That's pretty much horse manure. In the words of the Leftist Hero John Maynard Keynes, "In the long run we're all dead."

Forgive me for interpretting for you but i believe I understood the point they where trying to make. That there where some people who where homosexual who believed that a certain law was unconstitutional or that the government did not have the power, right or authority to control the action of two consenting adults. They formed a lawsuit which was turned down as the courts felt that the government did have the authority, right or power to control that action.

The point about you not understanding how the legal system works is that the constitution is a lving document that is reinterpretted quite frequently as to what the exact limitations are and that it is not the litteral end all and be all of what powers the government are limited to. To use a Pirates of the Carribean quote "They are more like a set of guidlines than a code really."

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“If this were a dictatorship, it’d be a heck of
a lot easier, just so long as I’m the dictator.”

– George W. Bush in Washington, D.C., Dec. 18, 2000

I found this picture out on the web and thought it was really appropriate here:
http://fukung.net/v/17958/6d4b329e78...b1edf67522.png

__________________
“If this were a dictatorship, it’d be a heck of
a lot easier, just so long as I’m the dictator.”

– George W. Bush in Washington, D.C., Dec. 18, 2000

What's so appropriate about it? Sounds like some retard who can't figure out that those same services that he uses can be provided by private entities and they can be better in many cases. You know that energy producers can exist without the government, right?

I'm not too thrilled about the fluoride they put into my drinking water, though. I'd be happier with a private service.

And seriously, the fucking weather? How often are they wrong? I don't even watch the weather anymore with any regularity. I'd rather have the money spent there to myself, thank you.

Oh, and the fucking FCC? They ruin programming, not improve it!

And if I wanted my food and drugs inspected, I'd pay someone to do it. It's not like food producers want to kill off their customers, FFS.

Then they get really ridiculous. Yes, I get onto the roads that are "being repaired" and blocked off 24/7 for decades consecutively (thanks to bribes from construction companies) and I do this in a car that I must inspect once every two years (because everyone knows that nothing can possibly happen to your vehicle before then). Are they crazy? If I think something is wrong, I'll have it checked out on my own. Last inspection I had, they found two things. One that I didn't care about repairing because it didn't bother me or have any impact on performance and the other is one about which I would have found out (and one which I never use) on my own.

Then I get the fuel that's inflated in price due to EPA regulations I don't give a shit about. I drop some mail into a service that I only use because I'm already forced to pay for it at gunpoint (no way I'd use it otherwise). And even then, it's no bargain. To do this, I use money that is printed at will and given to failure corporations, thus fucking me over for not being a complete failure.

As I drive, I notice 4 sets of numbers on many trucks, costing ridiculous amount so fees, all thanks to the DOT's retarded regulations. These costs increase the prices of many of the things I have to ship. They also accomplish next to nothing.

I drop the kids off at a school where they're going to learn bullshit they'll forget when it's over and which will likely serve absolutely no purpose in their adult lives. And I have to pay for it. And they waste a dozen years of their lives. And the government holds a gun to everyone's head and tells them that they must do it.

And then, when I get home, my house is still standing because the fire marshal cast a "protection from fire" spell on my house.
Just kidding! It's still standing because it didn't catch fire! It would have been just as fine without them. But if I wanted the protection, I'd get insurance or hire a private protection service.

And not to forget the FCC which I mentioned briefly, I'm very glad they're watching out for "indecency" on TV. I mean, it's not like I can change the fucking channel on my own. NO! I need to pay a bloated organization to fuck up the channels so that I don't want to watch them anymore! It saves me from having to change the channel since the TV wouldn't ever be turned on.

I didnt agree with the point actually.

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"To take from one, because it is thought his own industry and that of his father has acquired too much, in order to spare to others who (or whose fathers) have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, "to guarantee to everyone a free exercise of his industry and the fruits acquired by it."

-Thomas Jefferson

well, you'll find it in any economics textbook.

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"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good." --Thomas Paine

And...

...the point is that our system is supposedly built around capitalism...certain components of capitalism (i.e. perfect information) that are critical for it to function properly are missing from our system. certain industries (i.e. health insurance) are able to unfairly take advantage of the system by exploiting the fact that our system is based upon a faulty premise.

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"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good." --Thomas Paine

Back to the point of the thread. Obama beleives that he has the power, and should use it, to take property that is owned by one person and give it to someone else based on how much they need it. Thats is socialism, and that is wrong. Wrong both because i beleive it is unconstitutional, and wrong because I beleive it is against my god given, inherint, right to life, liberty, and property. Now, if someone would like to try and convince me that Obama does not beleive in socialism, then have at it.

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"To take from one, because it is thought his own industry and that of his father has acquired too much, in order to spare to others who (or whose fathers) have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, "to guarantee to everyone a free exercise of his industry and the fruits acquired by it."

-Thomas Jefferson

And pray tell, in what Utopian Universe is there ever perfect anything dealing with humans?

...



that's the point.

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"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good." --Thomas Paine

What? That in a perfect society Socialism might work?

no...that you can't have perfect information and so therefore a system built upon classical capitalist theory is doomed to have serious problems unless regulated properly.

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"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good." --Thomas Paine

And no one denies that we need some regulation, thats why its specifically authorized in the constitution. Govt ownership of production and redistribution of wealth are not, and a system built upon it is doomed.

__________________
"To take from one, because it is thought his own industry and that of his father has acquired too much, in order to spare to others who (or whose fathers) have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, "to guarantee to everyone a free exercise of his industry and the fruits acquired by it."

-Thomas Jefferson

Where in the constitution does it say the government cannot own anything?
The government has owned assets and managed for profit enterprises since the founding fathers were the government, surely they understood the constitution better than you.

The Post Office was originally a cabinet level department, not a quasi-public corporation, but a department of the federal government, that acquired buildings, land, horses, wagons and other productive assets to provide a service. The founding fathers had no problem with that, so I find your interpretation of the original intent of the constitution less than insightful.

The founding fathers had no problem with the federal government owning and operating a bank, canals, toll roads and bridges, all productive enterprises which had been done by private enterprise before, the only justification the founding fathers seemed to need was that the federal government could handle these things more efficiently than the private sector.

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“ The subjects of every state ought to contribute towards the support of the government, as nearly as possible, in proportion to their respective abilities; that is, in proportion to the revenue which they respectively enjoy under the protection of the state.”

Adam Smith , The Wealth of Nations 1776

"We have always known that heedless self-interest was bad morals; we know now that it is bad economics"
FDR's second Inaugural Address