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Re: The moon landing
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YouTube - US flag on the moon There is also a web page, where a US physicist has calculated the angle of the earth as it should have been on the landing site (most pictures have major errors), but I don't remember the site just now - I will post it later. I have studied myself that as well and also the day/night lines in the earth pictures. There are just crazy examples from the fabrication... like full earth meaning that the capsule could have gone directly towards the sun - which they did not do. Such pictures have been taking by geostationary weather satellites. Picture pages: Aulis Online - Different Thinking Aulis Online – Different Thinking Last edited by Analyst; 12-10-2006 at 02:52 PM. |
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Re: The moon landing
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Thanks for the much needed laugh, Analyst. I have solved this "mystery" for you, using a frame capture from the video you linked and my amazing analytical abilities. I noticed a subtle thing in the video that explains the motion of the flag, and I have highlighted it here for you: ![]() I know it's a little tough to see, but I used sophisticated image enhancement tools to locate the mysterious source of the moving flag. Matt
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Re: The moon landing
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Re: The moon landing
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In any case, even if you are correct, then it’s all the more reason to question why the Soviet Union would have played along with the charade. If they had the upper hand in both space technology capacity and in political standing, they had little reason to let the world believe that the USA had reached the Moon first. It goes against the historical pattern of mass display of Soviet superiority, which was a driving factor in the Soviet Union’s own space firsts, as well as going against the grain of natural Russian nationalism. The Soviet Union had the capacity to monitor the mission, as I have referenced in previous posts. And this is where it gets murky. Again returning to the principle of Ockham’s razor, one of the problems with the conspiracy theory is that it has to devise speculative explanations for all the questions that arise if we accept the hoax theory. So, in this case, it is proffered by some conspiracy theorists that there was a secret economic deal reached to buy the Soviet Union’s silence. Then in order to make that explanation fit, a lot of related questions are side-stepped. No one here yet has attempted to give an explanation for Australia’s complicity in the scam. And what references do you have for the Nixon quote you state as fact? Quote:
I am aware that Werner von Braun and other experts are reported to have clashed with government and military officials regarding schedules and other aspects of the space program in general. But do you have references of Werner von Braun (and other experts) saying that it was not possible to send such rockets to the moon? And as far as the cosmic rays issue is concerned, does this mean that all subsequent Moon missions were faked? And I come round again to Ockham’s razor, and I believe it is more probable that there are means to shield humans from cosmic rays that are not known to me because I don’t have a science background, than it is probable that all missions to the Moon were faked. And what sources do you have that say that the ground tests had failed. The lunar module was tested during the Apollo 9 mission. There were minor problems but the various tests are recorded as satisfactory. Moonport, Ch21-3 Moonport, Ch21-1 Quote:
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If there are political reasons to explain the case for an elaborate hoax, I could equally argue that there are political reasons why NASA might have decided to fake some of the material of the mission. It works both ways. But there’s a difference between a little trickery and a grand conspiracy. Again, it is more probable that a little trickery was involved, than it is probable that a grand conspiracy was masterminded. Quote:
In this case the conspiracy theory is harder to rationalise than the official story. Okay…time to sleep now. Good night all.. Tethys
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Last edited by Tethys; 12-11-2006 at 05:56 AM. |
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Re: The moon landing
It was very late at night when I wrote my last post and I didn’t check it over properly…
