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Gun Rights and Security Issues Gun Control, Crime, Drugs, Defence, Homeland Security, Immigration, Law Enforcement

View Poll Results: who would ye hire?
1. Team A 9 39.13%
2. Team B 14 60.87%
Voters: 23. You may not vote on this poll

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  #106 (permalink)  
Old 08-24-2009
Steve's Avatar
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Location: San Diego
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Re: illegal aliens or americans?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wallaroo View Post
Good boy! Nothing beats german cleaning anyway...
That woman was festidious, that's for damn sure...
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  #107 (permalink)  
Old 08-24-2009
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Re: illegal aliens or americans?

Quote:
Originally Posted by lpfan13612 View Post
should have... but weren't...
But should've been...

Quote:
i don't think that makes them scumbags though.
I acknowledge that you disagree with me.

But that doesn't mean you're right...

Quote:
they beat the system without abusing it... good for them i say.
And I say "Should've shipped 'em the fuck back to Cuba"...

Quote:
What part of New York? Im a liaison on Fort Drum right now. more curious than anything.
Long Island; Suffolk County...

Quote:
It makes a difference because you don't know the first thing about having to WANT to be a citizen.
Sure I do.

I've been all over the world, and have visited countless countries. After visiting those countries, I know I "want" to be a citizen, and I'm glad I am. I think what you meant to say is that I don't know what it's like to want to become a citizen.

And to that I ask "So what?"

I don't know what it's like to be a child molester or a kidnapper, either. Should I have some compassion for those people, too?

Quote:
you were blessed with citizenship by birth. I obtained mine when i was 12 when i came over from Germany. Legally (just thought i should put that). My wife didn't get hers until she was almost 19...
Good for you. You're wife should've been deported...

Quote:
I guess my point is that there are good "illegals" out there.
No, there aren't.

They're criminals.

Why should I think that these people are going to be "law abiding"? After all, they've already demonstrated a propensity to dismiss the law. They've proven that they will break the law in order to get what they want.

Why should anyone think they won't continue to do that?
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  #108 (permalink)  
Old 08-24-2009
Secretary of Defense
Weirdo centrist

 
Member Since: Feb 2008
Location: Democratic Republic of Dublin
Posts: 2,034

Ireland     Israel

Re: illegal aliens or americans?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slartibartfas View Post
I doubt you will be still able to find a lot of illegal immigrants from Eire or England in the modern day US.
Actually, there are a fair few illegal Irish in the US. It's a topic that periodically becomes an issue. It's one of the reasons that the GAA (Gaelic Athletics Association) has to play matches against American teams in the US - all their American members are illegals.
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  #109 (permalink)  
Old 08-24-2009
solletica's Avatar
Secretary of State

 
Member Since: Dec 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 3,535

   
Re: illegal aliens or americans?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MeadHallPirate View Post
*acknowledges the Solletica the anime*

aye aye lass! if ye don't like the way me poll question be framed, thats fine, though judgin' by yer earlier statement...
...i'd guess ye would hire team A.
No, I never said that. I would hire the crew that costs the least for the kind of work I wanted to be done. If that crew is the $50,000 one, so be it. If that crew is the $70,000, so be it. Paying more than one someone is worth is unwise, but so is being a cheapskate.
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  #110 (permalink)  
Old 08-24-2009
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Member Since: Aug 2004
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 25,432

United_States     Louisiana

Re: illegal aliens or americans?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wallaroo View Post
So you never hired a spick cleaning lady or babysitter with no green card?
I know you were asking Steve but I'll answer anyway. After Katrina, the only contractors that I hired that I didn't know was the one that repaired my roof and the one that rebuilt my fence. As I took bids, I asked each contractor whether or not their crews were legal American citizens. One hemmed and hawed so he was automatically dropped from my list, another was from out of state and he wanted over double what the job was worth (come to find out, he was going to charge me for six extra bundles of shingles and his contract read that he would keep any extra material!). I ended up going with a local guy to build my fence and he did a fantastic job. For my roof, I could have got the 'family rate' from my cousin but family rate also means that it would take a little longer so I went with a crew of four from Ohio, three guys and a woman, all in their late 20's. They weren't the cheapest but I was quite impressed with the way they presented themselves and they were all Americans. On the last day of the job, I bought lunch for them...roast beef po-boys...just to show a little Southern hospitality and appreciation for a job well done!
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  #111 (permalink)  
Old 08-24-2009
Slartibartfas's Avatar
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the sole solution: mutual understanding

 
Member Since: Feb 2005
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European_Union     Austria

Re: illegal aliens or americans?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hafke View Post
Actually, there are a fair few illegal Irish in the US. It's a topic that periodically becomes an issue. It's one of the reasons that the GAA (Gaelic Athletics Association) has to play matches against American teams in the US - all their American members are illegals.
Sounds rather stupid to me. Well, maybe now in the face of the new crises again, it may become understandable, but why should anyone want to become an illegal if the own country is so successful and wealthy?

