Thread: Now that the Senate has voted to commit fiscal homicide...

I say they pass a single bill that increases the debt limit as a function of time, raising it less-and-less each year so that eventually its not raised ever again. As part of the bill, they should add a provision that requires 80% majority to repeal the bill.

I.e.
Year 1. Raise it $1 Trillion
Year 2. Raise it $800 billion
Year 3. Raise it $650 billion
Year 4. Raise it $500 billion
Year 5. Raise it $400 billion
Year 6. Raise it $300 billion
Year 7. Raise it $200 billion
Year 8. Raise it $100 billion
Year 9+. No further ceiling increases. Requires 80% majority to raise it again.

Originally Posted by Disillusioned_1

I say they pass a single bill that increases the debt limit as a function of time, raising it less-and-less each year so that eventually its not raised ever again. As part of the bill, they should add a provision that requires 80% majority to repeal the bill.

I.e.
Year 1. Raise it $1 Trillion
Year 2. Raise it $800 billion
Year 3. Raise it $650 billion
Year 4. Raise it $500 billion
Year 5. Raise it $400 billion
Year 6. Raise it $300 billion
Year 7. Raise it $200 billion
Year 8. Raise it $100 billion
Year 9+. No further ceiling increases. Requires 80% majority to raise it again.

I like the idea of trying to figure out a fazed process. It is impossible to do it over a short period of time but we need to put forward a concrete plan that pays off our debt over time.

Originally Posted by Disillusioned_1

I say they pass a single bill that increases the debt limit as a function of time, raising it less-and-less each year so that eventually its not raised ever again. As part of the bill, they should add a provision that requires 80% majority to repeal the bill.

I.e.
Year 1. Raise it $1 Trillion
Year 2. Raise it $800 billion
Year 3. Raise it $650 billion
Year 4. Raise it $500 billion
Year 5. Raise it $400 billion
Year 6. Raise it $300 billion
Year 7. Raise it $200 billion
Year 8. Raise it $100 billion
Year 9+. No further ceiling increases. Requires 80% majority to raise it again.

I think this is a very good idea - just one element missing. What happens when the debt limit for the year has been reached? They will simply raise federal taxes to compensate. When those tax increases result in further slow growth and the debt ceiling is reached again . . . raise taxes again. If we do not force changes on the spending side, the easiest choice to make - which is the one typically made - is to raise taxes again.

Couple your idea with some way of limiting endless tax increases, and you will have Cut, Cap and Balance.

Originally Posted by SupPackFan

I think this is a very good idea - just one element missing. What happens when the debt limit for the year has been reached? They will simply raise federal taxes to compensate. When those tax increases result in further slow growth and the debt ceiling is reached again . . . raise taxes again. If we do not force changes on the spending side, the easiest choice to make - which is the one typically made - is to raise taxes again.

Couple your idea with some way of limiting endless tax increases, and you will have Cut, Cap and Balance.

I think they would quickly find raising taxes each time to be political suicide. Also, as many people have shown over the past months/years here on USPOL, tax revenue is usually around ~20% of GDP regardless of the tax rate. So I don't think a succession of big tax increases would be a successful strategy for the congress to proceed with (assuming they could even pass them).

There are really very few options left. The government has chosen its own interests over those of the people. They will increase the debt limit and they will raise tax rates. Those who pay taxes will revolt non-violently by burying income and going to ever greater lengths to avoid paying those taxes. Tax collections will stagnate or possibly decrease which will prompt government to take more aggressive actions against taxpayers. They will press the class warfare issue even more and, at some point, do something which makes really big headlines. After that it will be all hands on deck. One third of the population will side with the people, one third will side with the government and the other third will sit around with their thumbs up their ass until it's too late. In the unrest the Chinese will make their move, with the support of much of the rest of the world, in the interests of "stabilizing the situation". By the time it's over the only place you'll find the USA will be in history books.

Originally Posted by Commodore

... Against our Republic, what are we to do?

