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  #46 (permalink)  
Old 04-09-2008
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goober goober is offline
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Re: The Airline Industry

Quote:
Originally Posted by pramjockey View Post
Of course, travel by train in the US is nothing like Europe. I think Europeans really struggle to understand how large the US is.
The heaviest air travel in the US is the Boston to Washington corridor.
We have high speed rail, the ACELA, but it can only hit top speed of 160 MPH (241 KPH) for a 12 minute stretch between Boston and NYC, the rest of the track won't allow it, so it averages 75 MPH.

Sure NYC to LA would take 20 hours at 160 MPH, but all those short haul routes especially in the Northeast could be run with high speed rail, saving millions of barrels of oil. And rail is city center to city center, you don't have the security issues, and you get off downtown, saving an hour cab ride from La Guardia to Manhattan.

Considering that a little over a 100 years ago we had 110 MPH rail service from NYC to Albany, this country should have high speed rail service along the coasts, servicing most of the population and saving a boatload of oil every day.

Of course we'd need new rail corridors, but that would generate lots of jobs building the new corridors, and the net result would be a massive savings in oil.
Bad for the airlines though.
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  #47 (permalink)  
Old 04-09-2008
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Bunz Bunz is offline
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Re: The Airline Industry

Quote:
Originally Posted by pramjockey View Post
Sorry, wasn't trying to pick on your town. Please don't take it as such.
Its not my town. I have only been there once. But it is my state. I do appreciate the chance to discuss the merits of the project anytime. I hope I might have shed some light into why the bridge to nowhere is a soundbyte with little truth to it. No offense taken.

Personally, I dont know how the good people of Ketchikan or any of the other major towns in SE do it. 7 days a week, in the summer, 3-5 cruise ships dock there daily. More or less vomiting 12,000 tourists into the downtown area. Which as you noted, is quite small. The people of Southeast have learned to make a buck off em. You can write "Alaska:The Last Frontier" in sharpie on a dirty tshirt and get 5bucks for it probably.
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  #48 (permalink)  
Old 04-09-2008
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Re: The Airline Industry

Quote:
Originally Posted by goober View Post
The heaviest air travel in the US is the Boston to Washington corridor.
We have high speed rail, the ACELA, but it can only hit top speed of 160 MPH (241 KPH) for a 12 minute stretch between Boston and NYC, the rest of the track won't allow it, so it averages 75 MPH.

Sure NYC to LA would take 20 hours at 160 MPH, but all those short haul routes especially in the Northeast could be run with high speed rail, saving millions of barrels of oil. And rail is city center to city center, you don't have the security issues, and you get off downtown, saving an hour cab ride from La Guardia to Manhattan.

Considering that a little over a 100 years ago we had 110 MPH rail service from NYC to Albany, this country should have high speed rail service along the coasts, servicing most of the population and saving a boatload of oil every day.

Of course we'd need new rail corridors, but that would generate lots of jobs building the new corridors, and the net result would be a massive savings in oil.
Bad for the airlines though.
In 1908 there was 115mph rail service?

Really?

Fascinating.

I'd love to see increased local rail service here. As far as the northeast goes, I haven't seen enough of it to be able to judge. I'm sure that I'd rather take a train than a plane if I could, but given that it's 3 days from Denver to the East Coast by train, at this point it ain't gonna happen.
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  #49 (permalink)  
Old 04-09-2008
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Re: The Airline Industry

Quote:
Originally Posted by goober View Post
Sure NYC to LA would take 20 hours at 160 MPH, but all those short haul routes especially in the Northeast could be run with high speed rail, saving millions of barrels of oil. And rail is city center to city center, you don't have the security issues, and you get off downtown, saving an hour cab ride from La Guardia to Manhattan.
I wont disagree with the merit of your post, and I think it might be wise though incredibly expensive, but the logical system would be to go down both coasts and then down the Mississippi.

Though I would venture a guess that the people of London might disagree about security concerns. Also, and I may be over concerned about this because I dont know the full issues. But the safety of a train running at 160, the maintenance on the tracks must be quite cumbersome.

Up here our trains are not so quick. Speed limit is 20 if the conductor is sober and 30 if hes drinking.
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  #50 (permalink)  
Old 04-10-2008
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Re: The Airline Industry

Quote:
Originally Posted by pramjockey View Post
By air, it is 3944 km. By rail? If it just followed the roadways, it's 4467 km. So, 15 hours on the TGV, assuming it could sustain that speed the whole way and make no stops. That's, of course, after we built tracks capable of running that kind of speed. Never mind those little Rocky Mountains that sit in the way.

Not likely.
The railway of the TGV doesn't follow the road, it has the particularity to go straight ahead whether there is mountains or rivers, just straight, that is why the cost of the TGV railways are very high because of all the tunnels and bridges it has to build (especially the Paris-Marseille), and all the lands the state has to buy.
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  #51 (permalink)  
Old 04-10-2008
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Re: The Airline Industry

Great News!

