So what experts are there, who you believe in?

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President Josiah Bartlet: Sweden has a 100% literacy rate. 100%! How do they do that?
Leo McGarry: Maybe they don't and they can't add.

You make me curious. Do you mean that there are things about the Moon landings and the journeys there would violate the laws of nature? In what way would they do that? What fake materials are you referring to?

It is such a well established fact that the Moon landings did occur, that those who do not believe have the burden of proof. They should at least make it plausible that the Moon landings never happened. So far, I have never came across any evidence making this plausible in any way.

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President Josiah Bartlet: Sweden has a 100% literacy rate. 100%! How do they do that?
Leo McGarry: Maybe they don't and they can't add.

I believe scientists, not pilots. Leonov is just a pilot.

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Please watch this:


Shocking video of results of Georgian attack on South Osetia
CNN is spreading propaganda!
American witness: "Not only Georgia, but also U.S. are responsible for the violence in South Ossetia"
Mark Almond: It's simplistic to cast Russia as sole villain in South Ossetia clashes

I only mean what those very well made films and reports are saying (I went through a big pile of materials some years ago - I am a professor of natural sciences). Here are just some points which I remember:

- Its is impossible for a man to go to the van Allen radiation zone without thick led layer around ... in the moon the radiation is just killing.
- It is not possible to land to the moon with a lander which has one big booster and tiny jets to balance it. On earth these kinds of experiments few months earlier failed even if the configuration was very different and much more stabile.
- The rocket booster should have created a major hole to the moon surface, terrible noise to the radio, and the dust should have partly covered the lander ... there are no sign on these in the pictures and tapes.
- the stars should have been striking as there is no atmosphere - none are visible in the images.
- You cannot use the Swedish Hasselblad in space, where the temperature is plus/minus 140 C depending on the postposition. There are no known film materials which could do this (Kodak may disagree, but nobody knows what they could be). Also video technology would not have worked there.
- There are some materials which have not been released by purpose to public. One is the video showing how they faked the descending earth on the way to moon - they just filmed the window of the capsule...then they by accident turned the lights on and the trick was revealed.
- The pictures have several anomalies like crossing shadows and illumiated shadow places (several light sources).
- In one film the US flag starts to violently flutter without any reason ... however, there is no wind in the moon ... no atmosphere.
- There is a video from the moon showing the lander flying back up. There is no exhaust at all (should be enormous) and the video is following the capsule even if there was nobody left and there is long delay in the ground control transmission.
- There are similar places in pictures taken from different locations indicating that same background lanscape were used.
- There is a moon landscape visible in the Area 51 and some moon pictures indicate that the big "moon globe" prepared in NASA was used as a background (somebody has seen image borders there).
- If you show the videos with 2x speed, you will see very familiar movements what we have used to see (eye is very sensitive here).

... and so on

This is the famous film and some people say it is a serious one (probably the director himself did not believe in what he was told ... and made jokes to smooth the situation). Do you believe that the most important experts (Kissinger, Rumsfelt, Haig, astronauts, etc) could have participated to joke of a French film maker?
Free Movies & Documentaries - Dark Side of the Moon (2002)

Earth-found moon rocks are distinguishable from the real thing because those actually brought back from the moon still have the micro-impacts of minute impacts on the surface of the moon. On earth these micro-impacts don't occur due to the atmosphere and the original micro-impacts that happened when the rock was still on the moon have eroded away during the time spent in the Antarctic ice. This constitutes a litmus test for the finding place of moon rocks. I'm not aware of any anomalous data in this context. If you have a credible source here, please share.

I don't know the film you're referring to. Could you give a list of the participating experts ?

What aspect of a moonlanding would constitute a violation of the laws of nature and which laws specifically ? It's actually a fairly simple trip in that regard (although definitely an impressive feat back in 1969).
Edit : Scuse me, you addressed that in the above post.

Independent scientists, I couldn't agree more, but as for the media, I see very little independence there, be it from governmental or corporate influence.

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"Say not, 'When I have free time I shall study'; for you may perhaps never have any free time"
Hillel the Elder

You should have visited the home page of the authors of the movie :
Point du Jour - Programmes

Just a quote:

__________________
"Say not, 'When I have free time I shall study'; for you may perhaps never have any free time"
Hillel the Elder

I gave this reference to you in my post No: 96 here.

This is an independent critical review of the movie. But I have seen several similar documents (e.g. the Fox document) and also comments that this French film is a serious one, but the director did not take the risk to look serious ... he was shocked.

In any case, this is an example how people can be misslead - to a direction or another.

quote:
A documentary intrigue, a subtle blend of facts, fiction and hypothesis, around an event that marked the 20th century: the landing on the moon.
What if it’s all been a big hoax triggered by the race of the two super-powers to be the first to conquer the moon ? What if there have been no “live transmissions” from the moon – as many claim? The progress of film and television technology has made it possible to manipulate images without it being obvious. Even the use of archive pictures is no guarantee for authenticity since they can be used to substantiate very different “facts”. How can the spectator KNOW what he watches?

