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  #196 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009
Secretary of State

 
Member Since: Dec 2004
Location: AKRON
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Re: Constitutional Law: "To Provide for the Common Defense and General Welfare"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chocobot View Post
Who is the 'you' here?

Lemme guess, the 'guv'mnt' right??
No, the people who control the government.
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  #197 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009
Chocobot's Avatar
Secretary of State

 
Member Since: Jun 2008
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Re: Constitutional Law: "To Provide for the Common Defense and General Welfare"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Norrin Radd View Post
No, the people who control the government.
Who are?
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Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if Labor had not first existed. Labor is superior to capital, and deserves much the higher consideration.

Guess who?
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  #198 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009
Secretary of State

 
Member Since: Dec 2004
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Re: Constitutional Law: "To Provide for the Common Defense and General Welfare"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chocobot View Post
Who are?
I have been through this before. There is no single group. Many groups have their fingers in the pie. From the CFR, Trilateral Commission, Military Industrial Complex, Insurance companies, Drug companies/Medical industry, but mostly the banks, the foundations and the "old money." The bankers who had their son, or daughter many another banker and they have so many trusts that the family will be rich forever. It is estimated the Rockefellers have over 200 trusts.

These people all overlap in groups like the CFR, Trilateral Commission and the Bilderbergs. They make their deals, some secret, some not and sway public opinion, as well as manipulate government officials, to steer the country towards their goals. Not all of them have the same goals, but many of the powerful all support world government, as they know if they can get world government entrenched, while they are still in power, it will be almost impossible to ever have their power challenged again.
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  #199 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009
htperr6565's Avatar
Secretary of Defense
The voice of doom

 
Member Since: Mar 2007
Location: The Glorious Southlands of the United States
Posts: 3,457

United_States     Georgia_state

Re: Constitutional Law: "To Provide for the Common Defense and General Welfare"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Norrin Radd View Post
I have been through this before. There is no single group. Many groups have their fingers in the pie. From the CFR, Trilateral Commission, Military Industrial Complex, Insurance companies, Drug companies/Medical industry, but mostly the banks, the foundations and the "old money." The bankers who had their son, or daughter many another banker and they have so many trusts that the family will be rich forever. It is estimated the Rockefellers have over 200 trusts.

These people all overlap in groups like the CFR, Trilateral Commission and the Bilderbergs. They make their deals, some secret, some not and sway public opinion, as well as manipulate government officials, to steer the country towards their goals. Not all of them have the same goals, but many of the powerful all support world government, as they know if they can get world government entrenched, while they are still in power, it will be almost impossible to ever have their power challenged again.
So when does the Illuminati and Adam Weishupt come in the night to castrate me and suck my knowledge of truth (which i got from you) right out of my very brain?

Hahah just kidding. You remind me of myself in middle school. I believed all that crap. and how old are you?
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  #200 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009
htperr6565's Avatar
Secretary of Defense
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Re: Constitutional Law: "To Provide for the Common Defense and General Welfare"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Norrin Radd View Post

Unemployment, welfare, ADC, subsidized housing, food stamps, SSI, Medicaid, all of these things are chains around our necks. We are becoming dependent on the government and eventually that power will be abused. It is only a matter of time. IT IS HUMAN NATURE.



BRILLIANT!
you apparently know absolutely nothing about unemployment
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  #201 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009
Secretary of State

 
Member Since: Jun 2005
Location: San Francisco Bay Area
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Re: Constitutional Law: "To Provide for the Common Defense and General Welfare"

Hey, Norrin, you finally explained clearly and in your own words and in a single paragraph what you mean about a conspiracy that controls the government. Now that I see it, I find you mean nothing except the excessive influence on the government by rich capitalists. Well, well. I actually agree with you about that.

However, the problem is that you get this all mixed up with a lot of other crap. Like your fixation on world government, or your desire to return to the government of pre-Civil War days, and now this demographic shift where the white race will cease to be a U.S. majority. (As if that was a concern.)

But here's the thing. The control of rich capitalists over the government isn't as total as you're suggesting, and many of the things that you're blaming on them actually represent times when they were defeated or had to compromise. A perfect example is Roosevelt's New Deal, especially the Second New Deal. You see this as the manipulation of the capitalists because you see their goal as big government, but it isn't, big government is only a means to an end, and it can work against them as easily as for them. On that occasion it did: it changed the rules to raise wages, raise taxes on the rich, and in general make most people freer than before, by making them less dependent on their employers. A lot of the rich in this country HOWLED when these moves were put through. The most enlightened among them did not, recognizing that the system was in peril and if it were to be saved at all, some reform was necessary.

