There WAS someone supposed to be watching over them..FED, SEC, White House, Congress....however when these two combined made for some of the highest paying lobbyist for BOTH parties...you can do pretty much whatever the frig you want to....as I said our founding fathers just over turned in their graves.

Honestly both "companies" are also prime examples for "social democrats" ideas of helping ordinary folks run havok and become the giant /political/economic failure, which they always will.

In this case it all started with good intentions by politicans decades ago and not with an entrepreneur acting according to the free market.

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"bellum omnium contra omnes; atque in eo bello jus esse omnibus in omnia."
Thomas Hobbes

"Homo Homini Lupus"
Thomas Hobbes

Indeed, but did they continue to be owned by the government? When did they go out of control? It may have been started by the government but it hasn't been run by them.

Its no coincidence that since free market ideology took hold, especally monterism, we've had the 3 worst recessions/depressions since the Great Depression. (1978-1983, worsened due to Thatchers 'free market' policies, 1988-1994 and this one if it meets predictions). Keynes wasn't always right and his policies where too statist but he did manage to combat boom and bust, which is what we're back too.

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I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it. - Voltaire

There is no instance of a country having benefited from prolonged warfare. - Art of War, Sun-Tzu, Chapter 2, Paragraph 6

"An eye for an eye makes everyone blind"-Gandi

Agreed, the whole system of supervision needs looking at. Theres been a lot of very irresponsable moves by various companys in the last 15 years leading to this that just wern't picked up on... But stronger regulation is also needed.

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I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it. - Voltaire

There is no instance of a country having benefited from prolonged warfare. - Art of War, Sun-Tzu, Chapter 2, Paragraph 6

"An eye for an eye makes everyone blind"-Gandi

My favorite part: the two CEOs walk away with $15M apiece. Fucking brilliant.

I need to become a CEO. I'll just run the company into the ground and walk away with my golden parachute.

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When they come a wull staun ma groon
Staun ma groon al nae be afraid
Thoughts awe hame tak awa ma fear
Sweat an bluid hide ma veil awe tears

Can you hire me as a lobbyist for your corporation so I can embroil the company in some scandal and get us both rich?

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Cultural insecurities are the foundation of American conservatism.

Hehehe. I was right in my earlier post with the executives getting a nice retirement package. Stay tuned as the crony appointments come next.


Oh wait they're already here...

From wiki...
Herbert M. Allison.
He served as national finance chairman for U.S. Senator John McCain's 2000 presidential campaign.

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Is our children learning? -George W. Bush

"I think—tide turning—see, as I remember—I was raised in the desert, but tides kind of—it's easy to see a tide turn—did I say those words?"—Washington, D.C., June 14, 2006

"[T]he illiteracy level of our children are appalling."—Washington, D.C., Jan. 23, 2004

So lets blame the people who were swindled for being swindled? And this when the swindlers were not only the people entrusted by law with being the ones who tell people whether they were qualified or not but were also the same people who were flat out defrauding them as to the value of their homes and/or the value/nature of their assets.

Goddam. You will do or say ANYTHING to excuse your little tin god, won't you? and please stop trying to say you don't support him when everything you do is aimed at his benefit.

Bullshit, since when are banks able to just pick and choose more or less risky investments without engaging in massive fraud and lawbreaking? Which is exactly what they were doing and the real reason for this crisis. It's not an institutional failure but the consequence of a few of Bush's cronies doing actual big time criminal activities, which I doubt any of them will even get accused of.

Fannie and Freddie were doing fine. It took this passel of crooks less than a decade to ruin our economy utterly and now they're going to lay off the entire thing on the victims

The people who are getting foreclosed on didn't get scammed, the screwed themselves.

The people who got scammed are those who lost their asses in these stocks.

From 65 dollars LESS than a year ago to .73 cents?

Someone should be going to jail. Actually numerous people should go to jail, but all that would happen is that another well connected person would die from heart failure in prison just like Ken Lay and Jim McDougal did.

Where did all that money go?

