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Gun Rights and Security Issues Gun Control, Crime, Drugs, Defence, Homeland Security, Immigration, Law Enforcement

View Poll Results: Do You Regularly Carry A Firearm?
Yes 47 29.94%
No 110 70.06%
Voters: 157. You may not vote on this poll

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  #1021 (permalink)  
Old 12-05-2007
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crisis crisis is offline
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Re: Do You Carry A Gun?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MattLarson View Post
And you have some reason to believe that shooting involves someone with a license to carry a concealed weapon why?

The article says the suspect is still at large.

Matt
You said "That’s (Basically all that can be said for widespread gun proliferation and the law of the jungle you suggest is that it would lead to mayhem. It means not only do you need to worry about people who may mean you harm, you need to worry about people who overreact or escalate relatively harmless situations.)
pretty much what has been said by anti-gun nuts in every state which has relaxed its concealed carry laws, and yet over the past 20 years, it has not come to pass even once."

I don’t believe you need a licence to carry a concealed weapon in that state!
I don’t think having a gun in a car is necessarily carrying a concealed weapon either.
And in any case the laws in that state make it gun nut heaven baby!!

That is a prefect example one instance where “the law of the jungle has lead to mayhem.”
A perfect example of one instance of “not only needing to worry about people who may mean you harm, but needing to worry about people who overreact or escalate relatively harmless situations”

You will continue to have your ass handed to you unless you put in a little effort and try to put some support to your thoughtless rambling.
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  #1022 (permalink)  
Old 12-05-2007
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Wallaroo Wallaroo is offline
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Re: Do You Carry A Gun?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve View Post
I saw the group of them from a good distance away. When we were about 50 feet away, I saw that one of them was holding what I thought was a baseball bat (it turned out to be a pipe). When we were about 30 feet away is when I saw the first knife, and when I reached for my gun. My wife and I stopped and they kept walking towards us. By the time they'd gotten to about 20 or 25 feet away, I saw that three of them were holding knives, and that's when I drew my gun.

One of them said "Here we go". I didn't know what he meant by that. I aimed at the closest one; and by "closest", I mean maybe a foot or so in front of the others, and said "STOP!". There was no question that I was aiming a gun at him.

His response was "Oh, I don't think so", and he took two more steps. I fired twice, hitting him in the chest with both rounds. At that point, he was probably 15 feet from me. I then aimed at the guy to his left; my right, and fired twice. I hit him once in the chest and once right below the collarbone.

When the second one fell, he was about 10 feet from me...
Thanks for explaining. I guess you figured they weren't out collecting for the Red Cross.

What did the location where it happened on look like? I mean, if they were 30 feet away when you first noticed that something was completely wrong, why couldn't you and your wife run away?
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  #1023 (permalink)  
Old 12-05-2007
Lunatech Lunatech is offline
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Re: Do You Carry A Gun?

Quote:
Originally Posted by crisis View Post
I don’t believe you need a licence to carry a concealed weapon in that state!
Wrong

Quote:
Originally Posted by crisis View Post
I don’t think having a gun in a car is necessarily carrying a concealed weapon either.
Correct, for Georgia, but here in Idaho it is considered a concealed weapon if it is in your glove box.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crisis View Post
And in any case the laws in that state make it gun nut heaven baby!!
Our laws are a bit more lax than Georgia's, actually.

Quote:
Originally Posted by crisis View Post
That is a prefect example one instance where “the law of the jungle has lead to mayhem.”
A perfect example of one instance of “not only needing to worry about people who may mean you harm, but needing to worry about people who overreact or escalate relatively harmless situations”

You will continue to have your ass handed to you unless you put in a little effort and try to put some support to your thoughtless rambling.
One example, out of 100 million legal gun owners. Please. You need to put some effort into your posts, as well. You're more likely to be killed crossing the street than by a legal gun owner in the US. You just keep handing people's asses to them, by all means.
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  #1024 (permalink)  
Old 12-05-2007
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Re: Do You Carry A Gun?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lunatech View Post
One example, out of 100 million legal gun owners. Please. You need to put some effort into your posts, as well. You're more likely to be killed crossing the street than by a legal gun owner in the US. You just keep handing people's asses to them, by all means.
How often do you hear about cases where legal gun owners have overreacted?
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  #1025 (permalink)  
Old 12-05-2007
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EricOKC EricOKC is offline
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Re: Do You Carry A Gun?

