Well, you all know this is dear to my heart. I personally think we wouldnt be in a financial mess if it were enacted. It is one of the best things we could do to promote growth and freedom. And Im happy to debate it. It currently had 34 cosponsors in congress and has had as many as 60 in previous congresses. It expected there will be more this session than ever before, and you may remember several republican presidents making it part of their platform, and even one democrat. For those unfamiliar, the Fair Tax:

-repeals the 16th amendment
-removes all federal income taxes, capital gains, payroll taxes, etc
-eliminates the IRS
-establishes a national sales tax rate of 23% inclusive on all new retail items and services
-sends a prebate equal to the tax on spending up to the level of poverty for all citizens
-other technical and administrative stuff

The basics - Americans For Fair Taxation: The Basics

So, any chance well see any tax reform in the next four years?

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"To take from one, because it is thought his own industry and that of his father has acquired too much, in order to spare to others who (or whose fathers) have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, "to guarantee to everyone a free exercise of his industry and the fruits acquired by it."

-Thomas Jefferson

I sincerely think that if it ever had a chance, the timing right now is near-perfect. I'll keep my fingers crossed, or write a letter, what ever.

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The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.-Winston Churchill

Great!

A 23% national sales tax is the surest way to destroy the US economy, reduce the people to squabbling savages, and render the nation incapable of defending itself.

Will they ship each merchant a copy of the Koran along with his new tax tables?

I would like to see data supporting any one of these claims. You must have read the over 67,000 pages of tax codes for 2008 already. I have started reading 2009 so I can finish it by 4/15/2010.

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The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.-Winston Churchill

Why is that?

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"To take from one, because it is thought his own industry and that of his father has acquired too much, in order to spare to others who (or whose fathers) have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, "to guarantee to everyone a free exercise of his industry and the fruits acquired by it."

-Thomas Jefferson

So that we can be prepared to "submit."

I am opposed to this for a very solid and reliable reason - I simply do not trust the government to be fiscally responsible. If they were able to pass this tax scheme, a short time later (after they've spent it all on the governmental equivalent of Booze, cigarettes, and lottery tickets) they will reinstitute the income tax anyway (they'll call it something else - of course).

If you need any further proof of the deceitful nature of these assclowns, witness the way they are marketing this scam to us: they call it a 23% tax. TOTAL BULLSHIT. It is a 30% tax. If you buy an item for $100.00 the "Tax" added will be $30.00 - and you'll pay $130.00 for the item. It is purposely deceptive.

Most likely they'll continually raise the 30% tax- in perpetuity. It will be a nice little incremental increase of only a 1/2% here and a 1/4% there, ostensibly to help the "POOR" or some other noble reason. Until one day you wake up and your 30% tax is now 50% - of course when it does hit 50% they'll call it 33% "all inclusive"

Ask yourself why, if this is such a great idea, are they starting off with a freakin' LIE?

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I can picture in my mind a world without war, a world without hate. And I can picture us attacking that world, because they'd never expect it.

TheHighForester,
Would you mind explaining why you feel the Fair Tax would do those things

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"Chaplain Charlie will tell you about how the free world will conquer Communism with the aid of God and a few marines! God has a hard-on for marines because we kill everything we see! He plays His games, we play ours! To show our appreciation for so much power, we keep heaven packed with fresh souls! God was here before the Marine Corps! So you can give your heart to Jesus, but your ass belongs to the Corps! Do you ladies understand?"

What exactly is keeping the politicians from doing the same to the income tax?

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"Chaplain Charlie will tell you about how the free world will conquer Communism with the aid of God and a few marines! God has a hard-on for marines because we kill everything we see! He plays His games, we play ours! To show our appreciation for so much power, we keep heaven packed with fresh souls! God was here before the Marine Corps! So you can give your heart to Jesus, but your ass belongs to the Corps! Do you ladies understand?"

That is EXACTLY what they have been doing for the past 80 years!!! After the 16th ammendment was ratifed the federal income tax was 1% tax on net personal incomes above $3,000, with a 6% surtax on incomes above $500,000 - today it is 35%. Connect the dots.

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I can picture in my mind a world without war, a world without hate. And I can picture us attacking that world, because they'd never expect it.

this may help

Americans For Fair Taxation: The FairTax Rate: a 23% tomato or a 30% tomato?

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"Chaplain Charlie will tell you about how the free world will conquer Communism with the aid of God and a few marines! God has a hard-on for marines because we kill everything we see! He plays His games, we play ours! To show our appreciation for so much power, we keep heaven packed with fresh souls! God was here before the Marine Corps! So you can give your heart to Jesus, but your ass belongs to the Corps! Do you ladies understand?"

Why is it that you beleive:

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"To take from one, because it is thought his own industry and that of his father has acquired too much, in order to spare to others who (or whose fathers) have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, "to guarantee to everyone a free exercise of his industry and the fruits acquired by it."

-Thomas Jefferson

I absolutely agree that they have been abusing the system and for just as long we have complianed about it, to no avail. Should we let them keep doing it or should we allow them to try and change? My hope is that every citizen watches this carefully because we all no they will abuse it if given the oppurtunity.

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The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.-Winston Churchill

This is why repealing the 16th amendment is essential. But you are right. No matter what tax system we have, we still have to watch them. I dont see how improving the system can make it any worse however. Would you rather keep the current system AND allow them to keep screwing us? They are already doing exactly what you fear they would do. The FT however removes their power. A sales tax is voluntary. If you do not like the tax rate, do not buy anything new.

As or the second part, USMC covered it. 23/30 it doesnt matter. 23 is used to make it similar to the income tax. If you spend a dollar that includes 23c in tax. If you make a dollar currently, that includes 23c in tax (or whatever rate). Its not that hard. The law will be written such that the tax is not added on to the price you see on the shelf, but included in the price, and fully visible on the recipet.

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"To take from one, because it is thought his own industry and that of his father has acquired too much, in order to spare to others who (or whose fathers) have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, "to guarantee to everyone a free exercise of his industry and the fruits acquired by it."

-Thomas Jefferson

My point was that tax rates fluctuate up and down and not a steady climb as you described. Tax rates will change regardless of what system is in place so your argument is dumb.

__________________
"Chaplain Charlie will tell you about how the free world will conquer Communism with the aid of God and a few marines! God has a hard-on for marines because we kill everything we see! He plays His games, we play ours! To show our appreciation for so much power, we keep heaven packed with fresh souls! God was here before the Marine Corps! So you can give your heart to Jesus, but your ass belongs to the Corps! Do you ladies understand?"