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Re: Politicians WRONG On Energy--The Ethanol BS
Ethanol as a replacement to gasoline use is a joke.
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I am an American. That's the way most of us put it, just matter of factly. They are plain words, those four: you could write them on your thumbnail, or sweep them clear across this bright autumn sky. But remember too, that they are more than just words. They are a way of life. So whenever you speak them, speak them firmly, speak them proudly, speak them gratefully. I am an American. ...a tradition Last edited by Si modo; 03-10-2008 at 05:54 AM. Reason: grammar correction |
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Re: Politicians WRONG On Energy--The Ethanol BS
Ethanol was a good method 20 years ago... but time has moved forward and you could use "Biomass-to-Liquid" technology to produce twice the amount of gasoline out of plants like corn & crops...
As of today, Wind energy is the most efficent alternative energy source... Solar power is on a good way. BUT! Driving your car is a part of the live where there is little choice today... Building an energy efficent house that does not need heating or exesive cooling is absolutly possible today. And last time I checked, the amount of Primary Energy a house uses is often higher than what people use to drive around. Check out "Passive house" standards... the first were build 1980s and now the first that are even cheaper than conventional houses are available |
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Re: Politicians WRONG On Energy--The Ethanol BS
Try getting the nomination in Iowa by being against ethanol.
Ethanol from corn is a political by-product, that makes little or no sense except in a country where Iowa is so vital to the political process.
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“The thought of his being president sends a cold chill down my spine.” Senator Thad Cochran, Mississippi (R) on McCain “I decided I didn’t want this guy anywhere near a trigger.” Senator Pete Domenici, New Mexico (R) on McCain “My anger did not help my campaign ... People don’t like angry candidates very much.” McCain on McCain |
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Re: Politicians WRONG On Energy--The Ethanol BS
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They say it is 'too early' to pick winners and losers among proposed projects. It is not 'too early'. Any biofuels project that does not use solar as a primary source of energy for production will create more pollution than order. This is inevitable. The biofuels projects being funded are not using solar as a primary source. Since only solar's outside energy input to a system can mitigate pollution, we can be sure non-solar produced biofuels can not be winners. Consider Colorado's first cellulosic ethanol plant proposal. The feedstock and ethanol output are touted (100 ton/day of wood and 2 million gal/yr of ethanol). Significantly missing is quantification of the plant's CO2 production implicated in global warming. It would seem that one of our highest concerns (climate change) is not worth quantifying. Apparently, the non-solar projects are so technically sweet and entail such a political investment they will continue, even though clearly an a priori boondoggle. I don't think solar hydrogen is the only solar answer, however. Even solar panels hold promise. |
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Re: Politicians WRONG On Energy--The Ethanol BS
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Plants are the most efficent & cleanes (no toxics during production) solar power convertes out there... If you want efficent solar energy you can not ignore the use of plants to convert it... The really bad things about Ethanol is, that it is only mixed to normal fuel and when imported from the other side of the earth it's not clean at all... Bottom line, Ethanol is inefficent and outdated.... If you use home grown plants and convert them with modern technics to bio-diesel it is much more efficent... But what to expect from a government that has no clear line on eccolocial subjects and tries to form a national project... |
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Re: Politicians WRONG On Energy--The Ethanol BS
Fermentation/distillation typically uses CO2 fuels.
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Re: Politicians WRONG On Energy--The Ethanol BS
I just meant, that if you use growing sources to produce something, it is solar energy in the end...
My main dislike is simply that it is mixed with petrol fuel... and the mentioned incredible inefficency ![]() But I think modern technics that convert biomass into fuel or chemicals are very promissing... growing and farming fuel locally (not in brazil for the US) seems quite natural... |
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Re: Politicians WRONG On Energy--The Ethanol BS
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They say this stuff is much more efficient to produce it from because it requires virtually no irrigation or fertilization to grow. Biofuels from Switchgrass: Greener Energy Pastures Switch Grass: Fuel for the Future? : TreeHugger Then there is the Jatropha tree that grows in Mexico, India & elsewhwere that they are also very interested in using in the US as well. Environmental Capital - WSJ.com : BP Bets on the Jatropha Tree Domestic Fuel » Archives » Jatropha Tree Could Be Key to Florida Biodiesel |
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Re: Politicians WRONG On Energy--The Ethanol BS
ell we agree for once....its BS and has been since day one.....sorry to say the global warming lobby had of course latched on to this...and well, there ya go....its not one of the answers and these dolts could have just read Henry Fords memoirs...he gave it shot back in the Model T. it was not an efficient burner and to hard to manufacture…etc.....and is still valid to day despite tech. advances..as it takes too much refining time and BTUs to make it….to say nothing of raising the costs of everything that corn etc in all its forms has an influence on…….
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Obama-e fungis nati homines.... |
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Re: Politicians WRONG On Energy--The Ethanol BS
If the 'cooking' is not solar, its a loser per the laws of physics. One doesn't need to know the details.
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Re: Politicians WRONG On Energy--The Ethanol BS
IMHO, biofuels are more of a side step, than a step forward, biofuels still pollute, and I seriously doubt that biofuels could be produced in sufficient quantities to replace fossil fuels without damaging the ecosystem.
Just think, a hydrogen powered electric plant that gets its hydrogen from solar active titanium dioxide water splitters fed by a nearby river, releasing oxygen as a by-product at the same time. Then while burning the hydrogen to power the plant, pure water is created and fed back into the river. Can you image the implications? Waste water from a hydrogen electric plant would be pure water. Cars could have dual cells, one for the hydrogen, and one to collect the water from the hydrogen combustion, and in turn return the water to hydrogen filling stations, which would then return it to the hydrogen refineries in the same trucks used to deliver the hydrogen. Sounds too good to be true? Well its too good for America apparently. It probably won't happen until there are enough ways to rip us off. ![]()
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"Shake off all the fears of servile prejudices, under which weak minds are servilely crouched. Fix reason firmly in her seat, and call on her tribunal for every fact, every opinion. Question with boldness even the existence of a God; because, if there be one, he must more approve of the homage of reason than that of blindfolded fear." "An honest man can feel no pleasure in the exercise of power over his fellow citizens." -Thomas Jefferson |
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Re: Politicians WRONG On Energy--The Ethanol BS
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I think they're researching ways of chemically extracting the plant sugars to make the fuel that wouldn't require burning fossil fuels. |
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Re: Politicians WRONG On Energy--The Ethanol BS
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