Thread: International Burn a Quran Day~

Originally Posted by snbl11225

The question is not the right to burn the Bible, Quran, American Flag, etc. I think that is a right that I would defend. The question is whether it is good judgment to do so. In this case, I think it is poor judgment and counterproductive. By the way, I am a Born Again Christian and I would no more burn the Quran than I would the Bible. I may disavow Islam but I would not disrespect the people. And most Islams are not terrorists.

Get used to it. Many conservatives (liberals too) in here automatically think that if you support the right of someone to burn the flag or burn a book, you automatically support it.

They can´t see the difference.

Originally Posted by Maddox

Get used to it. Many conservatives (liberals too) in here automatically think that if you support the right of someone to burn the flag or burn a book, you automatically support it.

They can´t see the difference.

Then again some people here think defending acting in good judgement as well as defending that rights come with responsibility somehow also means you automatically support being PC and weak in dealing with the enemy.

In this case here they also can't see the difference.

Originally Posted by MattInFla

A great piece on the Quran burning in the Orlando Sentinel:

Burn a Koran Day: Burned up over Terry Jones' notariety? Blame the media - OrlandoSentinel.com

The author hits it right on the head:

Well there it is. Amazing that freedom of the press is not a problem for Patraeus but freedom of expression is.

It appears that some people object to news coverage of this proposed event. It is the job of the free press to report the news and a book burning in the United States is news.


Concern for the troops has been voiced. While this is a potential problem (and this would in no way alter the rights question), it may not be as much so as is being implied.

Because the news media have been giving this coverage and there is a resulting backlash against the proposed action, the backlash itself undercuts the propaganda value of this (proposed) event to Al Qaeda and/or the Taliban.

The criticism of the proposed book burning has come from different levels of government (as well as other religious groups).

Even pastor’s old church condemns Quran-burning | The Upshot Yahoo! News - Yahoo! News

"It could endanger troops and it could endanger the overall effort," top commander in Afghanistan Gen. David Petraeus told the media. "It is precisely the kind of action the Taliban uses and could cause significant problems.

As "an act of patriotism," the media should not cover the burning, Secretary of State Hillary Clinton said. She also said, "It's regrettable that a pastor in Gainesville, Florida, with a church of no more than 50 people can make this outrageous and distressful, disgraceful plan, and get the world's attention":

The terrorist attacks of 9/11, says the Vatican, "cannot be counteracted by an outrageous and grave gesture against a book considered sacred by a religious community."

Attorney General Eric Holder called the plan "idiotic and dangerous."

Presumed presidential candidate Mitt Romney told Politico
"Burning the Quran is wrong on every level. It puts troops in danger, and it violates a founding principle of our republic."

"I do not think well of the idea of burning anybody's Koran, Bible, Book of Mormon or anything else," Mississippi Gov. Haley Barbour told reporters. "I don't think there is any excuse for it. I don't think it's a good idea."

"Any type of activity like that that puts our troops in harm's way would be a concern," White House spokesman Robert Gibbs said Tuesday.

"I appeal to people who are planning to burn the Quran to reconsider and drop their plans because they are inconsistent with American values and, as General Petraeus has warned, threatening to America's military," Connecticut Sen. Joe Lieberman said in a statement.

House Minority Leader John Boehner spoke out against the event, comparing it to the planned Islamic center near Ground Zero. "Well, listen, I just think it's not wise to do this in the face of what our country represents. ... Just because you have the right to do something in America, doesn't mean it's the right thing to do."

New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg called it "boneheaded and wrong" but said the protesters are protected by the First Amendment. "He has a right to do it," he said.

If the criticism is covered along side of coverage of the book burning itself (should it occur) in the Middle East, then the propaganda value, to those fighting American troops, of the book burning is diminished (possibly negated).

Originally Posted by snbl11225

It seems to me that we're so busy letting our frustrations/anger cloud our judgment that we have lost sight of what is important. While I don't argue that we have freedom of speech and expression in this country, and thus should have the right to burn a book, flag, etc., it is, in this instance, a stupid and counter productive action to take. The same same Constitution that provides for free speech also gives us the right to participate in whatever religion we choose. As a Born-Again Christian who has friends who are missionaries in countries who can be killed for even having a Bible I take that very seriously. You change people through your actions.
I'm tired of a nation that prides itself on it's freedoms, rights, beliefs, etc. and then is unwilling to extend them to those who do not profess those values then we obviously do not believe in the Declaration of Independence and the words contained within.

Damn right many Americans are angry and frustrated by Muslims! Some of us are more frustrated by the way our government kisses Muslim ass to avoid angering them.
We can't have prayer groups before the start of the school day, but we can install ritual foot washing stations in other schools. A cartoon with a likeness of Mohamed is inciteful, but a crucifix in a jar of piss is art. Burning qurans on the anniversary of 9/11 is a crazy and reckless and should be stopped, but our own military burns American soldiers' bibles in Afghanistan.
Me? I'm tired of a nation that continually infringes upon the rights of the majority to placate the minority.

Originally Posted by Ernie S.

but our own military burns American soldiers' bibles in Afghanistan.