How did that happen? Public action and awareness, showing that the government is accountable to the people as long as the people are paying attention. It's unfortunate that it took the Great Depression to make people pay attention, but that's the way it is, and it's WHY, throughout history, some elite of big shots has always called the shots their own way most of the time.
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  #202 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009
Secretary of State

 
Member Since: Dec 2004
Location: AKRON
Posts: 4,679

   
Re: Constitutional Law: "To Provide for the Common Defense and General Welfare"

Quote:
Originally Posted by htperr6565 View Post
So when does the Illuminati and Adam Weishupt come in the night to castrate me and suck my knowledge of truth (which i got from you) right out of my very brain?

Hahah just kidding. You remind me of myself in middle school. I believed all that crap. and how old are you?
I am 46 and I never believed any of this stuff until I did my OWN RESEARCH.

You are free to believe what you want. For me, I will accept what Senator Barry Goldwater told us, what Congressmen Larry McDonald told us, what Reece Committee heads Dodd and Wormser told us, as well as what Rear Admiral Chester Ward told us. As far as I know, Admiral Chester Ward is the only person to quit the CFR.
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  #203 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009
Secretary of State

 
Member Since: Jun 2006
Location: US, California - federalist
Posts: 5,339

   
Re: Constitutional Law: "To Provide for the Common Defense and General Welfare"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pogo View Post
I'll try again. How would you propose to protect the poor from the rich?
Unemployment compensation, at-will, that complies with at-will employment doctrine and state at-will employment laws.

You welcome to read the short story Life in the Iron Mills by Rebecca Harding Davis concerning truer forms of Capitalism during the Industrial Revolution.

Quote:
Quote:
The story’s protagonist stirs molten metal in a vast foundry beside the Ohio River. On his breaks he makes statues from a waste product of iron smelting. One of his pieces, a statue of a woman, is noticed by some bourgeois visitors who discuss the work condescendingly and awaken Hugh’s sense of natural rights. They raise his hopes but offer no concrete help, and Hugh makes a series of bad decisions that lead to tragedy. Meanwhile, the statue is kept by the narrator as a reminder of Hugh, his aspirations, and his achievements.
Quote:
The story is emphatically on the side of the exploited industrial workers, who are presented as physically stunted and mentally dulled but fully human and capable of tragedy.

The story is said to reflect a capitalist society.

It is also one of the first American Realist novellas written.
Source: Life in the Iron Mills - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Last edited by danielpalos; 07-15-2009 at 12:41 PM.
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  #204 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009
Secretary of State

 
Member Since: Dec 2004
Location: AKRON
Posts: 4,679

   
Re: Constitutional Law: "To Provide for the Common Defense and General Welfare"

Quote:
Originally Posted by TSGracchus View Post
Hey, Norrin, you finally explained clearly and in your own words and in a single paragraph what you mean about a conspiracy that controls the government. Now that I see it, I find you mean nothing except the excessive influence on the government by rich capitalists. Well, well. I actually agree with you about that.

However, the problem is that you get this all mixed up with a lot of other crap. Like your fixation on world government, or your desire to return to the government of pre-Civil War days, and now this demographic shift where the white race will cease to be a U.S. majority. (As if that was a concern.)

But here's the thing. The control of rich capitalists over the government isn't as total as you're suggesting, and many of the things that you're blaming on them actually represent times when they were defeated or had to compromise. A perfect example is Roosevelt's New Deal, especially the Second New Deal. You see this as the manipulation of the capitalists because you see their goal as big government, but it isn't, big government is only a means to an end, and it can work against them as easily as for them. On that occasion it did: it changed the rules to raise wages, raise taxes on the rich, and in general make most people freer than before, by making them less dependent on their employers. A lot of the rich in this country HOWLED when these moves were put through. The most enlightened among them did not, recognizing that the system was in peril and if it were to be saved at all, some reform was necessary.

How did that happen? Public action and awareness, showing that the government is accountable to the people as long as the people are paying attention. It's unfortunate that it took the Great Depression to make people pay attention, but that's the way it is, and it's WHY, throughout history, some elite of big shots has always called the shots their own way most of the time.
I simplified it. There is much more to it, as many of these groups overlap. The foundations took control of US education policy after WWI, solidifying that control after WWII. Dodd and Wormser both told us so as did a few others.

If I remember correctly, you have read both Norman Dodd's interview and his testimony on Regionalism, but do you belive what he had to tell us?

NORMAN DODD: That effect was to orient our educational system away from support of the principles embodied in the Declaration of Independence and implemented in the Constitution; and the task now was the orientation of education away from these briefly stated principles and self-evident truths. That's what had been the effect of the wealth, which constituted the endowments of those foundations that had been in existence over the largest portion of this span of 50 years, and holding them responsible for this change. What we were able to bring forward, what we uncovered, was the determination of these large endowed foundations, through their trustees, to actually get control over the content of American education.

Well, they could say it, Mr. Griffin, but they had to have something in the way of a rationalization of their decision to do everything they could to stop the completion of this investigation in the directions that it was moving, which would have been an exposure of this Carnegie Endowment story and the Ford Foundation and the Guggenheim and the Rockefeller Foundation, all working in harmony toward the control of education in the United States.


