of the GOP too)!

I am aware of the efforts in the late 90s to drill that was vetoed by Clinton, I would have to brush up on when and where the scenario you describe took place. Any further info? timeframe?

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Abstinence Education at its finest:

I figured you'd ask so i was trying to think back.

I think the Dems managed to fillibuster it entirely when they had the majority in the Senate so it was after we won all 3 branches in 04, so around maybe March to May 2005, whenever the budget is due i guess (what month is that?/was that in 2005?)

I think stevens got it out and then the rest of the party took it out, not sure why but i assume because they thought the entire budget would fail to pass.

Why is there any insistence on drilling within a nature preserve? Extracting underground oil reserves could be accomplished from outside the boundaries of the preserve and closer to existing pipeline infrastructure.

I think I have covered this already, but another time wont hurt I guess.

Two things, the underground resources are still subject to the surface designation is the way it has been described to me.

Also, the existing infastructure is to far away to have directional drilling be effective. It will be necessary to have some footprint on the surface in the refuge.

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Abstinence Education at its finest:

Meanwhile Sec. of Commerce Guitierrez said the other day in Fairbanks that he is in support of opening ANWR.
adn.com | Money : Commerce secretary backs ANWR drilling

Commerce secretary backs ANWR drilling

The Associated Press


Published: March 27th, 2008 12:22 AM
Last Modified: March 27th, 2008 12:22 AM

FAIRBANKS -- U.S. Secretary of Commerce Carlos Gutierrez told business leaders Wednesday that drilling in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge could help bring down the record-high price of oil.

"We know that reliance on foreign oil is one of our most serious national security concerns, and we need to address it," Gutierrez told the Greater Fairbanks Chamber of Commerce.

The 1.2 million-acre coastal strip east of the Prudhoe Bay oil field is under federal protection from efforts to open it to energy companies.

Legislation to open the refuge to drilling has never succeeded in Congress, despite strenuous efforts by U.S. Sen. Ted Stevens, R-Alaska. President Bush supports drilling; however, all three major presidential candidates -- Democrats Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama and Republican John McCain -- oppose it.

Stevens, who is traveling with Gutierrez during the secretary's two-day trip to the Interior, said he is confident ANWR legislation could be passed after November's presidential election.

Now what gets me, is his confidence that a bill opening the refuge could be passed after November. Maybe the cold temps up there fried his brain a bit. I would venture to guess that after the next President is elected that ANWR is off the table for another 4 years minimum.

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Abstinence Education at its finest:

Can you cite any sources?

The technology exists for extended reach drilling. Any improvements in that technology could allow for a drilling platform next to a pumping station and pipeline.