In fact, if there was no life at all on this planet, there would be no greenhouse effect. Its a very delicate system where all parts contribute and consume, industrial man is throwing this system into chaos.

Andrew

__________________
“...corporations and those who run them cannot stop exploiting resources and amassing wealth until they have... .I cannot finish this sentence, because the truth is that can never stop; like cancer, they can only continue to expand until they kill the host.”

-- Derrick Jensen

Look up the Show "Snowball Earth"

Even if there is no life, there would still be greenhouse gases... those things called Valcones.

__________________
Government Should Fear the People That Voted Them In!!

New Government=one that the President likes a GOP idea but then the Staff puts that Idea in a very DEEP HOLE.

Read HR143 get enlightment.

The Revolution Will not be Televised

The CO2 spewed from volcanoes began as life.

But you are correct, water is also a GHG. The more important point i was attempting to make is that life itself regulates the system that in turn supports us.

Andrew

__________________
“...corporations and those who run them cannot stop exploiting resources and amassing wealth until they have... .I cannot finish this sentence, because the truth is that can never stop; like cancer, they can only continue to expand until they kill the host.”

-- Derrick Jensen

Has anyone heard of global windage ? That's when the wind blows a hell of a lot for some reason. This summer in Eastern Washington state has been windy. Windier than I've ever seen it.

My theory is that it's cause is Al Gore and his loud mouth. Now he's comparing people who don't buy his theory to the fight with the Nazis !

---------------------------------------------------------
Former U.S. Vice President Al Gore is comparing his struggle to reverse global climate change to the fight against the Nazis during World War II.

Gore, who won the Nobel Peace Prize for the climate change film, “An Inconvenient Truth,” said the greatest challenge would be to convince people that the threat from climate change was as urgent as the threat from Nazi Germany.

Newsmax.com - Gore Compares Climate Change Fight to WW II
---------------------------------------------------------

Now I know what's making all this damn wind. What a summer. Can someone get this Gore bozo to either prove his theory or shut the hell up ?

__________________
Something wicked this way comes.

That reminds me of this video:
YouTube - Brainy the Pooh & Pinklet Meet Algore & Bee Arthur

Somebody ought to tell Mars and Venus. While they're at it, they'd better invent a time machine and go back in time and tell ancient earth. (Since there have been much warmer times in earth history before any semblance of those evil men who invented those evil SUVs)

__________________
"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, ... That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men,"
-Declaration of Independence

Two truths that many Americans seem to have forgotten:
1. Men are endowed by God with inalienable rights.
2. Government's purpose is to secure man's God-given rights.

Actually, that's not true. It's free oxygen that's a product of life, not CO2 nor water vapor. The greenhouse effect would not only exist, but actually be stronger than it is now, in the absence of life.

Well, CO2 and Methane are also products of life, if you take into account the entire cycle.

But what i should have said was that the existence of life (from existence through decay) regulates the greenhouse effect. It would be pretty damn cold here without life.

Andrew

__________________
“...corporations and those who run them cannot stop exploiting resources and amassing wealth until they have... .I cannot finish this sentence, because the truth is that can never stop; like cancer, they can only continue to expand until they kill the host.”

-- Derrick Jensen

Methane and CO2 are naturally-occurring compounds that can exist without the intervention of life and do on lifeless planets. O2 -- free oxygen -- is another story. It's chemically unstable, tending to form compounds such as water, carbon dioxide, or sulfur dioxide. The only reason we have oxygen to breathe is because green plants continually break down CO2 into carbon compounds, releasing O2 as a waste gas. Animal life, which reverses this process, using O2 for its metabolism and exhaling CO2 as a waste gas, is dependent on plant life and a later adaptation. So without life, the atmosphere would have a lot MORE CO2 in it, and no O2.

So it's true as you say that life regulates the greenhouse effect, but not true that without life the planet would be an iceball. Much more likely that it would be a boiling hell instead. That's why deforestation is almost as much to blame for global warming as the burning of fossil fuels.

To be even more technical, all life respires in some way. Even plants. Plants just "make their own food" to break down unlike animals.

__________________
He who learns but does not think is lost! He who thinks but does not learn is in great danger. --Confucius

Smooth seas do not make skillful sailors.
--African proverb

Science is a wonderful thing if one does not have to earn one's living at it.
--Albert Einstein

Good points. Thanks for the clarification.

Andrew

__________________
“...corporations and those who run them cannot stop exploiting resources and amassing wealth until they have... .I cannot finish this sentence, because the truth is that can never stop; like cancer, they can only continue to expand until they kill the host.”

-- Derrick Jensen

Well, the alarm isn't the concentration of CO2 in the atmosphere, it's the rate at which we are adding to that concentration. It's true that in the past the world was hotter and had more CO2 than now. But, it didn't get that way until after millions of years. We are already seeing changes within the span of a human lifetime (for example, the pH of the ocean is decreasing after being stable for millions of years).

It comes down to carbon fluxes. If you look at what is going into the atmosphere and balancing that with what is coming out, humans (fossil fuels and land use) have more effect on the carbon dioxide concentration than anything else by far. Here's a good diagram of what I'm talking about. And we have very good evidence that carbon dioxide is responsible for major climatic shifts in our world's history.

There is a reason to be concerned.

__________________
He who learns but does not think is lost! He who thinks but does not learn is in great danger. --Confucius

Smooth seas do not make skillful sailors.
--African proverb

Science is a wonderful thing if one does not have to earn one's living at it.
--Albert Einstein

No. reason being is that it is absolutely not a canard. There is scientifi proof of global warming.

yeah, it warmed up like .6 of a degree.

the question is why....


far more likely that the sun as opposed to some SUVs are behind it.

__________________
Socialism doesn't create a rising tide that lifts all boats. It drains the lake and teaches the boat riders not to help themselves by rowing.

Jesus loves you, allah wants you dead

"Every government interference in the economy consists of giving an unearned benefit, extorted by force, to some men at the expense of others."

Ayn Rand

There is scientific proof of global cooling as well.

__________________
"The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money." - Margaret Thatcher

The sun has been determined to be responsible for fluctuations of earths temperature by about .1 degree either way (cooling or heating).

Response of global upper ocean temperature to changing solar irradiance
http://www.fel.duke.edu/~scafetta/pdf/2005GL023849.pdf

Check out this graph:



As you can see, for the warming recorded in the last half of the 20th century, the sun was actually in a slight cooling trend.

Andrew

__________________
“...corporations and those who run them cannot stop exploiting resources and amassing wealth until they have... .I cannot finish this sentence, because the truth is that can never stop; like cancer, they can only continue to expand until they kill the host.”

-- Derrick Jensen