Time for another round of government bailouts.
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  #52 (permalink)  
Old 04-10-2008
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Re: The Airline Industry

Quote:
Originally Posted by pramjockey View Post
But, Matt, human life is clearly secondary to profits. Large businesses make decisions like this all the time.
I'd love to see the gov. try and run an airline........if you think stewardess's are surly now, please.....

gonna crash? "Sorry we are on break...we'll help you into crash position after our break ends, or , you can talk to my shop steward...after they are off break "..
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Last edited by Imperator; 04-10-2008 at 08:48 AM.
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  #53 (permalink)  
Old 04-10-2008
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Re: The Airline Industry

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Originally Posted by pramjockey View Post
Government project. .
wow, you're kidding right?
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No individual can plan his own existence in their view.

So the state planners must arrogate to themselves the right to manipulate any sector of the economic system if the good of “society” or the “general welfare” is paramount.

Ipso- if the rights of the individual get in the way, the rights of the individual must be sublimated.

The Road to Serfdom
FA Hayek (interpretation)


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  #54 (permalink)  
Old 04-10-2008
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Re: The Airline Industry

It wasn't great news for the people I'm working with that were supposed to go home yesterday, though American did put them up at the Wyndam. I'm hoping this doesn't ripple through until Friday, as I'd really like to get home and actually have a weekend, but I had the good fortune that American (my company preferred vendor and the one with which I have most of my FF miles) flights were exorbitant when I was booking - my flight tomorrow is United
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  #55 (permalink)  
Old 04-10-2008
Americano Americano is offline
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Re: The Airline Industry

Quote:
Originally Posted by pramjockey View Post
Of course, travel by train in the US is nothing like Europe. I think Europeans really struggle to understand how large the US is.
As one who has traveled on European trains and Amtrak, how despicable passenger travel on Amtrak is would be beyond comprehension to most Europeans. Amtrak makes the cheapest, jammed, peanuts only passenger flight seem like five-star. In our world leader wisdom, the US is actually reducing passenger train travel and freight transport.
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  #56 (permalink)  
Old 04-10-2008
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AkDiesel AkDiesel is offline
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Re: The Airline Industry

I would like to know why it is that the Feds are singling out the MD-80 or others might call it the DC-9 for all of this check and recheck of wires in the wheel well? When was the last time that the plane had a problem there?
The last big deal with the MD-80 or DC-9 was the Jack Screw on that Alaska Airlines plane off Calif a few years back. The plane that had the bolt go into a fuel tank was the Boing 737 in Asia a few months ago.
Could the Feds be trying to close down American Airlines that has a large number of the MD-80 or DC-9?
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  #57 (permalink)  
Old 04-10-2008
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pramjockey pramjockey is offline
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Re: The Airline Industry

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anselme View Post
The railway of the TGV doesn't follow the road, it has the particularity to go straight ahead whether there is mountains or rivers, just straight, that is why the cost of the TGV railways are very high because of all the tunnels and bridges it has to build (especially the Paris-Marseille), and all the lands the state has to buy.
Oh, I know. I was just trying to find a reasonable measurement of the actual distance that would have to be crossed.

I can't even imagine how many billions of dollars it would cost to run just a TGV line from NYC to LA, without any stops in between.
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  #58 (permalink)  
Old 04-10-2008
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Re: The Airline Industry

Quote:
Originally Posted by AkDiesel View Post
I would like to know why it is that the Feds are singling out the MD-80 or others might call it the DC-9 for all of this check and recheck of wires in the wheel well? When was the last time that the plane had a problem there?
The last big deal with the MD-80 or DC-9 was the Jack Screw on that Alaska Airlines plane off Calif a few years back. The plane that had the bolt go into a fuel tank was the Boing 737 in Asia a few months ago.
Could the Feds be trying to close down American Airlines that has a large number of the MD-80 or DC-9?
Huh?

There's a Konspiracy to shut down American Airlines?
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  #59 (permalink)  
Old 04-10-2008
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Re: The Airline Industry

Quote:
Originally Posted by pramjockey View Post
Oh, I know. I was just trying to find a reasonable measurement of the actual distance that would have to be crossed.

I can't even imagine how many billions of dollars it would cost to run just a TGV line from NYC to LA, without any stops in between.
At the rate we're going it might not be too long before the fuel savings would shoulder a big piece of servicing the capital expenditure.
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  #60 (permalink)  
Old 04-10-2008
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Re: The Airline Industry

Maybe. But, realistically, we'd need a TGV network connecting every major city in the US. Trillions of dollars, and a questionable market. How many are going to be willing to sit on a train for 6, 8, 15 hours vs flying for 1/5 the time?
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