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2011 USPOL Most Valuable Poster (MVP)
ahoy me buckos,
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/26/us...tation.html?hpJuan David Gonzalez was 6 years old. He was in the court, which would decide whether to expel him from the country, without a parent — and also without a lawyer.
Immigration courts in this South Texas border town and across the country are confronting an unexpected surge of children, some of them barely school age, who traveled here without parents and were caught as they tried to cross illegally into the United States.
The young people, mostly from Mexico and Central America, ride to the border on the roofs of freight trains or the backs of buses. They cross the Rio Grande on inner tubes, or hike for days through extremes of heat and chill in Arizona deserts. The smallest children, like Juan, are most often brought by smugglers.
whilst Mr. Obama continues to push fer the protection 'o these innocent children with initiatives like the Dream Act, imma wonderin' what the proper fate ought to be fer these young lads 'n lasses?
thus far this year, the amount 'o illegal immigrant children who journeyed across our borders into our just and christian land hath doubled.
- MeadHallPirate
Secretary of Defense
This is a tough question as while I can see why people might feel the children need to be sent back it seems somehow heartless. They should try and foster them with a US family so they can grow up as valued citizens as the kids themselves didn't make the choice to cross the border.
Moderator
Peter: What is your country's laws toward this type of thing?
MHP: Have you an idea just to why this is happening? You should have...
2011 USPOL Most Valuable Poster (MVP)
ahoy Tsquare,Originally Posted by tsquare
i would imagine they're doin' so to escape conditions in thar own countrys, aye?
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/26/us...tation.html?hpYoung migrants say they are fleeing sharply escalating criminal violence in their home countries.
if ye hath spoken to these young, innocent children on yer own, i'd be curious as to what they told ye, Tsquare.
- MeadHallPirate
Moderator
No 6 year old comes to this country on their own.
They are sent. Maybe "to escape conditions in thar own countrys"
And the reason why? Obama's amnesty program. Why else send a child like that? A misplaced understanding along with a goal for the child to get legalized, so then to bring the rest of the family here.
2011 USPOL Most Valuable Poster (MVP)
ahoy Tsquare,
if yer contestin' that these children did not come to our christian and bountiful on thar own, who did they come with?
the NYT cites children who indeed be comin' here with no guardian, afterall.
now, this thread be still in its infancy, so please do not derail it.
what would ye do with these innocent children?
- MeadHallPirate
City Council Member
It seems that President Obama still believes in the inscription on the Statue of Liberty:
Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses, yearning to breath free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore,
Send these, the homeless, tempest tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door.
"Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance."
-- George Bernard Shaw
Secretary of Defense
It gets complicated as people from the EU are free to move between states without restriction. People from outside the EU don't tend to come to the UK initially as it's a lot easier to get to France or Spain but we have people trying to get here via the channel tunnel or in commercial vehicles.
As for illegal kids I'd imagine we'd keep the here and they'd end up in the care system.
Vice President
I'd send them back. What happens when a billion are sent?
“If we open up our borders … we could suppress wages of middle class jobs” – Alan GreenspanWe need to suppress the wage levels of the skilled. We need to suppress wages in comparison to the “lesser skilled ” - Alan Greenspan
Vice President
We'll split the cost of securing our border and sending them back home amongst the US businesses that aren't really US businesses.
You should always have an informed opinion, so after I inform you, please feel free to express my opinion...USCitizen
Vice President
I don't think Obama believes that inscription for one second. He has different motives.
Immigration has been flowing to America for hundreds of years ... at some point the rest of the world needs to put their dick in their pants and stop thinking America is their population dumping ground. That is essentially what America and many countries have become ... population dumping grounds.
“If we open up our borders … we could suppress wages of middle class jobs” – Alan GreenspanWe need to suppress the wage levels of the skilled. We need to suppress wages in comparison to the “lesser skilled ” - Alan Greenspan
Vice President
Sending a child is no different then sending an adult to America. It's the sloughing off of responsibility to care for ones own.
“If we open up our borders … we could suppress wages of middle class jobs” – Alan GreenspanWe need to suppress the wage levels of the skilled. We need to suppress wages in comparison to the “lesser skilled ” - Alan Greenspan
Administrator
That's great...legislation by poetry:rolleyes:
I'd hazard a guess that most of the kids sent here on their own were sent because their parents believed that they would have a better life here. Back in the 80's I did a tour in Honduras and couldn't believe the level of poverty. "Middle class" meant that you had a roof over your head instead of a tarp or a scrap of plywood. It was a step above middle class to have a floor made of something other than dirt. If you live in those conditions and want your kid to have the little things like an education and half a chance at being something other than a whore or a beggar it's totally understandable that you would send them north. Just imagine how desperate one would have to be to send their 6 year old out on his own!
It's also unlikely that anyone sends a pre-teen to the US just to gain amnesty for the rest of the family. The kid would have no legal standing to make that happen.
There is no quick fix to this kind of thing. The kid does need to be put into the system initially. Sending him or her back does no good unless you can track down the parents and then have reasonable confidence that he will have some kind of a life. Of course doing this on a small scale will lead to having to do it on a larger scale later on and that becomes overly burdensome so the process can't end there.
Many of my associates on the right will probably flame the hell out of me for this but free trade is one of the ways in which we can assist these countries so that they can take care of their own and that needs to be our ultimate goal. We also need to come up with an immigration policy that works. Sponsored work permits are one option especially if combined with better enforcement and tighter border security. On the private sector side of things such things as missionary work, international educational programs and jobs programs through the free trade agreements also help. I know that nobody likes to see sweat shops in foreign countries but for many of these people working 60 hours a week for $5 a day puts them far above the economic level that they are right now ESPECIALLY if the alternative is to do nothing to help them.
Vice President
Sorry L, not if it means we get screwed for their cultural inferiority.
You should always have an informed opinion, so after I inform you, please feel free to express my opinion...USCitizen
City Council Member
I don't understand that line of thinking at all. Or maybe I do... I'm sure in 1812 and 1912 just like 2012 there have been groups who thought the same thing, the rest of the world needs to wake up and make their own country better rather than trying to do it here. Or that maybe this country belongs to those lineages who have built it rather than those who would take advantage of what has been built.
But in the hundreds of years of immigration, whether people have come because of want, need or force, I think the United States has done better for its diversity than worse.
If Mexico wants to send us their children, if they truly want to remove their best hope for their future, I say we keep them. Build some charter-boarding schools. Emerse them in American values and culture. Teach them. Give them a path to citizenship through education, through military service. Something that keeps such a valuable resource here.
There is no secret ingredient.
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