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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2009
fishjoel's Avatar
Secretary of Defense

 
Member Since: May 2009
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 2,241

United_States     Pennsylvania

Re: Fidelity and the Oath of Office.

Quote:
Originally Posted by reality View Post
so now you want to accuse with no evidence. great.
Never accused anyone of anything. But suggesting that certain politicians didn't do anything shiesty because they didn't get caught in a scandal is naive.
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2009
Secretary of Defense

 
Member Since: Aug 2008
Location: Hohenwald
Posts: 2,187

United_States     Tennessee

Re: Fidelity and the Oath of Office.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CDavidNeely View Post
Greetings and Felicitations,



I don't think its based on a cynical view of marriage but in a cynical view of politics. In common life I would say you are correct with regards to the number of people who get married because they love each other. However, we are talking about politics and the pursuit of power. How many people marry for appearance and connection as opposed to because they actually like the person they married.

To the person walking the paths of power a wife is something you show off to other people and your children are tools to use to your advantage. You don't have to have any deep feelings for any of them.

Sincerely Yours,
C. David Neely
In Mark Sanford's career, Jenny has been far more than "something you show off to other people." To start with, she is independently wealthy--far wealthier than he will ever be. Her grandfather invented the Skilsaw and founded the company which supplies such tools to millions of carpenters, craftsmen, hobbyists, and homeowners today. After graduation from Georgetown, Jenny went to work for a Wall Street investment firm, Lazard Freres. She was a vice-president in charge of training when Mark joined the firm. To a great extent she was both his teacher and the manager of his successful career there. After their marriage and Mark's subsequent return to South Carolina and his entry into politics, she has been both his campaign manager and his closest political adviser at every step.

Jenny Sanford is a supremely capable and experienced woman, and tough as nails. If Mark succeeds in arousing her enmity, she will almost certainly undo him--both personally and politically.
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2009
fishjoel's Avatar
Secretary of Defense

 
Member Since: May 2009
Location: Pennsylvania
Posts: 2,241

United_States     Pennsylvania

Re: Fidelity and the Oath of Office.

I suppose CDavidNeely has a point, when it comes to marriage in regards to politicians. Maybe there are a lot of them that do it for political reasons. How about his children then? Or Clinton's daughter and so on and so forth? They are definitely the innocent victims of this kind of thing.
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A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul.
- George Bernard Shaw
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2009
WharfedaleTiger's Avatar
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Social Democrat

 
Member Since: Jan 2008
Location: Yorkshire/England
Posts: 2,353
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England     European_Union

Re: Fidelity and the Oath of Office.

In terms of making someone unfit for office, I don't think adultery should be a impeachable offense (or an offence at all). It dosn't affect someones ability to do their job and it dosn't prevent someone from doing the right thing at the right time. It dosn't automatically make someone untrustworthy or a bad person.

That said, it is also a stain on someones character, particually if you come out as strongly against it as this guy has. It isn't an honourable or good action but without knowing the circumstances I can't really judge how morally this guy acted. Anyways, the voters will decide on it and it will inevitably harm him.
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2009
President

 
Member Since: Jul 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 18,069

United_States     Russian

Re: Fidelity and the Oath of Office.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fishjoel View Post
(Hope this is in the right forum)

I was just thinking about the Sanford deal and how it effects his ability to hold office. We have come to find out that there were other girls as well. Cheating on your spouse is a huge betrayal of trust. This is done to someone in which they loved enough to marry.
You don't need to love someone to marry.
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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2009
President

 
Member Since: Jul 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 18,069

United_States     Russian

Re: Fidelity and the Oath of Office.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fishjoel View Post
I don't think you're understanding what I'm saying. His oath of office says nothing about him or any other official cheating on their spouse. It's the fact that he cheated on someone that he cared about and did something harmful to her and their kids. If they can cheat their families they can cheat you, the voter.
You're assuming that everyone cares about their families more than they care about all the voters put together.
Quote:
You have a pretty cynical view of marriage. The percent of people who get married that don't love or care for each other is very small, imo. Now, they may lose those feelings later but it would be up to them to do the honest thing and get a divorce and not be an oath breaker. Maybe they still do care but got caught up in the moment or let their feelings go down avenues that shouldn't be taken.

Point is, you aren't as important as their family is to them. So what's stopping them from cheating you?
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2009
President

 
Member Since: Jul 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 18,069

United_States     Russian

Re: Fidelity and the Oath of Office.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Commodore View Post
Last I knew, adultery is a court-martial level offense under the Uniform Code of Military Justice.

Shouldn't the President, as Commander-in-Chief of the Armed Forces, and Governors, and Commander-in-Chief of the State National Guard, be held to the same standard?

