You do realize tha the S. Korean Govt. wants us to stay and that the bases are being realigned, leaving a much smaller U.S. footprint in the country. No doubt the local farmers are upset with good reason, but it equates to the same as any govt. taking property for lets say a bigger road or transit system. Which by the way is also happening in S. Korea on a large scale. although it is desperatley needed, it would still suck to lose your business or house to a rail way base or whatever but it is their Govt. doing it because they want us there.

Yep theres demostrators saying they don't but hell you get that with anything like a memorial cross or whatever.

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man who goes to bed with itchy butt, wakes up with stinky finger

Doemstic reasons for displacing people are quite a bit different than a foreign power diplacing people. I am simply pointing to reasons why there is anti-american sentiments in particular as opposed to other nations.

Andrew

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Ethanol is a fabulous solution to our energy dilemma because it will provide more fuel for us to drive around and look for food.

-- Unknown

Again the govt. of S. Korea wants the U.S. military there, it is their own govt. displacing them. Should their govt. not want that base to expand so they can close others or rther occupy the others with their own military, then it wouldn't happen.

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man who goes to bed with itchy butt, wakes up with stinky finger

In the article i posted it references the South Korean government as saying that any delay in the project could cause friction between washington and Seoul. To me this means that the south korean government is bowing to pressure from washington, and so the perception of the people angry over this move is one where washington is calling the shots. And therein lies the whole point im trying to make. Even if we put aside for the moment any justification for an american presence in South Korea, im still just pointing to one of the ways in which the US government causes friction in the world, which results in anti-american feelings. Perception itself is one of the strongest forces in international politics.

Just imagine for a moment the idea of traditional farm land, in the possesion of farmers for generations, being taken away by a foreign military power that has already lost quite a bit of respect globally? This is just one of the sources of anti-americanism, justified or not, it is unique to america.

Andrew

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Ethanol is a fabulous solution to our energy dilemma because it will provide more fuel for us to drive around and look for food.

-- Unknown

And in regards to this same issue froma separate article:

http://targetwto.revolt.org/node/308

The impetus for this move comes from washington, and that certainly pisses people off.

Andrew

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Ethanol is a fabulous solution to our energy dilemma because it will provide more fuel for us to drive around and look for food.

-- Unknown

Right and like the little boy who cries wolf, nobody takes you seriously anymore.

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One day, I will sneak across the border into Canada and be an illegal alien. It will be fun.

[quote=Andrewl] As I said at the time, it was a brief response to a particular issue. No one remains on my ignore list for more than a few days. No - don't thank me....

Well, the US is "hegemon" now on the world stage just as Britain was during the Pax Britannica, and the reasons are far more complex than you indicate here.

You say that the aim of the US is to "create an economic and military empire" and uses "unjustified" force all over the world to attain this: and this "will naturally lead to hatred, distrust, and instability".

Andrew - this is hysterical hyeprbole.

Certainly the US is the number one military and economic power in the world. Part of that is simply the development of history and highly successful capitalist policy. Regarding the military, more recently, the Bush administration has pursued an expansionist foreign policy, which I happen to disagree with. But the idea that the US is some sort of rampaging collossus, destroying everyone and everything while helpless victims cower before us is more than nonsense - it is dangerous and foolish.

Consider what the world would look like if your perception was accurate: the US would simply use its might and its money and its influence to overthrow and occupy every nation on the planet. There would be no talk of democracy. The world would indeed be turned into a vast colony of slaves - which would not be a surprise to you because in your estimation, there is no limit to American evil.

You consistently use the image of evil Americans versus helpless and hapless victims. Does this reflect your experience of the world? It alarms me when I read your posts, because I know that you really mean what you say here - that is, you are not simply hurling abuse. It is an interesting but enlightening glimpse of why anti-Americanism is so popular and trendy now. But it reflects a simplistic and highly dangerous view of the world.

If you are going to take your role as "Critic of the United States" seriously, then you have to develop a more nuanced and sophisticated - and less dramatic - understanding of your subject.

