This argument still doesn't hold up. There isn't any way that sentient life, which by the nature of the observable universe exists in insignificant quantities to affect that existence, is critical in any way. Even if you limit your perception to our immediate solar system humans are so small in comparison that we might as well not exist at all. A relatively small piece of astronomical debris is enough to completely obliterate our existence and the universe wouldn't notice at all. The only way you can think we of any importance is to completely ignore the evidence that surrounds you. It is our ego's that tell us we must be important because we feel important.
In 2008 there was a gamma ray burst so strong that if we had been hit by it everyone here would have died. It originated 7.5 billion light years away. If we had been in its path we would have died and there wouldn't be anything to show our existence but a burned out hust of a planet orbiting a somewhat lackluster star in an insignificant arm of the Milky Way. No warning. No chance to avoid. No chance to prepare. No chance to survive.

Blinding Gamma Ray Burst Was Directed at Earth | Universe Today

So much for our significance.

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Ah, ignore the source and continue to talk about other things that are more convenient. That's fine, I know you can't address that reality.

Yeah, Christianity is just holding us back. Newton was an ignorant slob. I also don't believe you don't hate it from everything you've said. The only rational thing to do would be hate it, if you actually buy into everything you're saying.

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A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul.
- George Bernard Shaw

Well, I'm not saying we are effecting the Universe in any measurable quantity or quality. The stuff I'm talking about isn't measurable.

Also, I'm not trying to logically argue my position. I hold my position as a position faith, not something logical. My position stems from a belief in a creator God who is loving (both of which I will acknowledge as illogical). If one doesn't hold those beliefs, it's perfectly consistent to hold your position.

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"A dog barks when his master is attacked. I would be a coward if I saw that God's truth is attacked and yet would remain silent."
-John Calvin

Of course, I can. How can you judge the source when you don't have reliable data about the source. The Bible has been rewritten and rewritten. The Council of Nicea picked and chose which versions of what books should be contained in the Bible. The story of Jesus varies from apostle to apostle. He did no writing of his own. There aren't any records from other people that chronicled his life. Considering the above data how else are you supposed to discover the meanings of his supposed teachings. You have to judge on the results his teaching and you judge the result of his teaching by those who follow him and their actions.

I think it amazing that he managed to achieve so much despite the fact that he was Christian. Imagine what he might have accomplished had he not spend so much time and effort on interpretation of the bible. You can't honestly deny that Christianity through history has been a force more for ignorance than enlightenment. Perhaps we should dig Galileo up and ask him? Perhaps we could ask any of the other great scientist who were restrained, put to death or otherwise blocked from discovery or releasing the things they had learned. Perhaps we could ask the Creationist who just last year tried to get creationism pushed into the education system as a viable alternative to evolution. I bet they're not real Christians either.

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I bet their not real Christians either.

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Democrats, finding new ways to destroy wealth for over 100 years.

Thank you very much for pointing out a spelling error. I fixed it. A spelling error is such a minor thing. It is good that you have such finely tuned arguments.

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You'd have a point if.....we were all using the same documentation. So it doesn't really fly. You can go to the store and buy the very same book that everyone else uses. Anything we know about Jesus comes from the same source. You can try and shake and shimmy all you want but the life and teachings of Jesus, as we all have them, do not support the things that you dislike about Christianity.

Yes, the Catholic Church did fear losing is power and dominion over every aspect of the people's life. I am not a fan of the Catholic Church. I'm not saying that they aren't real Christians but that they have added many beliefs that you can't find any support for. It's a hierarchal setup that I don't like. Regardless of that, there were many advancements that were brought about by Christians, Jews, and Muslims alike.

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A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul.
- George Bernard Shaw

What would be immoral or unethical in delegating a power to ensure republican forms of government to the UN? Natural and civil rights are usually only enforced by forms of State-ism according to their social contract.

Nothing, as far as I know, I just shy away from the centralization of too much power. Power is corrupting.

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A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul.
- George Bernard Shaw

And yet millions of people do find the things I have talked about as valid expressions of Christianity. They will argue with you face-to-face that your understanding is wrong and theirs is right. I was raised Southern Baptist. I didn't arise as an atheist from some primordial ooze. I was inundated in the culture and the things they believe. I know from personal experience how they would see your ideas about the bible. They will tell you to your face that the bible is absolutely true exactly as written. The earth is only a couple of thousand years old. God created the entire universe in exactly six human days. The universe and the world was made exactly in the order that the bible says without error.
Like many believers you make the mistake of thinking that I haven't read the bible because if I had read the bible then I would, of course, believe.

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Now you bring up other things that has nothing to do with what we are talking about. Move the goalpost much? I won't argue with them about whether the Bible is true or not or about the creation.

What I will argue with them about is if they do the many things you have written in past posts.

It's funny how you simply won't address the source of Christianity as you know it will completely crumble your entire argument, at it's base, everyone else can still see it. Go ahead and keep dodging what we have written on the life and ministry of Jesus though.

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A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul.
- George Bernard Shaw

I did address the "source."

In other words, without any other corroborating evidence than the bible for the "ministry" I judge it as nothing. As far as I am concerned the source was made up because the source doesn't have any supporting evidence. The only evidence for the "ministry of Jesus" is circumstantial. It's a fantasy of wishful thinking just like god is a fantasy of wishful thinking.

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I know, I admit it was childish, and petty of me, but you act as if you're so much smarter than everyone, I just couldn't resist.

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Democrats, finding new ways to destroy wealth for over 100 years.

There are secular writings of the time which corroborate the ministry of Jesus Christ. I guess archeological evidence doesn't count either.

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Democrats, finding new ways to destroy wealth for over 100 years.

No, you didn't. You blew smoke as everything you said, even if it were true, is irrelevant. Like I pointed out, what we have an know is all from one source. The Christians that behave in the ways that you despise are using the very same book that you used or that anyone uses if they go to the book store. It's all from one source. So, whether it is valid or not, isn't an issue as it doesn't change where we get our knowledge from.

So, I repeat, how did Jesus act and teach as compared to the practices of some Christians? Do you feel they are emulating and following the testimony of Jesus? Or do you feel they are placing their own beliefs and motivations on what they read? I think the answer is evident.

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A government which robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul.
- George Bernard Shaw