You do realize that the bibles being burned in Afghanistan were not for the soldiers. They were written in two popular languages in Afghanistan and were designed to be used as mechanisms for conversion. They didn't round up every soldiers bible and burn it. The circumvented some church groups intent to try and convert the people of Afghanistan to Christianity in direct violation of the rules. You might want to remember that we aren't on a fucking holy crusade to convert.

The U.S. Military & The Afghan Language Bible Burning Controversy (Wizbang Blue)

Oh for the day when we finally evolve past this childish need for religion.

Originally Posted by CDavidNeely

You do realize that the bibles being burned in Afghanistan were not for the soldiers. They were written in two popular languages in Afghanistan and were designed to be used as mechanisms for conversion. They didn't round up every soldiers bible and burn it. The circumvented some church groups intent to try and convert the people of Afghanistan to Christianity in direct violation of the rules. You might want to remember that we aren't on a fucking holy crusade to convert.

The U.S. Military & The Afghan Language Bible Burning Controversy (Wizbang Blue)

Oh for the day when we finally evolve past this childish need for religion.

If that is truee it was stupid to try to pass out bibles in hopes of converting some of them.

So when you're "all grown up" you suddenly realize that you have no soul?

The real racism and lack of judgment is in everyone just assuming that Muslims will react violently to it. The President himself has even said it's going to happen.

And the funniest part is, many of the same people who believe this Koran burning will result in general violence insist that Muslims are peaceful and only the extremists are a problem.

Well, then we won't see much of an issue aside from the usual suspects when these Korans get burned. But really, it would be nice if someone would define who the usual suspects are and how many of them there are. Enough dancing around the issue of Islam itself. Either Muslims are as peaceful as everyone else, or they are not. They cannot be both depending on the political circumstances. They want to build a mosque, well, they are peaceful. Someone else wants to publish depictions of Mohammed in a Danish newspaper, and then we hear how that shouldn't be done(as opposed to the government funding an art project featuring Jesus in urine), because that will cause violence. Among Muslims. Who are peaceful.

Someone needs to start levelling with the American people about this issue, because right now everyone's drawing their own conclusions, and it's not working out favorably for Muslims.

Originally Posted by Ernie S.

We can't have prayer groups before the start of the school day, but we can install ritual foot washing stations in other schools.

You do realize that the school that was installing a foot washing station was a university and not a public school.

You do realize that students can have a prayer group before school if they want to. The school just can't do it.

In the United States, public schools are prohibited from sponsoring religious observances such as daily prayer. Prayer itself is not forbidden while at school. Regarding the Free Exercise Clause of the First Amendment, the courts have consistently ruled that students' expressions of religious views through prayer or otherwise cannot be abridged unless they can be shown to cause substantial disruption in the school.
School prayer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Maybe this will help you out a little more.
Prayer In School

O, the poor Christians. Always under the attack but always willing to suppress the rights of others.

Here are some nice people trying to get Fahrenheit 451 banned from school. Imagine that. Trying to get a book about banning/burning books banned.

YouTube - Religious nuts in Texas seek to ban book about book banning!

Or how about those good old fashioned Harry Potter book burnings.
Another Harry Potter book burning - HPANA

It is time to get off the persecution band wagon.

I'm also seeing on this thread people fearing that this will be usd to recruit everyday Muslims to Al Qaeda's ranks.

Um, no. A single church in Florida burning Korans is not going to convince a single Muslim not already prone to view Al Qaeda favorably that the WEst is waging a war against Islam.

REally, just how stupid and barbaric do you guys think Muslims are?

Originally Posted by chassisman

If that is truee it was stupid to try to pass out bibles in hopes of converting some of them.

So when you're "all grown up" you suddenly realize that you have no soul?

How old should you be when you stop believing in fairy tales?

Al Qaeda and the Taliban want to thank their Christian brothers for helping them recruit suicide bombers to slay the infidels.
Every burnt Koran is a new suicide bomber for the cause.

CAse in point. Is it really that easy to recruit everyday Muslims to the cause of jihad?

Originally Posted by CDavidNeely

You do realize that the bibles being burned in Afghanistan were not for the soldiers. They were written in two popular languages in Afghanistan and were designed to be used as mechanisms for conversion. They didn't round up every soldiers bible and burn it. The circumvented some church groups intent to try and convert the people of Afghanistan to Christianity in direct violation of the rules. You might want to remember that we aren't on a fucking holy crusade to convert.

The U.S. Military & The Afghan Language Bible Burning Controversy (Wizbang Blue)

Oh for the day when we finally evolve past this childish need for religion.

So we are there to prop up the same oppressive tyranny that was there?

Because we just decided that the burning of religious texts was offensive, ill advised, and moronic, but still protected speech. So if some citizens of Afghanistan want to, thats their purgative, but as a force in league with the Afghan government, thats not our role.

Clearly those attempting to proselytize to the Afghans in the name of Christ are truly in a hurry to meet their God, but it is not the role of the US military, who has sworn to defend and uphold the Constitution to interfere, and its bad policy to support the Afghan government in such endevours.

There is a reason radical Islam is trying to blackmail us into building a mosque near Ground Zero, and a radical backlash by the Koran burning preacher, we are not willing defend and uphold our own values and culture.