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"Our fears in Banquo
Stick deep; in his royalty of nature
Reigns that which would be fear'd: 'tis much he dares;
And, to that dauntless temper of his mind,
He hath a wisdom that doth guide his valour
To act in safety."

Macbeth 3:1

I agree that this was wrong. However, your suggestion that the US is uniquely evil - and that you even present Russia and China as paragons of virtue - is simply outrageous - utterly preposterous and false.

You have developed your own theory of anti-Americanism and insist that all evidence must be twisted to support your theory. When you get to the point of presenting China as a model nation, you are no longer dealing with reality at all.

Why can't you see how dangerous this is? You insist Americans are the villians in all situations and uniquely guilty. This is the very essence, the definition, of bigotry.

__________________
"Our fears in Banquo
Stick deep; in his royalty of nature
Reigns that which would be fear'd: 'tis much he dares;
And, to that dauntless temper of his mind,
He hath a wisdom that doth guide his valour
To act in safety."

Macbeth 3:1

Tim,

Where did I present China or Russia as model nations?

Im just pointing to certain facts that might help explain why the US gets the brunt of criticism in the world.

Andrew

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Ethanol is a fabulous solution to our energy dilemma because it will provide more fuel for us to drive around and look for food.

-- Unknown

[quote=Tim]This is funny because you are using over-the-top hyperbole to attempt a criticism of my 'hyperbole'.

But I stand by my contention that if the US continues a go it alone strategy using military force to guarantee their position as a global hegemony, than certainly hatred, distrust, and instability will follow. That is not hysterical ranting, that is what is playing itself out right now in the world. Its a prediction based on observation of recent history. Its a lose/lose situation. It ruins your credibility on the international stage, and it is inherently unsuccesful. I would just rather see the US lead by example, and reserve military force striclty when self-defense calls for it.

Andrew

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Ethanol is a fabulous solution to our energy dilemma because it will provide more fuel for us to drive around and look for food.

-- Unknown

[quote=Andrewl][quote=Tim]

Attempt a criticism? I succeeded in criticizing your theory by taking your theories to their logical outcome.....

I fully agree with your comments regarding "going it alone". I have never supported that. I also agree with the "leading by example" comment as well.

Hmmmm....two areas of agreement?

__________________
"Our fears in Banquo
Stick deep; in his royalty of nature
Reigns that which would be fear'd: 'tis much he dares;
And, to that dauntless temper of his mind,
He hath a wisdom that doth guide his valour
To act in safety."

Macbeth 3:1

You're right about the needs and wants of the South Korean government but dead wrong about opposition to US forces by the people. I've spent a fair amount of time in Asia and believe me, there's more than just token opposition to US military forces in the region - lots of it has to do with outrageous behaviour by wayward US troops in South Korea (rapes and murders) and Japan (minors being raped).

http://www.kimsoft.com/korea/gikill.htm
http://www.kimsoft.com/korea/us-army.htm
http://www.guardian.co.uk/japan/stor...681142,00.html
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Korea/FA28Dg02.html

Believe me, these are just the tip of the iceberg, as any Asia hand can tell you. It's about time this gets reported accurately in the US press so that Americans can be better informed about the mess their tax dollars are supporting abroad and change course before they create even more anti-americanism (which in this case is justified).

The US stayed out of WWII as long as they could. They did the same thing in WWI. Prescot Bush was a great pal of many prominent Nazi Party memebers and Chuck Linburgh was a Nazi. The Nazi Party operated openly in the USA well into the 1940's....pray tell my friends but you are in no position to lecture anyone or brag about anything.

I almost forgot to ask. What happened in Vietnam? You lost to a bunch of illiterate VC peasants

Looks like the hate mongering Canadians are out in force this evening.

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One day, I will sneak across the border into Canada and be an illegal alien. It will be fun.

Yet they avoid any conversation about their own backyards. My bad, one of them commented in a canadian thread...he wasn't very truthful or nice, but he commented.