I mean there have been quite a few illegal Americans in central Europe until recently as well. They exploited the visa policies but now that got pretty hard as they had to cross borders every few months, and with most central European countries being now part of the Schengen zone, that is not so easy any more. Anyway are we talking about this dimension of illegal immigration or really substantial one?
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  #112 (permalink)  
Old 08-24-2009
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Secretary of Defense

 
Member Since: Jun 2006
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 3,218

United_States     Italy

Re: illegal aliens or americans?

Quote:
Originally Posted by solletica View Post
No, I never said that. I would hire the crew that costs the least for the kind of work I wanted to be done. If that crew is the $50,000 one, so be it. If that crew is the $70,000, so be it. Paying more than one someone is worth is unwise, but so is being a cheapskate.
That's the beautiful part of being illegal, you can get by on 6.50 an hour here in the US if you're an illegal because that 6.50 an hour is really like 15.00 an hour in Mexico. Hence illegals will always work for less.

When you rent a bunk for 50 bucks a week in your cousins garage and stack your cash, you can go back to Mexico and live for 3 or 4 years and not work and just chill like you're retired.

Americans don't have that option, we cost more because or living standards are higher then in Mexico, hence higher wages.

Americans cant get by on 6.50 an hour but a temporary illegal alien can, this is a cash cow to these illegals.

I wish I could work for 3 or 4 years and sock away 50-60 grand in that time and live like a king in Mexico and when it was all gone I could just jump the boarder and do it all over again. And the majority of illegals do this, they're constantly going back and forth.
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  #113 (permalink)  
Old 08-24-2009
Donkey_Left's Avatar
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United_States     Colombia

Re: illegal aliens or americans?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Swoop187 View Post
That's the beautiful part of being illegal, you can get by on 6.50 an hour here in the US if you're an illegal because that 6.50 an hour is really like 15.00 an hour in Mexico. Hence illegals will always work for less.

When you rent a bunk for 50 bucks a week in your cousins garage and stack your cash, you can go back to Mexico and live for 3 or 4 years and not work and just chill like you're retired.

Americans don't have that option, we cost more because or living standards are higher then in Mexico, hence higher wages.

Americans cant get by on 6.50 an hour but a temporary illegal alien can, this is a cash cow to these illegals.

I wish I could work for 3 or 4 years and sock away 50-60 grand in that time and live like a king in Mexico and when it was all gone I could just jump the boarder and do it all over again. And the majority of illegals do this, they're constantly going back and forth.
Absolute no-one is stopping you from renting a bunk in a garage.
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  #114 (permalink)  
Old 08-24-2009
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Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 3,218

United_States     Italy

Re: illegal aliens or americans?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Donkey_Left View Post
Absolute no-one is stopping you from renting a bunk in a garage.
Why would I want to live in a garage?

Its not like I can just save money and move back to Mexico where its value lets me live like a king for 3-4 years.

Do you understand that concept?
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  #115 (permalink)  
Old 08-24-2009
Swoop187's Avatar
Secretary of Defense

 
Member Since: Jun 2006
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 3,218

United_States     Italy

Re: illegal aliens or americans?

I'm sick of people basing their opinions on their bullshit news paper articles and heart.

Its time people base their opinions on experience rather then some fucked up ideology.

People want to say capturing illegals is impossible, yeah fucking right, I could catch 100's in an 8 hour work day.

I know exactly where they're at and finding them is easy as fuck.

When Mexicans are living in a garage, they are 99% of the time illegals.. If they weren't illegals they wouldn't be living in a fucking garage in military type barracks. That's just common sense.

Illegals and US citizens have different living lifestyles...They're quite easy to spot... Illegals where cowboy boots and cowboy hats here in the north and dont speak a lick of English while your average Mexican here on a visa who is here permanently does make strides to assimilate.

Most Mexican immigrants that value the US and who want to assimilate and live the American dream will NOT make their home a barrio shit hole, they will actually live the American dream, because that's the God damn point.

That's called common sense.
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  #116 (permalink)  
Old 08-24-2009
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Re: illegal aliens or americans?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Swoop187 View Post
That's the beautiful part of being illegal, you can get by on 6.50 an hour here in the US if you're an illegal because that 6.50 an hour is really like 15.00 an hour in Mexico. Hence illegals will always work for less.

$6.50 under the table is also closer to $15.00 net in the US.
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  #117 (permalink)  
Old 08-24-2009
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Joint Chiefs of Staff Member

 
Member Since: Feb 2006
Location: sailin' the seven seas
Posts: 1,048

   
Re: illegal aliens or americans?

