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  #181 (permalink)  
Old 06-09-2009
Joint Chiefs of Staff Member

 
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Re: Make an argument as to why marijuana should be illegal....

Quote:
Originally Posted by fishjoel View Post
Retro Fit,
(taking your information at face value for now)

Thanks for the article, it was very informative. The comparison to alcohol was not needed as I had already admitted that it's side effects are worse than (i'll use you language) hemp. I don't think hemp is a terrible drug either, but drug it still is. I still feel that it's a needless vice that, recreationally, has no real value. The fact that it may not impair you as much as alcohol still does not mean that it doesn't impair at all. I suppose, in the overall picture, the benefits of legalizing hemp would outweigh the detractors (since I obviously don't see it as that harmful). I was simply making my case for the intended purpose of the thread. I still think that the majority of what I state is still true, but I suppose that it's just not a battle that is worth fighting. So that aside...I would like to broaden the thread (temporarily), if no one minds...

Is hemp the only drug in which you advocate legalizing? I know many people lump those who are for legalizing hemp in with those you want all drugs to be made legal. Do you (all) think the systemic damages cause by more dangerous drugs inconsequential enough to legalize them as well?
Legalizing coke, heroin or meth makes no sense. That shit can and will kill you. Pot won't, plain and simple.
  #182 (permalink)  
Old 06-09-2009
Porras's Avatar
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Re: Make an argument as to why marijuana should be illegal....

Coke isn't so bad with proper production and use. I can't say much about heroine. Meth, of course, is God's way of reinforcing natural selection.
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  #183 (permalink)  
Old 06-09-2009
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Re: Make an argument as to why marijuana should be illegal....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Porras View Post
Coke isn't so bad with proper production and use. I can't say much about heroine. Meth, of course, is God's way of reinforcing natural selection.
If used responsibly, I doubt it is. Although few people are able to do so, the few who almost undoubtedly do should be allowed to carry on as they please. In my opinion, that is. Heroin is a prodrug of morphine, simply much more lipophilic, and many people are able to use opiates - such as heroin - responsibly as well. Opiates in general, with a few exceptions, are quite benign as far as physical damage is concerned. When injected, the adulterants are the real danger of heroin use. Well, and the addiction. That has to suck.
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  #184 (permalink)  
Old 06-09-2009
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Re: Make an argument as to why marijuana should be illegal....

my concern is the overdose. And how ive seen coke, heroin or meth literally fill someones every thought all day every day. Its just sad. Never seen that happen with pot. Not at all. Ive seen someone smoke all day, but if they didn't have any they didn't FREAK out. It was a bummer, but thats it.

Ive seen alcohol fill someones thoughts, but we tried prohibition already, it didn't work.
  #185 (permalink)  
Old 06-09-2009
Secretary of State

 
Member Since: Dec 2004
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Re: Make an argument as to why marijuana should be illegal....

Quote:
Originally Posted by reality View Post
Legalizing coke, heroin or meth makes no sense. That shit can and will kill you. Pot won't, plain and simple.
Lots of things can kill you. Every year hundreds of kids die from huffing dangerous chemicals. Should we make Dust Off illegal too? Should we make all of the hundreds of chemicals kids huff illegal? Heck, I know one guy who turned his brain to mush from sniffing gasoline fumes. Maybe we should make gasoline illegal too.

Each year, more than 830 children ages 14 and under die as a result of unintentional drowning.

Should we make swimming pools illegal too?

Teen suicides had been declining until 2007, where they increased 8% in one year.

The analysis also found that changes had taken place in the methods used to attempt suicide. In 1990, firearms were the most common method for both girls and boys. However, in 2004, hanging/suffocation was the most common method of suicide among girls, accounting for 71.4 percent of suicides among 10- to-14-year-old girls and 49 percent among 15-to-19 year-old girls. From 2003 to 2004, there was a 119 percent increase in hanging/suffocation suicides among 10-to -14-year-old girls. For boys and young men, firearms are still the most common method.

Look at those stats on hanging? I say we make rope illegal too.

You simply can't protect everyone, no matter how bad you want to.