I never thought I be glad that Spitzer was caught doing something illegal, so we could be rid of them.
First of all, that's stupid. Second, I don't think stupid rules should be applied here. Third, the CinC is not a member of the military.
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2009
President

 
Member Since: Jul 2005
Location: USA
Posts: 18,069

United_States     Russian

Re: Fidelity and the Oath of Office.

The way I see it, the pols get married in part because they know that dumbasses get married. Dumbasses like it when people act like them. Sort of the "have a drink with him" type of mentality. And a dumbass's vote is worth just as much as anyone else's vote. Dumbasses also tend to think that marriage = good (sometimes even if they are not married, but think it's a good idea). And since smart folks realize that "married" does not equal "good leader," they figure they can catch more fish by being married.
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2009
Commodore's Avatar
Secretary of Defense
Nationalist

 
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Location: Upstate New York, USA
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New_York     Earth

Re: Fidelity and the Oath of Office.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TSGracchus View Post
The president is not a member of the armed services. The military is under civilian control. The president is the main civilian authority over the military. (I seem to recall Clinton using the same bogus argument in a completely different context. He was wrong, too.)
It's not a matter of him being a member of the military, its a matter of him setting an example to the men he commands.
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old 07-02-2009
Secretary of State

 
Member Since: Jun 2005
Location: San Francisco Bay Area
Posts: 5,221

   
Re: Fidelity and the Oath of Office.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Commodore View Post
It's not a matter of him being a member of the military, its a matter of him setting an example to the men he commands.
As a matter of law, it IS about him being a member of the military, which he isn't.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 07-03-2009
Town Council Member

 
Member Since: Jun 2009
Location: houston,texas
Posts: 112

United_States     Louisiana

Re: Fidelity and the Oath of Office.

It is easy to say Sanford is a hypocrite, if he broke the law he should be prosecuted( I doubt he did). I do hope that he shuts up for the sake of his family, they certainly don't deserve this. I think it is strange to base his wothiness for the job based on his marriage. The big message here, We need to get out of each others bedrooms, period.
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 07-03-2009
Joint Chiefs of Staff Member

 
Member Since: Dec 2008
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,817

   
Re: Fidelity and the Oath of Office.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheHighForester View Post
In Mark Sanford's career, Jenny has been far more than "something you show off to other people." To start with, she is independently wealthy--far wealthier than he will ever be. Her grandfather invented the Skilsaw and founded the company which supplies such tools to millions of carpenters, craftsmen, hobbyists, and homeowners today. After graduation from Georgetown, Jenny went to work for a Wall Street investment firm, Lazard Freres. She was a vice-president in charge of training when Mark joined the firm. To a great extent she was both his teacher and the manager of his successful career there. After their marriage and Mark's subsequent return to South Carolina and his entry into politics, she has been both his campaign manager and his closest political adviser at every step.

Jenny Sanford is a supremely capable and experienced woman, and tough as nails. If Mark succeeds in arousing her enmity, she will almost certainly undo him--both personally and politically.

so shes a sugermama that he's used to catapult himself into the realms of power.
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 07-03-2009
Secretary of Defense

 
Member Since: Aug 2008
Location: Hohenwald
Posts: 2,187

United_States     Tennessee

Re: Fidelity and the Oath of Office.

Quote:
Originally Posted by reality View Post
so shes a sugermama that he's used to catapult himself into the realms of power.
I didn't describe a "sugermama"--I described Jenny Sanford. Think of a woman as smart and as ambitious as Hillary Clinton, but with more money and more class.
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 07-03-2009
Joint Chiefs of Staff Member

 
Member Since: Dec 2008
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,817

   
Re: Fidelity and the Oath of Office.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheHighForester View Post
I didn't describe a "sugermama"--I described Jenny Sanford. Think of a woman as smart and as ambitious as Hillary Clinton, but with more money and more class.
right but he used her like a sugermama. he used her money and influence to catapult himself into power. by your own admission without a shit ton of her influence and cash as well as advice he'd have fuck all. So he married her to tie himself to her. Sugermama. a classy, smart sugermama, but a sugermama still.
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 07-03-2009
Secretary of Defense

 
Member Since: Aug 2008
Location: Hohenwald
Posts: 2,187

United_States     Tennessee

Re: Fidelity and the Oath of Office.

Quote:
Originally Posted by reality View Post
right but he used her like a sugermama. he used her money and influence to catapult himself into power. by your own admission without a shit ton of her influence and cash as well as advice he'd have fuck all. So he married her to tie himself to her. Sugermama. a classy, smart sugermama, but a sugermama still.
I will say that your perception is limited.

And I will say no more.
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