Do you believe this statement?
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  #205 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009
htperr6565's Avatar
Secretary of Defense
The voice of doom

 
Member Since: Mar 2007
Location: The Glorious Southlands of the United States
Posts: 3,457

United_States     Georgia_state

Re: Constitutional Law: "To Provide for the Common Defense and General Welfare"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Norrin Radd View Post

Do you believe this statement?
only if the Illuminati won't kill me....
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  #206 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009
Secretary of State

 
Member Since: Dec 2004
Location: AKRON
Posts: 4,679

   
Re: Constitutional Law: "To Provide for the Common Defense and General Welfare"

Quote:
Originally Posted by htperr6565 View Post
you apparently know absolutely nothing about unemployment
I have known dozens of people in my life who worked as little as possible until they fulfilled their unemployment requirement and then would take unemployment, for as long as was allowed, rarely ever looking for a job, milking that unemployment while often times working side jobs for cash.

Dozens of people and I am not even in the construction industry. It's not right. It is WRONG. It is unfair, unjust and unconstitutional.
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  #207 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009
Secretary of State

 
Member Since: Jun 2005
Location: San Francisco Bay Area
Posts: 5,221

   
Re: Constitutional Law: "To Provide for the Common Defense and General Welfare"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Norrin Radd View Post
Do you believe this statement?
No. Having two daughters who graduated from public school within the past year, I am too aware of the fact that what he said happened didn't happen, and therefore I have no reason even to consider what he said about why it happened. It's a reason for an event that never took place.
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  #208 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009
htperr6565's Avatar
Secretary of Defense
The voice of doom

 
Member Since: Mar 2007
Location: The Glorious Southlands of the United States
Posts: 3,457

United_States     Georgia_state

Re: Constitutional Law: "To Provide for the Common Defense and General Welfare"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Norrin Radd View Post
I am 46
Geesh. and it has never occurred to you that the trilateral commission and the buildmeaburger's are figments of conspiracy theorists imagination?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Norrin Radd View Post
and I never believed any of this stuff until I did my OWN RESEARCH.
Funny, because I believed that stuff until I did my own research.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Norrin Radd View Post
You are free to believe what you want. For me, I will accept what Senator Barry Goldwater told us, what Congressmen Larry McDonald told us, what Reece Committee heads Dodd and Wormser told us, as well as what Rear Admiral Chester Ward told us. As far as I know, Admiral Chester Ward is the only person to quit the CFR.
You will accept these opinions not because you know they are verified and correct, but because they offer your simple mind a simple explanation of world events, and these opinions empower you to work towards an intellectual cause. Unfortunately for you, this cause is mythology.

Gee, five congressman speak of a bogeyman that pulls the strings behind the scenes, it must be true, eh?
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Last edited by htperr6565; 07-15-2009 at 12:48 PM.
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  #209 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009
Secretary of State

 
Member Since: Jun 2005
Location: San Francisco Bay Area
Posts: 5,221

   
Re: Constitutional Law: "To Provide for the Common Defense and General Welfare"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Norrin Radd View Post
I have known dozens of people in my life who worked as little as possible until they fulfilled their unemployment requirement and then would take unemployment, for as long as was allowed, rarely ever looking for a job, milking that unemployment while often times working side jobs for cash.

Dozens of people and I am not even in the construction industry. It's not right. It is WRONG. It is unfair, unjust and unconstitutional.
It's certainly not unconstitutional; you need to learn the difference between that word and "unfair" and "unjust."

I agree that this sort of gaming the system is unfair and unjust, but not nearly as unfair or unjust as abolishing unemployment compensation would be.
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  #210 (permalink)  
Old 07-15-2009
htperr6565's Avatar
Secretary of Defense
The voice of doom

 
Member Since: Mar 2007
Location: The Glorious Southlands of the United States
Posts: 3,457

United_States     Georgia_state

Re: Constitutional Law: "To Provide for the Common Defense and General Welfare"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Norrin Radd View Post
I have known dozens of people in my life who worked as little as possible until they fulfilled their unemployment requirement and then would take unemployment, for as long as was allowed, rarely ever looking for a job, milking that unemployment while often times working side jobs for cash.

Dozens of people and I am not even in the construction industry. It's not right. It is WRONG. It is unfair, unjust and unconstitutional.
i was getting more at the source of unemployment funds, which do not come from the government in the same way as welfare, etc., as you implied.

the government merely administrates the distribution of the funds, which used to be a private enterprise. Private unemployment firms were a little too good at denying people their claims.

but hey, the bilderbergers want it to be there to weaken capitalism so they can suck america dry, right?

and you couldn't dream of successfully explaining how unemployment programs are 'unconstitutional'

You will probably say something like "madison didn't mention unemployment, ergo its unconstitutional.
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