The closing statement should have read: “In this case the conspiracy theory is harder to rationalise than the irregularities in the official story.” That is, I do not contest the claims that there may be irregularities in the official account and material records of the Apollo 11 mission, or that political machinations and other malpractices were at play behind the scenes, but I believe that these irregularities or reports of misrepresentations and/or intent to “fake it” do not amount to hard evidence of a hoax. In other words, the irregularities and misrepresentations thus far catalogued or alleged by conspiracy claimants can be disproved, contested or explained. These explanations might include unethical or unprofessional actions, and/or human error, technical problems, security measures and other reasons. It is important to question everything. But the point is that the incidence of any irregularities related to the Apollo 11 mission should not lead one to jump to the conclusion that there was a conspiracy, and that the moon landing was a hoax. A conspiracy is possible. But it is more reasonable to first presume that any apparent or verifiable irregularities are explainable, albeit that they may be unprofessional. An objective view requires an examination of both the official account and the arguments advanced in the conspiracy theory. In this case, none of the claimed irregularities in the official records are beyond conceivable explanation, again albeit that such explanations may reveal elements of error or fraud. In contrast, the conspiracy scenario contains far too many unanswered questions and doubtful suppositions, and it is equally opened to the charge of fabrication and spin for its own ends. I know I’m hammering the point, but I do so in the interest of seeking that reason prevails in any challenge of a contentious matter. It is a disservice to the ideals of constructive inquiry and objective critique to propagate uncritical conspiracy theories each time questions arise in relation to an event. For those interested in the principles of Ockham’s razor (also check under Occam and other spellings), there are a lot of references on the web. Here’s one that discusses the concept as applied to conspiracy theories (and it even cites the Moon landing conspiracy!): Essays: Occam's Razor Tethys
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Re: The moon landing
I know the pic in this article Mussssst be fake..but thought I would post it anyway...man has photoshop come along way...
250-mile high telly repair job | the Daily Mail
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No individual can plan his own existence in their view. So the state planners must arrogate to themselves the right to manipulate any sector of the economic system if the good of “society” or the “general welfare” is paramount. Ipso- if the rights of the individual get in the way, the rights of the individual must be sublimated. The Road to Serfdom FA Hayek (interpretation) Mortgage Backed Security survivor |
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Re: The moon landing
Which pic, Imperator, clear.cgi? Or did they change it?
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"Bring the boys back home!"--Pink Floyd NFA JJG 42-95 ![]() Free People/Free Markets Following the Path of the Beam |
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Re: The moon landing
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Actually there was very strong solar radation burst just when they finished this work. The radiation was 10.000 higher as norm. ISS is well bellow the protective van Allen radiation belt, but high enough that the humans will receive a dangerous dose. If they had been on moon, they had been killed immediatelly. Actually, there were similar at the same time as the Apollo crew was thought to be on the moon. Nobody knows why they were not killed. It was impossible to use any protection methods against cosmic rays. Occam's razor theory is not a valid one - it has been developed by CIA who wants to exploit these kinds of methods how to fool criticism. There is a point "take an official theory and don't believe it" - this is just a crazy starting point. If scientists would use that, nothing would preceed. |
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Re: The moon landing
Strange, can't see it on my laptop but shows on this one no problem.
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"Bring the boys back home!"--Pink Floyd NFA JJG 42-95 ![]() Free People/Free Markets Following the Path of the Beam |
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Re: The moon landing
These are interesting films where they show how the rounded earth picture was fabricated by putting a slide to the window of the capsule and filming the window in a dark capsule - then they put lights on and remove the slide and earth can be seen very close - Armstrong was said to walk on the moon on the next day - how this was possible - it takes 3 days to go to the moon orbit from earth orbit. Watch also the other movies coming to the right column.