Quote:
Originally Posted by crisis View Post
You said "That’s (Basically all that can be said for widespread gun proliferation and the law of the jungle you suggest is that it would lead to mayhem. It means not only do you need to worry about people who may mean you harm, you need to worry about people who overreact or escalate relatively harmless situations.)
pretty much what has been said by anti-gun nuts in every state which has relaxed its concealed carry laws, and yet over the past 20 years, it has not come to pass even once."
It hasnt. Crime happened before the laws were relaxed, and surprisingly enough, it will continue to. In this case, the gun was not the problem but rather an individual with some major anger problems. Those people have existed LONG before there were firearms.
Quote:
Originally Posted by crisis View Post
I don’t believe you need a licence to carry a concealed weapon in that state!
You're incorrect - as usual. You most certainly DO need a license to carry concealed in the state of Georgia.
Quote:
Originally Posted by crisis View Post
I don’t think having a gun in a car is necessarily carrying a concealed weapon either.
Well as we've already established, what YOU think and what is reality tend to differ greatly. In many states, a gun in the car is considered a concealed weapon. I dont know about Georgia specifically though.
Quote:
Originally Posted by crisis View Post
And in any case the laws in that state make it gun nut heaven baby!!
How the fuck would you know? You dont even realize a CCW permit is required in Georgia. There are only 2 states in which a permit is not required to carry concealed - Vermont, which has been that way for over a century, and Alaska which recently dropped the license requirement.
Quote:
Originally Posted by crisis View Post
That is a prefect example one instance where “the law of the jungle has lead to mayhem.”
No, its a perfect example of criminal behavior. Nobody has used the "law of the jungle" line except you and frankly finding one single example of criminal behavior in a nation of 300 million people and equating that with the behavior of all gun owners makes you look quite foolish and hysterical.
Quote:
Originally Posted by crisis View Post
A perfect example of one instance of “not only needing to worry about people who may mean you harm, but needing to worry about people who overreact or escalate relatively harmless situations”
Exactly - and one of the many reasons why I carry. Thank you for proving my point.
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Originally Posted by crisis View Post
You will continue to have your ass handed to you unless you put in a little effort and try to put some support to your thoughtless rambling.
I hardly think you've handed anyone their ass, yet you've done a very good job of once again demonstrating how your head is firmly embedded in your own.
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Last edited by EricOKC; 12-05-2007 at 06:14 PM.
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  #1026 (permalink)  
Old 12-05-2007
Lunatech Lunatech is offline
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Re: Do You Carry A Gun?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wallaroo View Post
How often do you hear about cases where legal gun owners have overreacted?
Haven't heard one in years. I guess you could say that guy in Texas overreacted, though. The one who shot the two blokes who were robbing his neighbor's house.

They're rare, and when they happen they make national news. Maybe once or twice a year, we get the story about someone shooting someone else when they shouldn't have. 'Bout as common as hunting accidents, really. Which is funny, of course, since our own VP accidentally shot someone he was hunting with.
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  #1027 (permalink)  
Old 12-05-2007
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Re: Do You Carry A Gun?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wallaroo View Post
How often do you hear about cases where legal gun owners have overreacted?
It is extremely rare frankly.

CCW holders are actually among the most law abiding, if not the most law abiding segment of the population. We rather HAVE to be. In some states, you can have your license yanked, or at least not renewed, for unpaid parking tickets.

Do we shoot people sometimes? Yes, but typically those shootings are ruled as valid. I'm not aware of any situations in which a CCW holder has been convicted of a crime involving the use of a firearm in which someone was wrongly shot. That doesn't mean there aren't any, just that I don't personally know of any.
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  #1028 (permalink)  
Old 12-05-2007
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Re: Do You Carry A Gun?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lunatech View Post
Haven't heard one in years. I guess you could say that guy in Texas overreacted, though. The one who shot the two blokes who were robbing his neighbor's house.
Apparently he didn't. I don't believe charges have yet been filed even though the Harris County DA is extremely anti-gun. To the point that the laws in Texas had to be rewritten specifically to rein him in.

Texas explicitly allows the use of deadly force in the protection and recovery of property.

The only gray area is that it wasn't his property, but his neighbor's. Apparently the neighbor did ask him to keep an eye on the house though which makes things a little sticky.

If by some chance charges are filed, there isn't a jury in the state that will convict the man. We consider killing criminals to be a public service.
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  #1029 (permalink)  
Old 12-05-2007
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Re: Do You Carry A Gun?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wallaroo View Post
Thanks for explaining. I guess you figured they weren't out collecting for the Red Cross.
A fair assessment...

Quote:
What did the location where it happened on look like? I mean, if they were 30 feet away when you first noticed that something was completely wrong, why couldn't you and your wife run away?
We'd just crossed a street, so turning around and running wasn't option. They weren't in a tight group; mildly fanned out. And I'm rather sure they would've chased us even if we had run.

The truth of the matter is that it all transpired in the span of a few seconds. 30 feet became 20 feet real quick, and 20 feet became 10 feet even quicker...
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  #1030 (permalink)  
Old 12-05-2007
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Re: Do You Carry A Gun?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve View Post
I saw the group of them from a good distance away. When we were about 50 feet away, I saw that one of them was holding what I thought was a baseball bat (it turned out to be a pipe). When we were about 30 feet away is when I saw the first knife, and when I reached for my gun. My wife and I stopped and they kept walking towards us. By the time they'd gotten to about 20 or 25 feet away, I saw that three of them were holding knives, and that's when I drew my gun.

