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Secretary of Defense
Senate Unanimously Passes 2013 NDAA; Power to Arrest Americans Remains
I am surprised no one has posted this yet.
The National Defense Authorization Act has passed for 2013 and the ability of the government supposedly to arrest US Citizens is still intact.
I have been against this myself since the Patriot Act and the NDAA's from after that. Even going back to earlier versions that had pieces of this in them.
Yet this is part of what Obama promised for his first term to end.
The worst part... it passed the Senate 98-0. Pretty pathetic but I am really starting to see a pattern I cannot ignore. Our Government wants to stay in power. They do not care about the Constitution and that goes for the Republicans as well as the Democrats. There are very very few who do anymore. It is all about power.
Alexander Tytler was credited with the following. That is debatable but the sentiment remains valid.
We can debate all year on whether Alexander Tytler said these things. That doesn't matter and is not the point. The point is that the concept and ideas involved in this statement are valid."A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the majority discovers it can vote itself largess out of the public treasury. After that, the majority always votes for the candidate promising the most benefits with the result the democracy collapses because of the loose fiscal policy ensuing, always to be followed by a dictatorship, then a monarchy."
"The historical cycle seems to be: From bondage to spiritual faith; from spiritual faith to courage; from courage to liberty; from liberty to abundance; from abundance to selfishness; from selfishness to apathy; from apathy to dependency; and from dependency back to bondage once more."
From my observations we are without a doubt moving from Dependency to Bondage. With almost 1/2 of citizens dependent on the government the rest of us are on the hook to pay for them. How anyone can believe that 1/2 of the population of working people are so bad off that they cannot find adequate work if at all is beyond me. The rest of what I would like to say is for another thread but the basics here are this.
The Government is maintains legal fictions to be able to incarcerate US Citizens on a whim. Yes on a whim. That is part of the NDAA going back for many decades the core principle is there. The Patriot Act expanded and Obama despite promises has not cut back from that position.
We have so many dependent on the government that anyone who threatens to cut their life line does not get voted in. The current crop and their cronies do not want to leave.
If you cannot see this trend and would prefer to call me a conspiracy nut, no problem. You better not have a problem when I say "I told you so"
My guns wont be illegal, they will only be undocumented.
I am male, white, straight, Christian, Conservative how else can I offend you today.
Vice President
Did you really expect anything else? Honestly? The momentum of the fall is increasing.
"The spirit must be the firmer, the heart the bolder,
courage must be the greater as our might fails"
Secretary of Defense
I have been trying not to go down the rabbit hole while it has been building up around me. I am starting to admit that some of the things I see happening are not for the greater good but for the subjugation of all.Originally Posted by ThorHammer
I truly worry that this was the last Presidential Election in the current United States. There is nothing I can do to stop it, all I can do is plan on how to weather the storm and protect my family the best way possible. Texas, South Carolina maybe, Tennessee and maybe even New Hampshire are the places that seem the best.
My guns wont be illegal, they will only be undocumented.
I am male, white, straight, Christian, Conservative how else can I offend you today.
Vice President
Ehhh, I wouldn't go that far. I think there will continue to be presidential elections and so on in the US. Will they mean anything? Well, that is an entirely different issue.
"The spirit must be the firmer, the heart the bolder,
courage must be the greater as our might fails"
Secretary of Defense
I wouldn't call you a "conspiracy nut".
Frankly, I had you pegged for a fairly bright guy and I'm surprised that you're just now starting to see it.
I ♣ Ideologues!
Secretary of Defense
Semantics at least in my opinion. The person on top will change but the system wont. How to stop it and go back to the Constitution, I don't know.
My guns wont be illegal, they will only be undocumented.
I am male, white, straight, Christian, Conservative how else can I offend you today.
Secretary of Defense
Get involved in the Libertarian Party. "Getting back to the Constitution" is sorta their thing.
We've got a long, long road ahead of us but it's the only viable option.
I ♣ Ideologues!
Vice President
I don't think it is possible to go back. Should we though?
Is it really an option though? Should it be?
I think the Constitution, on a certain level, is flawed.
"The spirit must be the firmer, the heart the bolder,
courage must be the greater as our might fails"
Secretary of Defense
Trying not to believe or see it is the issue. I really didn't want to think that the US is failing.
My guns wont be illegal, they will only be undocumented.
I am male, white, straight, Christian, Conservative how else can I offend you today.
Secretary of Defense
We have learned a lot in the last 230+ Years. We have learned that the words need to be rock solid with no ambiguity possible. We know they need to be clear with no and almost no way to misinterpret them.
The 2nd Amendment is a good example.
The Right of US Citizens to keep and bear arms that equal what the government can bring to bear shall under no circumstances be barred.
Just a quicky that would need to be adjusted but basically takes away wiggle room.
Or the "general Welfare clause" Article 1 Section 8.
The following powers are delegated to Congress and shall be their only powers except as Amended in the future through the Amendment System. These powers are not to be construed nor assumed to allow greater power than they specifically state here in.The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;
Then list clear and concise powers and try to avoid any possible Ambiguity. A rewrite of the Constitution with the concept that future generations will try and twist it to their own ends is a good idea.
That is the genius of the Constitution and why it is not really flawed past wording on some things. There is an Amendment system that allows for fixing or adding or removing something from it. It is not easy nor is it supposed to be.Is it really an option though? Should it be?
I think the Constitution, on a certain level, is flawed.
My guns wont be illegal, they will only be undocumented.
I am male, white, straight, Christian, Conservative how else can I offend you today.
Secretary of State
"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety" comes to mind.
- Frustrated Independent
"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin
"Every time something really bad happens, people cry out for safety, and the government answers by taking rights away from good people.” - Penn Jillette amazingly enough, and I agree.
Secretary of State
In some ways it is flawed, but what is more flawed is how wiling we are to ignore it for political gain. Unsure Libertarians are the right choice but in terms of the constitution they are by far more interested in fiscally limited government over anyone else these days. The document in terms of changes and updates is worth a look for dealing with our evolution needs and most certainly to get us off this track we are on.
- Frustrated Independent
"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin
"Every time something really bad happens, people cry out for safety, and the government answers by taking rights away from good people.” - Penn Jillette amazingly enough, and I agree.
Moderator
I AGREE!
But understand that you should start with the 'smaller' offices and that any 'movement' would take ten years (at least) to show promise.
Secretary of Defense
You damn well better go down the rabbit hole and prepare for a dollar collapse as well...that's when the shit really hits the fan with these FEMA "family help centers" and "indefinite detention" and the ending of posse comitatus (basically underway now). Heck even local police/sherriffs are getting these unmanned drones that can see in your house with infrared tech.
"Truth is treason in the empire of lies"
--R.P.
Secretary of Defense
If you could be more specific about how you think it's flawed I expect we could have a pretty good discussion around it.
That said, I agree with you but I don't know that it's possible to have a "perfect" charter.
Welssard pointed out a few examples of how he thinks it could be made better, but seeing as how I don't agree with him (I don't think wealthy individuals or businesses should be allowed, for example, to posess nuclear weapons) we run up against the issue of even the "new and improved" Constitution still being flawed (at least IMO).
Likewise, for every change that I'd like to see be made (I'd prefer a parliment to a Congress, for instance) I'm sure there will be plenty of people who'd think I'm fucking up the Constitution.
I ♣ Ideologues!
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