YouTube - NASA . Collins Makes His Mark - on the Camera Lens YouTube - NASA . Mitchell's Son Makes Death Threat |
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Re: The moon landing
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Again, I accept there are certainly a number of questionable and verifiable irregularities in the official account and records of the Apollo program. But there are also holes in the conspiracy theory claims. On balance, however, I think the most I can believe at this stage is that there were elements of disinformation and trickery used for political and other motives, but this does not mean the whole thing was a hoax. Quote:
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Ockham’s razor (also spelled Occam’s razor), was most certainly not developed by the CIA. And it most certainly does not entail "take an official theory and don't believe it." It is a valid method of inquiry, applicabel in many disciplines. It has to do with probability. For me, in this case, it’s about weighing the credibility of the official account against that of the conspiracy theory. I never said that I dismissed the conspiracy claims or that they had no basis. Quote me if you contend that I did. I only said that from my viewpoint, my understanding of science, global politics and other related factors, the conspiracy theory was harder to believe than the official account, and that irregularities in the official account, albeit that they might reveal elements of deception, could be explained without recourse to claims of grand conspiracy. I have already posted a link above but I will post another one here. Our ABC radio actually has a science program called “Ockham’s Razor”. It features many fascinating discussions and interviews about science and philosophy. I recall that one program had featured a history and explanation of Ockham’s Razor. Here it is: Ockham's Razor with Robyn Williams ABC Radio National Broadcasted on Sunday 16/04/00 Summary: Physicist Anthony Garrett explains the meaning of Ockham's Razor. Ockham's Razor - 16/04/00: Ockham's Razor Now, below, I am posting the sources I have found on the question of exposure to cosmic rays. They are commentaries by various experts collected in a NASA publication called BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO. I took the time to cite and reference each individual report published in this collection, so people can easily see the span of issues covered and select the topics that most interest them. From skimming the various reports, it seems there are frank admissions of the problems that were faced, and also of the political, scientific and medical divisions that manifested themselves in relation to the Apollo mission with respect to the radiation problem. Here we go…. BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO Dedication, Editorial Board, Foreward, & Preface The purpose of putting this book on the Internet is to make it readily available to scientist and engineers throughout the world. Hopefully, it will provide ideas for expanding our understanding of space medicine and space physiology via the International Space Station. Since the original publication of this book in 1975, the contributors have been scattered. Some are making contributions in other areas or jobs, some are still making contributions to the current space program, some have retired, and some have died. The effort involved in putting this book online is dedicated to all of those pioneers who made the Apollo Program a success and to the cherished memories of our former colleagues and friends who are now deceased: BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - Dedication, Editorial Board, Foreward, & Preface BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO Introduction SECTION I CHAPTER 1 INTRODUCTION by Richard S. Johnston Director of Life Sciences Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - Introduction (Sec.1,Ch.1) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - APOLLO MISSIONS (Sec.1,Ch.2) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION I CHAPTER 2 APOLLO MISSIONS by Richard S. Johnston Wayland E. Hull Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - APOLLO MISSIONS (Sec.1,Ch.2) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - CLINICAL ASPECTS OF CREW HEALTH (Sec.2,Ch.1) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION II CHAPTER 1 CLINICAL ASPECTS OF CREW HEALTH by W. Royce Hawkins, M.D. John F. Zieglschmid, M.D. Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - CLINICAL ASPECTS OF CREW HEALTH (Sec.2,Ch.1) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION II CHAPTER 2 MICROBIOLOGICAL INVESTIGATIONS by James K. Ferguson, Ph.D. Gerald R. Taylor, Ph.D. Bernard J. Mieszkuc BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - MICROBIOLOGICAL INVESTIGATIONS (Sec.2,Ch.2) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - RADIATION PROTECTION AND SECTION II CHAPTER 3 INSTRUMENTATION by J. Vernon Bailey Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - RADIATION PROTECTION AND INSTRUMENTATION (Sec.2,Ch.3) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO METABOLISM AND HEAT DISSIPATION DURING APOLLO EVA PERIODS SECTION II CHAPTER 4 METABOLISM AND HEAT DISSIPATION DURING APOLLO EVA PERIODS by J.M. Waligora D.J. Horrigan Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - METABOLISM AND HEAT DISSIPATION DURING APOLLO EVA PERIODS (Sec.2,Ch.4) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION II CHAPTER 5 ENVIRONMENTAL FACTORS by E.L. Michel, M.S. J.M. Waligora, M.S. D.J. Horrigan, M.S. W.H. Shumate, Ph.D. Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - ENVIRONMENTAL FACTORS (Sec.2,Ch.5) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION II CHAPTER 6 FLIGHT CREW HEALTH STABILIZATION PROGRAM by Bennie C. Wooley, Ph.D.[*] Gary W. McCollum, M.S. Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - FLIGHT CREW HEALTH STABILIZATION PROGRAM (Sec.2,Ch.6) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION II CHAPTER 7 THE ROLE OF TOXICOLOGY IN THE APOLLO SPACE PROGRAM by Wayland J. Rippstein, Jr. Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - THE ROLE OF TOXICOLOGY IN THE APOLLO SPACE PROGRAM (Sec.2,Ch.7) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION III CHAPTER 1 ENDOCRINE, ELECTROLYTE, AND FLUID VOLUME CHANGES ASSOCIATED WITH APOLLO MISSIONS by Carolyn S. Leach, Ph.D. W. Carter Alexander, Ph.D. Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center P.C. Johnson, M.D. Baylor College of Medicine BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - ENDOCRINE, ELECTROLYTE, AND FLUID VOLUME CHANGES ASSOCIATED WITH APOLLO MISSIONS (Sec.3,Ch.1) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION III CHAPTER 2 CLINICAL BIOCHEMISTRY by W.C. Alexander, Ph.D. Carolyn S. Leach, Ph.D. Craig L. Fischer, M.D.[*] Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - CLINICAL BIOCHEMISTRY (Sec.3,Ch.2) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION III Chapter 3 HEMATOLOGY AND IMMUNOLOGY STUDIES by Stephen L. Kimzey, Ph.D. Craig L. Fischer, M.D.[*] Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center Philip C. Johnson, M.D. Baylor College of Medicine Stephan E. Ritzmann, M.D. University of Texas Medical Branch Charles E. Mengel, M.D. University of Missouri School of Medicine BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - HEMATOLOGY AND IMMUNOLOGY STUDIES (Sec.3,Ch.3) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION III CHAPTER 4 APOLLO FLIGHT CREW CARDIOVASCULAR EVALUATIONS by G. W. Hoffler, M.D. Robert L. Johnson, M.D. Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - APOLLO FLIGHT CREW CARDIOVASCULAR EVALUATIONS (Sec.3,Ch.4) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION III CHAPTER 5 EXERCISE RESPONSE by J.A. Rummel, Ph.D. C.F. Sawin, Ph.D. E.L. Michel, M.S. Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - EXERCISE RESPONSE (Sec.3,Ch.5) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION III CHAPTER 6 NUTRITIONAL STUDIES by Paul C. Rambaut, Sc.D.[*] Malcolm C. Smith, Jr., D.V.M. Harry O. Wheeler, Ph.D. Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - NUTRITIONAL STUDIES (Sec.3,Ch.6) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION III CHAPTER 7 SKELETAL RESPONSE by Paul C. Rambaut, Sc.D.[*] Malcolm C. Smith, Jr., D.V.M. Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center Pauline Beery Mack, Ph.DÝ Texas Womens’ University Denton, Texas John M. Vogel, M.D. U.S. Public Health Service Hospital San Francisco, California BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - SKELETAL RESPONSE (Sec.3,Ch.7) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION III CHAPTER 8 APOLLO FLIGHT CREW VESTIBULAR ASSESSMENT by J.L. Homick, Ph.D. Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center Earl. F. Miller, II, Ph.D. Naval Aerospace Medical Research Laboratory BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - APOLLO FLIGHT CREW VESTIBULAR ASSESSMENT (Sec.3,Ch.8) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION IV CHAPTER 1 BIOSTACK-A STUDY OF THE BIOLOGICAL EFFECTS OF HZE GALACTIC COSMIC RADIATION by Professor Horst Bücker University of Frankfurt, Federal Republic of Germany BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - BIOSTACK--A STUDY OF THE BIOLOGICAL EFFECTS OF HZE GALACTIC COSMIC RADIATION (Sec.4,Ch.1) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION IV CHAPTER 2 APOLLO LIGHT FLASH INVESTIGATIONS by W. Zachary Osborne, Ph.D. Lawrence S. Pinsky, Ph.D. University of Houston Houston, Texas J. Vernon Bailey Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - APOLLO LIGHT FLASH INVESTIGATIONS (Sec.4,Ch.2) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION IV CHAPTER 3 THE APOLLO 16 MICROBIAL RESPONSE TO SPACE ENVIRONMENT EXPERIMENT by Gerald R. Taylor, Ph.D. Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - THE APOLLO 16 MICROBIAL RESPONSE TO SPACE ENVIRONMENT EXPERIMENT (Sec.4,Ch.3) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION IV CHAPTER 4 THE APOLLO 17 POCKET MOUSE EXPERIMENT (BIOCORE)[*] by Webb Haymaker, M.D. Bonne C. Look NASA Ames Research Center Eugene V. Benton, Ph.D. University of San Francisco Richard C. Simmonds, D.V.M. NASA Ames Research Center BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - THE APOLLO 17 POCKET MOUSE EXPERIMENT (BIOCORE) (Sec.4,Ch.4) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION V CHAPTER 1 THE LUNAR QUARANTINE PROGRAM by Richard S. Johnston John A. Mason Bennie C. Wooley, Ph.D.[*] Gary W. McCollum Bernard J. Mieszkuc Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - THE LUNAR QUARANTINE PROGRAM (Sec.5,Ch.1) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION V CHAPTER 2 QUARANTINE TESTING AND BIOCHARACTERIZATION OF LUNAR MATERIALS by Gerald R. Taylor, Ph.D. Bernard J. Mieszkuc Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center Richard C. Simmonds, D.V.M. U.S. Air Force Charles H. Walkinshaw, Ph.D. U.S. Department of Agriculture BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - QUARANTINE TESTING AND BIOCHARACTERIZATION OF LUNAR MATERIALS (Sec.5,Ch.2) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION VI CHAPTER 1 APOLLO FOOD TECHNOLOGY by Malcolm C. Smith, D.V.M. N.D. Heidelbaugh, V.M.D. Paul C. Rambaut, Sc.D. R.M. Rapp Harry O. Wheeler, Ph.D. Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center C.S. Huber, Ph.D. C.T. Bourland, Ph.D. Technology, Inc. BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - APOLLO FOOD TECHNOLOGY (Sec.6,Ch.1) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION VI CHAPTER 2 WASTE MANAGEMENT SYSTEM by Richard L. Sauer Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center George K. Jorgensen The Boeing Company BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - WASTE MANAGEMENT SYSTEM (Sec.6,Ch.2) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION VI CHAPTER 3 BIOINSTRUMENTATION by Stanley M. Luczkowski Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - BIOINSTRUMENTATION (Sec.6,Ch.3) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION VI CHAPTER 4 POTABLE WATER SUPPLY by Richard L. Sauer David J. Calley Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - POTABLE WATER SUPPLY (Sec.6,Ch.4) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION VI CHAPTER 5 APOLLO COMMAND AND SERVICE MODULE AND LUNAR MODULE ENVIRONMENTAL CONTROL SYSTEMS by James C. Brady Donald F. Hughes Frank H. Samonski, Jr. Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center Roger W. Young David M. Browne The Boeing Aerospace Company BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - APOLLO COMMAND AND SERVICE MODULE AND LUNAR MODULE ENVIRONMENTAL CONTROL SYSTEMS (Sec.6,Ch.5) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION VI CHAPTER 6 EXTRAVEHICULAR MOBILITY UNIT by Maurice A. Carson Michael N. Rouen Charles C. Lutz James W. McBarron, II Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - EXTRAVEHICULAR MOBILITY UNIT (Sec.6,Ch.6) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION VII CHAPTER 1 SUMMARY AND CONCLUSIONS by Lawrence F. Dietlein, M.D. Lyndon B. Johnson Space Center BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - SUMMARY AND CONCLUSIONS (Sec.7,Ch.1) BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO SECTION VII CHAPTER 2 PERSPECTIVES ON APOLLO by Charles A. Berry, M.D.[*] President, The University of Texas Health Science Center at Houston BIOMEDICAL RESULTS OF APOLLO - PERSPECTIVES ON APOLLO (Sec.7,Ch.2) For other related sources: NASA Documents Online |