Please read this:
MAD Scientist: The Van Allen Belts and Travel to the Moon

Why would it be impossible ? It is rocket science but all very basic stuff. Newton would've understood it with 17th century knowledge.

Noise ?? In a vacuum ? Are you a professor in the natural sciences of Star Wars ? Just kidding. You must know that sound needs a medium to propagate in.

For this I would have to see the pictures. Got a link ?

I'll have a look at that.

__________________
"Say not, 'When I have free time I shall study'; for you may perhaps never have any free time"
Hillel the Elder

OK, but which scientists?

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President Josiah Bartlet: Sweden has a 100% literacy rate. 100%! How do they do that?
Leo McGarry: Maybe they don't and they can't add.

So you do not believe in any photographies taken in space?

Hasselblad in Space

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President Josiah Bartlet: Sweden has a 100% literacy rate. 100%! How do they do that?
Leo McGarry: Maybe they don't and they can't add.

Ah...a moon landing conspiracy thread!

I thought there had to be at least one of those on this board.

Okay, I'll hop in: I'm a believer.

Fine, yes, it's possible it was a hoax.

But I think it did happen.

The Parkes Radio Telescope in Australia played a key role in transmitting the TV signals during the Apollo 11 mission. Here is a refereed scientific paper in the Publications of the Astronomical Society of Australia.

On Eagle's Wings: The Story of the Parkes Apollo 11 Support

I saw the Dark Side of the Moon documentary. As it has already been stated here, the Point du Jour producers aimed to demonstrate that it was possible to fake any news story. But the fake story in this case was not the Moon landing; it was the hoax revelation.

It sure seems as if we are all living in Plato’s cave, though…

Tethys

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-- Harry S. Truman

American, french or russian, that's doesn't matter. I have already said that soviet/russian scientists during USSR never openly hesitated that americans visited moon. That was accepted as fact by society, it was printed in books, in encyclopedias, school texbooks, etc...

That was american scientists that casted doubt on american moonlanding.

__________________
Please watch this:


Shocking video of results of Georgian attack on South Osetia
CNN is spreading propaganda!
American witness: "Not only Georgia, but also U.S. are responsible for the violence in South Ossetia"
Mark Almond: It's simplistic to cast Russia as sole villain in South Ossetia clashes

>So you do not believe in any photographies taken in space?

The head designer of Hasselblad did not believe in the moon pictures shown - he was interviewed in one of the documentary films. Usually the space photographs are taking from inside of the space ships where the temperature is within the limits of the camera and film (+/- 30 C).

>Noise ?? In a vacuum ?

There was no vacuum in the moon lander - the materials and the air inside would have conducted the terrible noise to the radio, but if you download the recording, where they finally say that the engine was shut down, you don't hear anything.

>It is rocket science but all very basic stuff.

It is easy to launch a rocket up but go down is difficult. Imagine a fireworks rocket - up it goes well, but if you would put weight to the sides and above the mouthpiece in order to get it down, that would be imbalanced - this exactly happened to the test version of the lander (Armstrong was close to be killed but evacuated).

WONDER HOW THEY TOOK THIS...

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From toxic waste to the unpronounceables on your food labels, chemicals are all around and within us......

I agree, MilleVanille.

By 1969, the Soviet Union had a decade’s experience with sending robotic missions to the Moon with the Luna and Zond programs. They also had an array of surveillance equipment in operation. This means they had the capacity to track the Apollo 11 mission. Further, a circumlunar Zond orbiter mission took place in August 1969, part of the mission being to gather colour photographs.

NSSDC Master Catalog Display: Spacecraft

I know that the conspiracy theorists will argue that behind-the-scene deals were done to buy the Soviet Union's silence. It is true that high-deception and propaganda are part of the world of politics. But it seems implausible to me that such a grand-scale conspiracy could have occurred. Did the Australian scientists and technicians involved in the relay of the TV signal also take part in the conspiracy?

As MilleVanille says, there was never any question voiced in any Soviet publications or by any scientists or other officials as to the veracity of the Americans landing on the Moon. And there were none here either.

I had the chance of being in the Soviet Union in 1975, at the time of the Apollo-Soyuz link-up. I followed with deep interests both the US and USSR space programs. Everyone was enthralled and displayed respect and admiration for both the achievements of the USSR and those of the USA.


There's another point I would like to make. Like many others, I am critical of many aspects of US foreign policy. But when it comes to US achievements in science and technology, and in particular in space research and exploration, I am in awe. More than 40 years since John F. Kennedy made his “Moon speech”, though I was too young at the time to take notice, I am spellbound by his words. They encapsulated the essential American spirit that I love and admire. And I think the Moon landing remains the single most inspirational event in our history.

I was glad when the confirmation came this week of the plan to resume the Moon program. Such projects offer hope to the world and show the US as a nation worthy of our respect. This is what US leadership should be about.

So it is sad to see people trying to disprove it happened, and finding “explanations” for any arguments that don’t fit the conspiracy claim.

Tethys

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-- Harry S. Truman