IT HAD TO GO SOMEWHERE.

Well I hope the American sheeple continue to support republicans and democrats because this will just continue to happen.

The US economy is being purposely destroyed and the sheeple are too busy arguing over which party is worse to notice.

baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa.

Go ahead and keep supporting the two traitor parties.

When we hit rock bottom you can look in the mirror and know WHY WE HIT BOTTOM.

Pathetic fucking sheep.

Where did you get the idea they were Bush's cronies?

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http://www.fairtax.org

Elminate all taxes on income and replace with a national sales tax.

Looks like Lehman Brothers is next...so far today they have lost 43% of their value.
Their books are equally as ugly as F&F........is this the next multi-billion bailout??

I am beside myself this discussion has so few participants...does everyone not realize the magnitude of this?

Wow, it takes alot to be that completely wrong. Assuming you are talking about the U.K., you STILL don't really have anything near "free markets" compared to the U.S.

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"It's a good feeling to shoot a bad guy. Something you democrats would never understand. Americans are homesteaders, we want a safe home, keep the money we make, and shoot bad guys!"

----Denny Crane

Stay on topic guys....this is about the F&F bailouts...this will not be turned into another partisan jib jab thread.
Posts deleted

It seems you know very little about UK politics mate, compared to 1979 Thatcher and the Tories deregulated massivly, and attempted to create a free market in government as well. It may not be as 'free' as in the US (if this is even an entirly god thing) but comparitivly it was a huge step towards a free market.

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I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it. - Voltaire

There is no instance of a country having benefited from prolonged warfare. - Art of War, Sun-Tzu, Chapter 2, Paragraph 6

"An eye for an eye makes everyone blind"-Gandi

Well, they certainly deserve a good portion of the blame, don't they?

When I bought my house, I knew exactly what my mortgage payment would be every month. Armed with that information, my wife and I then had to decide whether or not to buy the house. If it was too high, or if there was a provision that allowed it to go higher than we were comfortable with, we wouldn't have bought the house.

The point is that I was assuming responsibility; the risk, of paying the mortgage, as did those who found themselves in trouble. Why should they, essentially, be let off the hook when they were the ones who decided to take out the mortgage? As bad as Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac have been, I doubt they forced anyone to take out a mortgage.

A friend of mine works in a print shop and plays in a band. He probably makes $35,000.00 a year at the print shop job, and maybe another $15,000.00 a year with the band. He took out a mortgage for $550,000.00. Almost from the word "go" he was having problem making ends meet. He was doing it, but it was tough. Unfortunately, though, the guy's an idiot, as he didn't get out while real estate prices were up. He could've sold the house at a profit. Instead, he opted to "tough it out" ("But my band's getting signed!") in the hopes that things would get better.

Everyone he talked to about it told him to sell the place. Everyone he talked to told him that he was in a prime position to come out on top and make a profit. Everyone told him that he couldn't keep going the way he was. Everyone recommended that he take the money and run.

He didn't. He was stupid.

The bank foreclosed on his home, and he lost it. He now lives in a two bedroom apartment with his wife and two kids, because it's all he can afford. When he tries to blame the lender for "sugar coating it", his friends laugh at him. One of our friends is a mortgage broker, and he was telling him that there was no way he could afford to keep going the way he was. He could see that things were bad, but ignored the red flags going up all around him.

Why should he be "bailed out"? He assumed the responsibility for the mortgage and, when things got bad, he ignored some pretty fuckin' sound advice. He had every chance to do the best thing for him and his family, and he opted not to. He made that choice, not his lender.

If he was "swindled", the only reason for that is he didn't do his homework. He hadn't a clue what he was getting himself into. The sad part is that he could've educated himself pretty easily about adjustable mortgages. He simply refused to do so.

So, he bought this big beautiful home in San Diego, and he gets to look at it every time he drives by it on his way to work. Sorry, but that's his fault, and no one elses...

"Tin God"?

"Support him"?

Sorry, but I have no idea what the fuck you're talking about...

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