As I've been stating on this forum for some time, the proposed US regulations requiring passports for Canadian and US citizens crossing the border are stupid, ill-thought out and a disaster in the making. Someone in homeland security should lose their job!

WASHINGTON (AP) - New York state businesses warned the U.S. Congress on Thursday requiring passports at the Canadian border will disrupt trade and hurt tourism, while one official tried to reassure legislators an alternative ID would probably cost about $50 US.

Howard Zemsky, leader of a Buffalo-area business group, warned legislators: "Don't turn the war on terrorism into the war on tourism."

He and other witnesses outlined their fears a new rule to require passports at all land crossings into the United States by 2008 would clog up commerce with the country's biggest trading partner, Canada, and keep out critical tourism dollars.

As part of the U.S. government's post-Sept. 11, 2001 tightening of security measures, the Department of Homeland Security and Department of State announced the Western Hemisphere Travel Initiative, which requires passports or one of four other secure documents at border crossings.

Officials on both sides of the U.S.-Canada border argue the passport rule would reduce trade and leisure travel between the two countries. The government, however, maintains it is necessary to prevent terrorists from entering the country.

Legislators sounded almost as concerned as the witnesses, with many on the committee questioning if driver's licences could be upgraded to substitute for passports.

"This is a looming crisis at our borders," said committee chairman Donald Manzullo, an Illinois Republican

Representatives Louise Slaughter and Brian Higgins said just the talk of the rule is already having a chilling effect on travel back and forth, and a passport requirement would essentially throw a bureaucratic wall up between tightly connected communities.

Janice Kephart, a lawyer for the now-defunct 9/11 Commission, said the new rules are critical to keeping out terrorists who can obtain fake drivers licences or other forms of ID.

She also said the U.S. State Department is creating a North American travel card, a cheaper alternative to a $97 passport.

"This card will be about half the cost of a passport, fit into a wallet like a driver's licence, protect privacy, (and) can be vetted against national security information," Kephart said.

A Detroit-based manager for DaimlerChrysler told legislators his supply chain runs right over the border, part of a "just-in-time" manufacturing system that reduces costs by rapid deliveries of inventory.

Under that system, the carmaker moves 700 truckloads a day between Detroit and Windsor, Ont., said the manager, William Cook.

He urged Congress to make sure whatever changes are implemented, they don't turn the border into a giant bottleneck for his company's production line.

The head of a national manufacturing group said businesses are already navigating a maze of options for different government identification cards.

"We've got so many different pieces of new ID that we're creating," said Engler, also a former governor of Michigan.

"Everybody's designing a piece of it and the pieces don't fit very well."

I am thoroughly confused by your attitudes towards this issue. I would assume you would be delighted by a dramatic drop in tourism between Canada and the US. Your contempt and dislike for Americans appears to be without limit, yet you are running yet another finger-wagging, scolding thread about this issue. Surely you would WANT us to stay away? And why would you want to cross the border and visit a nation you despise? Altogether very odd indeed - no doubt you see my point.

__________________
"Our fears in Banquo
Stick deep; in his royalty of nature
Reigns that which would be fear'd: 'tis much he dares;
And, to that dauntless temper of his mind,
He hath a wisdom that doth guide his valour
To act in safety."

Macbeth 3:1

Cool. Another worthless thread.

__________________

Jn 4:14
I have my own Kingdom. You may live in it.

I am all for keeping the border wide-open as that is the civilized thing to do. I have posted elsewhere of my like for most Americans and many admirable attributes of the US. Where have I ever expressed contempt for individual Americans? I don't depise the US at all although I completely despise the Bush administration. Learn to make the distinction Tim. Your misrepresentation of what I have posted is truly juvenile. It seems like you are the one full of contempt my friend. Are you trolling?

Where have you expressed contempt? You are joking, surely...I certainly have not misrepresented your views - not at all. As for trolling, calm yourself, sir, calm yourself. I did manage to get an acknowledgment from you that not all Americans are evil - and I congratulate myself for my accomplishment.

The problem with you is: you don't know the how to tell the difference between your enemies and your friends....

__________________
"Our fears in Banquo
Stick deep; in his royalty of nature
Reigns that which would be fear'd: 'tis much he dares;
And, to that dauntless temper of his mind,
He hath a wisdom that doth guide his valour
To act in safety."

Macbeth 3:1

So that must be why you've showed up Dago.

Once again Tim, you've totally managed to avoid discussing the issue at hand. Where did you learn how to debate? Deal with the issue my friend. Otherwise you are doing nothing but trolling.

Again - calm yourself. You have lost some credibility with me because your posts are more or less the same: you hurl accusations and you scold and you fuss and cluck, and then you are surprised by the lack of discussion. Speak to your opponents with respect. I assume you want to be taken seriously here? Well, talk with me, not at me. And stop calling me a troll....

__________________
"Our fears in Banquo
Stick deep; in his royalty of nature
Reigns that which would be fear'd: 'tis much he dares;
And, to that dauntless temper of his mind,
He hath a wisdom that doth guide his valour
To act in safety."

Macbeth 3:1

Witty.

__________________

Jn 4:14
I have my own Kingdom. You may live in it.

Likewise Tim, otherwise you would be the definition of a hypocrite. I'm tired of your whining.

Thank you.

Don't waste you time with Bailey, everytime you mention Canada he throws a fit and goes on his usual trolling. Better to ignore the worthless canuck.

__________________

Jn 4:14
I have my own Kingdom. You may live in it.

Now even US Senators are voicing fears over Bush administrations ill-concieved border policy


http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2...400462-ap.html

WASHINGTON (CP) - Some U.S. senators complained Friday about plans to require a new security card for Americans coming back from Canada, telling a committee hearing it will hurt the economy.

The United States announced this month it was ditching plans to require passports and will instead start issuing a security card at about one-half the cost by the end of the year. But senators from states that border Canada said that will still be disruptive.

"We want to make sure we don't do something that doesn't (actually) increase security but instead really harms our economy and the tourism industry," said Democratic Senator Patty Murray of Washington state.

And so many people still think that they'll need a passport, they've just stopped taking trips across the border, said Murray.

Senator Ted Stevens, a Republican from Alaska, said the United States and Canada should work it out so the same cards are acceptable on both sides of the border.

Canadian officials have said they will devise a system that links up with the U.S. one.

While Canada is pleased passports are out of the running, there are still concerns about timing.

Under U.S. law, the cards will be required by Jan. 1, 2008, from all Americans, Canadians and Mexicans arriving in the United States over a land crossing.

So Canada needs to meet that deadline in devising its own security card.

Murray suggested the U.S. administration set up an advisory committee with business people and politicians from border states to investigate the impact of the travel cards.

U.S. senator says border ID card plan is a 'train wreck' and should be dropped

By BETH GORHAM
WASHINGTON (CP) - Vermont Senator Patrick Leahy says the "cockamamie idea" of requiring new identity cards at the Canada-U.S. border will cause mayhem in return for dubious security benefits.

http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/Canada/2...423514-cp.html

I've been saying this since day 1, hence this thread! Nice to see some people in the US still have common sense!

The citizens of Canada are our brothers and sisters-- any governmental action that draws us further apart is an injustice.

__________________