ALL DRUGS SHOULD BE LEGALIZED.

Make the hard drugs a little harder to get. If you do not legalize them, then the black market will provide them and they will be more dangerous, with more impurities and the profits will go to scumbags who place little to no value on human life.
  #186 (permalink)  
Old 06-09-2009
Secretary of State

 
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Re: Make an argument as to why marijuana should be illegal....

Quote:
Originally Posted by reality View Post
my concern is the overdose. And how ive seen coke, heroin or meth literally fill someones every thought all day every day. Its just sad. Never seen that happen with pot. Not at all. Ive seen someone smoke all day, but if they didn't have any they didn't FREAK out. It was a bummer, but thats it.

Ive seen alcohol fill someones thoughts, but we tried prohibition already, it didn't work.
Why didn't prohibition work?

What problems did prohibition cause?

Isn't the war on drugs causing the exact same problems that alcohol prohibition caused?
  #187 (permalink)  
Old 06-09-2009
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Re: Make an argument as to why marijuana should be illegal....

Quote:
Originally Posted by reality View Post
my concern is the overdose. And how ive seen coke, heroin or meth literally fill someones every thought all day every day. Its just sad. Never seen that happen with pot. Not at all. Ive seen someone smoke all day, but if they didn't have any they didn't FREAK out. It was a bummer, but thats it.

Ive seen alcohol fill someones thoughts, but we tried prohibition already, it didn't work.
Your last statement seems rather odd - "we tried prohibition already, [but] it didn't work". Are you talking specifically about alcohol, or are you also talking about the prohibition that you advocate (i.e. coke, meth, heroin), which also doesn't work?

I'm assuming that you're talking about alcohol only, as advocating for something that doesn't work seems rather silly. If that is the case, why would you think that prohibition of one dangerous substance could not possibly work but that we ought to try the same strategy on another substance? Are you simply in favor of preserving the status quo for the sake of comfort?
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  #188 (permalink)  
Old 06-09-2009
President

 
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Re: Make an argument as to why marijuana should be illegal....

Quote:
Originally Posted by drgoodtrips View Post
Your last statement seems rather odd - "we tried prohibition already, [but] it didn't work". Are you talking specifically about alcohol, or are you also talking about the prohibition that you advocate (i.e. coke, meth, heroin), which also doesn't work?

I'm assuming that you're talking about alcohol only, as advocating for something that doesn't work seems rather silly. If that is the case, why would you think that prohibition of one dangerous substance could not possibly work but that we ought to try the same strategy on another substance? Are you simply in favor of preserving the status quo for the sake of comfort?
Probably because he thinks that alcohol is somehow "ingrained" in our society and all of the others drugs are not. Never mind that just under 50% of Americans have tried MJ by 12th grade. There's a LAW against it and that means it can't possibly become INGRAINED, no matter how ineffective said law has been proven to be.
  #189 (permalink)  
Old 06-09-2009
Vice President
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Re: Make an argument as to why marijuana should be illegal....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slon View Post
Probably because he thinks that alcohol is somehow "ingrained" in our society and all of the others drugs are not. Never mind that just under 50% of Americans have tried MJ by 12th grade. There's a LAW against it and that means it can't possibly become INGRAINED, no matter how ineffective said law has been proven to be.
Yup, that get's tossed around a lot, and I find it especially egregious due to the fact that:

A. Waaaaay too many cops are binge drinkers, if not juicehounds and
B. People die all the time from overdoses of smack, etc... in the joint
  #190 (permalink)  
Old 06-09-2009
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Re: Make an argument as to why marijuana should be illegal....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tanngrisnir3 View Post
B. People die all the time from overdoses of smack, etc... in the joint
Those poor criminals.
  #191 (permalink)  
Old 06-09-2009
drgoodtrips's Avatar
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Re: Make an argument as to why marijuana should be illegal....