One of them said "Here we go". I didn't know what he meant by that. I aimed at the closest one; and by "closest", I mean maybe a foot or so in front of the others, and said "STOP!". There was no question that I was aiming a gun at him.

His response was "Oh, I don't think so", and he took two more steps. I fired twice, hitting him in the chest with both rounds. At that point, he was probably 15 feet from me. I then aimed at the guy to his left; my right, and fired twice. I hit him once in the chest and once right below the collarbone.

When the second one fell, he was about 10 feet from me...
Louis Lamour?
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  #1031 (permalink)  
Old 12-05-2007
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Re: Do You Carry A Gun?

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Originally Posted by chassisman View Post
Louis Lamour?
Well, Wallaroo has a habit of asking for detail after detail after detail, so I figured I'd include as many as I could...
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  #1032 (permalink)  
Old 12-05-2007
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crisis crisis is offline
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Re: Do You Carry A Gun?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lunatech View Post
Fine but nobody said it was concealed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lunatech View Post
Correct, for Georgia, but here in Idaho it is considered a concealed weapon if it is in your glove box.
Well there it aint.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lunatech View Post
One example, out of 100 million legal gun owners. Please. You need to put some effort into your posts, as well. You're more likely to be killed crossing the street than by a legal gun owner in the US. You just keep handing people's asses to them, by all means.
Please put some in yourself and read what crap I was responding to.

FYI
Originally Posted by EricOKC
“Thats pretty much what has been said by anti-gun nuts in every state which has relaxed its concealed carry laws, and yet over the past 20 years, it has not come to pass even once.”


And there would be countless other examples where it has come to pass. That one was way too easy to find.

And my partial apologies to MattLarson in this case as I though I was responding to EricOKC with the bit about the “thoughtless rambling.”However the questions were still invalid.


Quote:
Originally Posted by EricOKC View Post
It hasnt. Crime happened before the laws were relaxed, and surprisingly enough, it will continue to. In this case, the gun was not the problem but rather an individual with some major anger problems. Those people have existed LONG before there were firearms.
Here we go! He couldn’t have shot the guy without the gun. The nut with the gun was the problem. He could not have done anything from one car to another without the gun.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EricOKC View Post
You're incorrect - as usual. You most certainly DO need a license to carry concealed in the state of Georgia.
But no one said it was concealed. Stop trying to mould this event into some scenario that may suit you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EricOKC View Post
Well as we've already established, what YOU think and what is reality tend to differ greatly. In many states, a gun in the car is considered a concealed weapon. I dont know about Georgia specifically though.
It doesn’t matter about other states and as you don’t know, by your own admission about this one, why would you say that. From anyone else I would be dumbfounded but……...

Quote:
Originally Posted by EricOKC View Post
How the fuck would you know? You dont even realize a CCW permit is required in Georgia. There are only 2 states in which a permit is not required to carry concealed - Vermont, which has been that way for over a century, and Alaska which recently dropped the license requirement.
Your ignorance is at least equal yet you profess to be an firearm expert.
This guy had a gun in his car. It doesn’t really matter if it was concealed cause it sure as fuck wasn’t when he blasted the other guy. He was carrying one in his car and was legally allowed to. In a totally random situation he responded to some incident on the road and by shooting at someone he didn’t like the look of. It is a case of someone who is unfit yet perhaps legally allowed to carry a gun using it irresponsibly and out of all proportion to the incident in hand.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EricOKC View Post
No, its a perfect example of criminal behavior. Nobody has used the "law of the jungle" line except you and frankly finding one single example of criminal behavior in a nation of 300 million people and equating that with the behavior of all gun owners makes you look quite foolish and hysterical.
But you said there was no example. We both know there are thousands each year where legal owners have committed used them irresponsibly. By definition once they have they are “criminals” in the sense they have committed a crime. Up until then they are not. So the guy (and it doesn’t necessarily need be this one) who has a gun in his car for self defence and has someone cut him off on the road and fling him the bird looses it and responds by shooting him. He is now a criminal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EricOKC View Post
Exactly - and one of the many reasons why I carry. Thank you for proving my point.
That’s probably what that nut thought he was carrying one for until he responded in what he thought was a reasonable manner to another person doing something he didn’t like or thought was threatening. Thanks for proving mine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EricOKC View Post
I hardly think you've handed anyone their ass, yet you've done a very good job of once again demonstrating how your head is firmly embedded in your own.
You said not a single case and I found on one minutes.
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  #1033 (permalink)  
Old 12-06-2007
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EricOKC EricOKC is offline
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Re: Do You Carry A Gun?

Quote:
Originally Posted by crisis View Post
You said not a single case and I found on one minutes.
No, i said that your claims of constant shootouts and the streets being flooded in violence has not come to pass.

Isolated incidents are not proof of your position crisis. Sorry, but you're simply wrong on this one.

By the way - you're the one who made the concealed weapon claim, not me. You dont even seem to be capable of remember which pile of crap you're spewing from post to post.
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