It was just a statement of fact, not so much a complaint. I possess no other means of feeding myself and those who depend on me. I require a job to survive, and all jobs are in service of the state. They have made any other means of subsistence illegal and/or impossible. I can either be a homeless person begging for food, or i can work. Not much of a choice at all.

Andrew

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Ethanol is a fabulous solution to our energy dilemma because it will provide more fuel for us to drive around and look for food.

-- Unknown

All jobs are in the service of the state?


Hogwash.

__________________
When they come a wull staun ma groon
Staun ma groon al nae be afraid
Thoughts awe hame tak awa ma fear
Sweat an bluid hide ma veil awe tears

I'm gonna print that out, dry it, grind it up and sprinkle it on my garden. It's the biggest load of pure, unadulterated bullshit I've ever seen.

Matt

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De duobus malis, minus est semper eligendum

How so?

Andrew

__________________
Ethanol is a fabulous solution to our energy dilemma because it will provide more fuel for us to drive around and look for food.

-- Unknown

There is no job that i know of that does not serve the state. Either through helping to prop up the economy, or directly by taking taxes off of each and every pay check.

Tell me, if everybody suddenly stopped working could the state still function indefinitely?

Andrew

__________________
Ethanol is a fabulous solution to our energy dilemma because it will provide more fuel for us to drive around and look for food.

-- Unknown

Nonsense. Consider, for a moment, a minimum wage earner. Yes, they pay taxes temporarily, but they get all the money back when they file a return.

Your "proof" that if everyone stopped working the state would eventually falter is not a proof that all jobs serve the state. Particularly not "full time" as you claimed.

Matt

__________________
De duobus malis, minus est semper eligendum

Because it's a silly proposition. Unless you take your definitions to the absolute farthest level of absurdity, of course.

__________________
When they come a wull staun ma groon
Staun ma groon al nae be afraid
Thoughts awe hame tak awa ma fear
Sweat an bluid hide ma veil awe tears

Personally, I like TP; so that's one thing that would be a detriment to my living as the aboriginals of NA.

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I am an American. That's the way most of us put it, just matter of factly. They are plain words, those four: you could write them on your thumbnail, or sweep them clear across this bright autumn sky. But remember too, that they are more than just words. They are a way of life. So whenever you speak them; speak them firmly, speak them proudly, speak them gratefully. I am an American. ...a tradition

But the government gets the interest on the collection of those taxes for the direct purpose of strengthening the state. And a minimum wage earner is still a consumer, serving the state that way as well. All the money that they spend consuming is eventually taxed.

8 hours a day 5 days a week, often more, is certainly full time.

So what IYO is the purpose of being a citizen if not to make the state stronger? And how does one make the state stronger if not by contributing to the coffers and the economy?

Andrew

__________________
Ethanol is a fabulous solution to our energy dilemma because it will provide more fuel for us to drive around and look for food.

-- Unknown

Holy thread drift, batman!

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"Jesus said: I have cast fire upon the world, and behold I guard it until it is ablaze."
Gospel of Thomas

No kidding. I made a long post directly relevant to the topic, made an offhand comment at the end of it, and that seems to be the only focus at this point. Nobody has yet responded to the main body of my post here: Post #16.

Andrew

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Ethanol is a fabulous solution to our energy dilemma because it will provide more fuel for us to drive around and look for food.

-- Unknown

That's because the rest of us are well grounded in reality. Reduction of allowed technology to pre-agrarian is not going to happen, at least not voluntarily.

__________________
When they come a wull staun ma groon
Staun ma groon al nae be afraid
Thoughts awe hame tak awa ma fear
Sweat an bluid hide ma veil awe tears

That is not relevant to the body of my post, which only proves you are commenting on something you have not read.

And besides, i never tried to argue that this culture would voluntarily switch back to a pre-agrarian lifestyle. I argued the opposite in fact. There is no way this culture would ever voluntarily reverse economic and technological growth.

The most likely scenario is that nature's limits dictate that we go back to at best a medieval type of economy. Physical reality more than anything will determine our future.

Andrew

__________________
Ethanol is a fabulous solution to our energy dilemma because it will provide more fuel for us to drive around and look for food.

-- Unknown

LMAO

That is hardly the "most likely scenario." You're romanticizing.

__________________
When they come a wull staun ma groon
Staun ma groon al nae be afraid
Thoughts awe hame tak awa ma fear
Sweat an bluid hide ma veil awe tears

So what do you think will happen when we no longer have enough land and resources to maintain this global civilization that we currently experience? Do you think permanent economic growth is sustainable?

Do you think technology will somehow make limits disappear? Is that not 'romanticizing' technology?

Is human ingenuity going to 'save us'?

Andrew

__________________
Ethanol is a fabulous solution to our energy dilemma because it will provide more fuel for us to drive around and look for food.

-- Unknown