And he took care of his family. He was a great man.

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Nate Peele
www.Thatsrightnate.com
"Finally a journalist is not scared to question the truth"--TJ Baker Holm

are you kidding me ?

poor is a relative concept therefore there always will be rich and poor regardless of how much wealth thier is in absolute terms.

I sleep in a bed and get to eat meat and vegetables, to peasants in the dark ages that would make me rich, but does that have any baring on how we should run our society today ?

I sure hope not

or maybe we should just legalize rape because the dolphins do it ?

poverty exists find a way to narrow that gap it makes for a better, happier society

how do we do that ? in most cases it is unfortunately through hand outs to the poor 'hard work' will be taken by those in control for their own gain.

Couldn't care less all I got out of that entire statement was that one rich man went and became an even richer man for various reasons that have nothing to do with the working poor.

Its an argument that more or less states 'don't be poor, be wealthy, then there will be no more poor'.

What I am is someone who recognizes that the "we" dimension to the dream is at least as important as the "me" dimension.

Sorry, but that's just bullshit. What I see as the "American dream" may be quite different than what someone else sees it as. The "we" dimension, if there even is one, is far less important than that "me" aspect.

The essence of your argument; indeed, every argument that revolves around this is this: "Steve, you've worked hard to make a comfortable life for you and your family. You've invested well to provide for retirement, and you've ensured, through your own efforts, that your family is taken care of. You worked hard and you deserve it. So, now you need to give some of what you have to those who haven't worked hard and don't deserve it".

Fat fuckin' chance...

Please go back and read what I suggested as the solution to the problem. Then tell me how that has any similarity whatsoever to what you just posted above.

Oh, I read it.

And it's bullshit.

The solution to the problem is for people to (GASP!) take some actual fucking responsibility for where they are in life, and do what they need to do to change a shitty situation.

You want the government to fix it...

You haven't answered my question. What I posted has absolutely no resemblance whatsoever to anything you objected to above. I am not suggesting that the government directly take money from one person (least of all you) and give it to others. I am suggesting that it stop facilitating the export of jobs overseas, and take other action to raise real wages across the board.

You know, most people in this country work. Most people have jobs. Changing the rules of the game (back to what they were when I was a boy) so that those jobs pay more than they currently do will do more to narrow wealth gaps than any amount of handouts. The fact that real wages have fallen is most of the reason why we have wealth gaps that have expanded, not because people can't get jobs at all or are living on the street.

What I want the government to fix is the problem that the government caused in the first place, and has been causing since the Reagan administration. I don't think that's unreasonable.

So, I say you want government to fix it, and you suggest that nothing I said is close to your position on the matter. Then you say you want the government to fix it.

Got it.

The reality is that there's nothing broken that can't be fixed by the American worker...

Don't be so goddamned obtuse. For the sake of others (because YOU know perfectly well you're being absurd), here's what you said:

So you see, what you were talking about, that doesn't even come within shooting range of what I was saying, wasn't just "having the government fix it," it was "taking something from me to give to those who don't deserve it."

Now, how about cutting out the crap and recognizing that you were wrong, and that I wasn't proposing anything remotely like that, OK?

Yeah? How's the American worker going to fix free-trade agreements that encourage employers to move jobs to third world thugocracies? That's the heart of the problem. And government has to fix the problem because government caused it in the first place.

Nor will I, as its a dead end with you.

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"To take from one, because it is thought his own industry and that of his father has acquired too much, in order to spare to others who (or whose fathers) have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, "to guarantee to everyone a free exercise of his industry and the fruits acquired by it."

-Thomas Jefferson

Sure, what you are suggesting is called socialism. This country is a democracy where all people are free and are afforded opportunities. These opportunities may vary greatly but millions have beat the odds and succeeded despite the hand they were dealt.
If this isn't the land of opportunity, why is it the world's number one immigration destination????

BTW, socialism doesn't work.

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Want government run healthcare? Join the military.

Why don't you quit whining and admit that, after saying you don't want government to fix it, you said you want government to fix it?

People's lives are what they make of it. If they're in a shitty situation, they need to buckle down and change them. Period. By blaming the government, you're absolving someone from their shitty situation.

I prefer to expect something out of them...

I know that I, for one, have suggested that people take responsibility for their lives and improve them if they need to be improved. Others here believe that government should improve them.

Because my suggestion actually puts responsibility on the individual, the libs reject it out of hand...

Actually, socialism and democracy are quite compatible. The people of a democracy can legally empower their government to redistribute wealth.
It is capitalism, not democracy, that conflicts with socialism.

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To educate a man in mind and not in morals is to educate a menace to society. -Theodore Roosevelt