It is obvious to anyone who hasn't forfeited all ability to think independently to the MSM that Cut Cap & Balance was the only real solution to our fiscal ills, and it had the backing of two thirds of the population. If the Senate is not going to represent the will of the American people, what is our next step?

As you note, we, the people, will have the final say in the voting booths. Would that all will remember this behavior by then (and Harry Reid, et al, are counting on our short memories).

IMO, since those 51 senators were elected to represent the values of their constituents and they clearly have not, our course is clear: Recall.

No. The Senate decided against committing fiscal homicide against middle class and poor people while exempting the wealthy from having to share any responsibility. The American people bailed out the wealthiest financial institutions in the country. Saved their asses, and today they thrive and have more cash on hand than before the recession. Therefore it is only fair that they pitch in now to help out the very people that came to their rescue 3 years ago in what was a calculated fraud perpetrated against the American people.

John Boehner and other Republicans could be scoring huge points with moderate voters in swing states had they just agreed to the President's plan of trimming $4 trillion over 10 years, the largest yet most responsible proposal out there. But since he's stuck having to please idiots in order to not have to face their wrath, his plan would cut less than $1 trillion over 10 years.

Tell me how that doesn't make him a total fuck-up at his job.

Originally Posted by Commodore

... Against our Republic, what are we to do?

It is obvious to anyone who hasn't forfeited all ability to think independently to the MSM that Cut Cap & Balance was the only real solution to our fiscal ills, and it had the backing of two thirds of the population. If the Senate is not going to represent the will of the American people, what is our next step?

Recall

Originally Posted by Jason Marcel

No. The Senate decided against committing fiscal homicide against middle class and poor people while exempting the wealthy from having to share any responsibility. The American people bailed out the wealthiest financial institutions in the country. Saved their asses, and today they thrive and have more cash on hand than before the recession. Therefore it is only fair that they pitch in now to help out the very people that came to their rescue 3 years ago in what was a calculated fraud perpetrated against the American people.

John Boehner and other Republicans could be scoring huge points with moderate voters in swing states had they just agreed to the President's plan of trimming $4 trillion over 10 years, the largest yet most responsible proposal out there. But since he's stuck having to please idiots in order to not have to face their wrath, his plan would cut less than $1 trillion over 10 years.

Tell me how that doesn't make him a total fuck-up at his job.

Please do what no other liberal has been able to: Post a link to this Obama plan you were talking about.

Thanks!

I wonder what happens if Obama loses the election. Would he still be bound to monthly allowance? Or is he allowed to spent, as soon as a republican has become prez?

Originally Posted by mabus

I wonder what happens if Obama loses the election. Would he still be bound to monthly allowance? Or is he allowed to spent, as soon as a republican has become prez?

You'd have to ask Michele.

Originally Posted by Jason Marcel

No. The Senate decided against committing fiscal homicide against middle class and poor people while exempting the wealthy from having to share any responsibility. The American people bailed out the wealthiest financial institutions in the country. Saved their asses, and today they thrive and have more cash on hand than before the recession. Therefore it is only fair that they pitch in now to help out the very people that came to their rescue 3 years ago in what was a calculated fraud perpetrated against the American people.

Just because your President said it does not make it true.

In 2010, the top 50% of income earners, those making over $32,850, paid 97.1% of all the nations income taxes. How much more responsibility can they take? There is only another 2.9% left to give.

The top 25% of income earners, those making over $66,500, paid 86.6% of all income taxes. In other words, the bottom 75% of earners in this country only supply a lousy 13.4% of income tax revenue. They (we) are the ones who should be ashamed!

As far as the bailouts, I agree. However, those making less than $33,000 can hardly complain - as they did not supply any of the bailout money to begin with.

All we hear is what will allegedly happen to Medicare , never a mention of all the pork carried back to their districts by the elected, the fed agencies and jobs added, the useless research funded, the foreign aid. I realize that the social programs are the bulk, but damn, why does all the rest have to ride?