Quote:
Originally Posted by fishjoel View Post
Those poor criminals.
Perhaps more to the point is that if we as a society cannot successfully keep prisoners from abusing drugs, there would seem to be very little hope for prohibition policies at large to be successful. Even when people eat, sleep, and crap on the government schedule, under supervision, the government is still not competent enough to make prohibition successful.
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  #192 (permalink)  
Old 06-09-2009
Vice President
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Re: Make an argument as to why marijuana should be illegal....

Quote:
Originally Posted by fishjoel View Post
Those poor criminals.
That wooshing sound? The one over your head?

Never mind....
  #193 (permalink)  
Old 06-09-2009
Joint Chiefs of Staff Member

 
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Re: Make an argument as to why marijuana should be illegal....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Norrin Radd View Post
Lots of things can kill you. Every year hundreds of kids die from huffing dangerous chemicals. Should we make Dust Off illegal too? Should we make all of the hundreds of chemicals kids huff illegal? Heck, I know one guy who turned his brain to mush from sniffing gasoline fumes. Maybe we should make gasoline illegal too.

Each year, more than 830 children ages 14 and under die as a result of unintentional drowning.

Should we make swimming pools illegal too?

Teen suicides had been declining until 2007, where they increased 8% in one year.

The analysis also found that changes had taken place in the methods used to attempt suicide. In 1990, firearms were the most common method for both girls and boys. However, in 2004, hanging/suffocation was the most common method of suicide among girls, accounting for 71.4 percent of suicides among 10- to-14-year-old girls and 49 percent among 15-to-19 year-old girls. From 2003 to 2004, there was a 119 percent increase in hanging/suffocation suicides among 10-to -14-year-old girls. For boys and young men, firearms are still the most common method.

Look at those stats on hanging? I say we make rope illegal too.

You simply can't protect everyone, no matter how bad you want to.

ALL DRUGS SHOULD BE LEGALIZED.

Make the hard drugs a little harder to get. If you do not legalize them, then the black market will provide them and they will be more dangerous, with more impurities and the profits will go to scumbags who place little to no value on human life.
Huffing paint, markers, glue, gas whathave you is already illegal. If youre caught doing it you get to go to JAIL.

Youre oversimplifying. Besides, our culture isn't at all ready to accept a bill that legalizes all drugs. Pot could get legalized if people would stop lumping it in with coke, heroin and meth. I'm a pot smoker, and I'm just looking out for my interests.
  #194 (permalink)  
Old 06-09-2009
Joint Chiefs of Staff Member

 
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Re: Make an argument as to why marijuana should be illegal....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Norrin Radd View Post
Why didn't prohibition work?

What problems did prohibition cause?

Isn't the war on drugs causing the exact same problems that alcohol prohibition caused?
Its different. Alcohol and pot are no where near as bad as meth or heroin. There just aren't redeeming qualities for those drugs. Everyone i've met whos done meth or heroine has had SERIOUS psychological and physical problems because of it. Pot and alcohol not so much. Most of the problems from pot and alcohol stem from legality issues (dwi and the like. possesion for pot). Heroin doesn't have to be illegal to turn you into a dope whore.

I'm concerned with getting pot legalized. I think that could be accomplished in part by seperating pot from "hard" drugs. Just looking out for number one.
  #195 (permalink)  
Old 06-09-2009
Joint Chiefs of Staff Member

 
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Re: Make an argument as to why marijuana should be illegal....

Quote:
Originally Posted by drgoodtrips View Post
Your last statement seems rather odd - "we tried prohibition already, [but] it didn't work". Are you talking specifically about alcohol, or are you also talking about the prohibition that you advocate (i.e. coke, meth, heroin), which also doesn't work?

I'm assuming that you're talking about alcohol only, as advocating for something that doesn't work seems rather silly. If that is the case, why would you think that prohibition of one dangerous substance could not possibly work but that we ought to try the same strategy on another substance? Are you simply in favor of preserving the status quo for the sake of comfort?
Not it at all. Alcohol prohibition didn't work because its you can make it at home with sugar. Just like you can grow pot in your closet easily. Coke heroin are nearly impossible to produce in your backyard. With stiffer penalties, tighter border control, and the like you could really cut down on it. Meth is trickier but it can be done. Just trying to be realistic about what could actually pass through congress.
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