Quote:
Originally Posted by solletica View Post
No, I never said that. I would hire the crew that costs the least for the kind of work I wanted to be done. If that crew is the $50,000 one, so be it. If that crew is the $70,000, so be it. Paying more than one someone is worth is unwise, but so is being a cheapskate.
*tweaks the mighty Solletica*

greetings lass, and hail thee!

well, based on what ye wrote, i still think ye'd have no trouble hirin' team A if ye were hirin' folks to add an addition to yer buildin', especially if the quality 'o work between both teams were comparable.

and why would them swabby's on team A be able to build yer addition fer less monies?
Quote:
Former City of Austin employee Andrew Henry agrees (with MeadHallPirate). Henry, 50, who recently retired from his maintenance job in the city's Public Works and Transportation Department, said illegal immigrants take jobs from some U.S. citizens and drive down wages for others. "Where you or I wouldn't take a job for $8, they'll take it for $2 or $3 an hour," he said.
and aye, thar be more! since ye seems to be a practical sailor, ye might find this interestin'...
Quote:
Some employers say they prefer hiring illegal immigrants to citizens and argue that hiring U.S. citizens would drive up costs for everyone.

"It would probably double the price of a house, and it would take them three to four times longer to finish a house," said an Austin contractor who builds house foundations. U.S. citizens "wouldn't work as fast as illegals -- you see them out there in 100-degree weather swinging a sledgehammer all day long."
I-9 Enforcement -- Illegal labor fuels hot Austin

aye?

- MeadHallPirate

ps - i just want to say that imma not some booster fer the illegal immigrant workforce, but thar seems to be a lot 'o americans who are. at any rate, clearly americans need to be protected from thar own nature, fer a good deal 'o them cannot resist this low hangin' fruit 'o cheap, effective labor.

Last edited by MeadHallPirate; 08-24-2009 at 10:45 PM.
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  #118 (permalink)  
Old 08-25-2009
Secretary of Defense

 
Member Since: Jan 2009
Location: Virginia
Posts: 2,044

Earth     United_States

Re: illegal aliens or americans?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Swoop187 View Post
Why would I want to live in a garage?

Its not like I can just save money and move back to Mexico where its value lets me live like a king for 3-4 years.

Do you understand that concept?
why not?
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  #119 (permalink)  
Old 08-25-2009
Secretary of Defense
Weirdo centrist

 
Member Since: Feb 2008
Location: Democratic Republic of Dublin
Posts: 2,034

Ireland     Israel

Re: illegal aliens or americans?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slartibartfas View Post
Sounds rather stupid to me. Well, maybe now in the face of the new crises again, it may become understandable, but why should anyone want to become an illegal if the own country is so successful and wealthy?
Yeah, Ireland is awesome.

But there was a terrible time in the 1980s, when a lot of people had to leave for basic survival. I think a lot of people missed out on visas, went anyway to earn money and ended up settling down, including having children in public schools and never quiet being able to sort out their citizenship. The Irish government has never wanted them all back, so they're trying to get the US government to give them an amnesty.

Quote:
I mean there have been quite a few illegal Americans in central Europe until recently as well. They exploited the visa policies but now that got pretty hard as they had to cross borders every few months, and with most central European countries being now part of the Schengen zone, that is not so easy any more. Anyway are we talking about this dimension of illegal immigration or really substantial one?
No one's really sure how many there are, but it's enough that no one could cope in Ireland if they were deported. I'll have to look that up, if you don't mind waiting.

Edit: Found something:

Quote:
There are an estimated 50,000 Irish illegal immigrants in the U.S.; 30,000 of them are thought to live in New York City.
http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/...5377830.column

The probably won't be legalised - at lest partly due a few incidents where Americans with visas were turned away from Ireland, but it's still interesting.

Last edited by Hafke; 08-25-2009 at 09:38 AM.
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  #120 (permalink)  
Old 08-25-2009
Cari's Avatar
Secretary of Defense

 
Member Since: Jul 2009
Location: I'm on a boat
Posts: 2,082

   
Re: illegal aliens or americans?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrs. M View Post
I know you were asking Steve but I'll answer anyway. After Katrina, the only contractors that I hired that I didn't know was the one that repaired my roof and the one that rebuilt my fence. As I took bids, I asked each contractor whether or not their crews were legal American citizens. One hemmed and hawed so he was automatically dropped from my list, another was from out of state and he wanted over double what the job was worth (come to find out, he was going to charge me for six extra bundles of shingles and his contract read that he would keep any extra material!). I ended up going with a local guy to build my fence and he did a fantastic job. For my roof, I could have got the 'family rate' from my cousin but family rate also means that it would take a little longer so I went with a crew of four from Ohio, three guys and a woman, all in their late 20's. They weren't the cheapest but I was quite impressed with the way they presented themselves and they were all Americans. On the last day of the job, I bought lunch for them...roast beef po-boys...just to show a little Southern hospitality and appreciation for a job well done!
Your experience is not unique, most people feel that way, and that's why I disagree that illegals make it harder for contractors. I work for a contractor, we're all Americans, we're TRCC certified (does LA have a residential building commission? Always get certified contractors!) and carry a million dollar liability insurance policy. When we tell a homeowner that, even though we are more expensive, they choose us every time. Only a cheat who wants to pocket half his insurance money picks the illegals, and those aren't the kind of people we want to do business with anyway. They'll screw you every time.
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