Amen! Respect the dead please.

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"A dog barks when his master is attacked. I would be a coward if I saw that God's truth is attacked and yet would remain silent."
-John Calvin

That's not what was said at all. Be prepared to defend this statement tomorrow....

Given that Osama Bin Laden stated rather unequivically that the US occupation of Saudi Arabia and US support for various tyrannical dictatorships in the Middle East was 'his' reason for launching the 9/11 attack, I see no valid reason to dispute OBL's view here.

In other words, it is plainly obivious that US foreign policy was the prime motivator behind 9/11. Blowback is a bitch they say... and this was one bitch of a blowback!

Does this statement justify the attack? No more than it justifies the idiot US foreign policies that allegedly caused it.

Just the facts. I'll leave the spin-games for the Americans to whom the issue is most dear.

Hey, at least Canadians are rational here...

Apparently Americans are blaming GWBush for causing it...

CNN poll suggests that 45% of US citizens blame the President for 9/11.
http://edition.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS...oll/index.html

Every American should read this.

My Virulent Anti-Semitism and Theirs : by Mark Green

[Stumper]

You are confusing "facts" with opinion. So Blowback is a bitch they say... and this was one bitch of a blowback!? So we had it coming? Well, that explains why so many Canadians comfort themselves with the bizarre fantasy that Americans are to blame for 9/11, as indicated in the opening post.

Sickening stuff - although at least you are open with your anti-American hatred. Although OBL hardly needs apologists.

Ah...now I get it. Another OBL apologist. Shameless.

Well, here I am.....and it won't take long. Here is Danny's statement:

Unfortunately, you are unable to comprehend the fact that if you get enough people angry at you, people will commit crimes against you. While that doesn't justify the crimes it should make one understand that you bring them upon yourself.

According to him, we "brought it on ourselves". So we are to blame. The logic is quite simple - and sickening, of course. Our "crimes" against the terrorists are so terrible that we have brought this on ourselves (including sending billions of dollars to them to buy oil, giving them whatever prosperity they have? - just a question....).

That is Danny's statement. OBL could not have said it better himself. Sickening, outrageous stuff - but he believes it. As I said at the beginning, hatred of Americans that goes this deep cannot be met with rational argument.

Alright, I met your "challenge". Now step up to the plate.

That quip does not explain why Osama bin Laden initially denied being involved in the attack. He did describe himself as the innocent rebel and then perhaps he usurped the prestige of the attack to bolster his own standing as the absolute hero among disgruntled Muslims?

Besides, you see the facts of the origin of the 9-11 attackers and their living accomodations next to WAMY headquarters, and yet you fail to address these FACTS in your rebuttal.

- - - - - - - -

When are you people going to start making the distinction between the interests of your government and the interests of your citizenry Tim ??? Can you not see that the interests of the corporatized American state and the interests of "the average joe" are often as disparate as the sun and the moon ?

This is Poli Sci 101 stuff here.

[Stumper]

Interesting, so Canadian's are "smarter" then people who do NOT think that it is U.S. foreign policy that was the real motivation behind the islamic extremism we are at war with.


So, what policies of the Canadian government have resulted in that? My guess (supported by decades of proclamations from Islamic extremists) is that it is no foreign policy in particular, but the very freedom and tolerance of the West as a whole. Why the U.S. most specifically? Because we are the most powerful, most succesful, and greatest threat to their evil ambitions.

__________________
"It's a good feeling to shoot a bad guy. Something you democrats would never understand. Americans are homesteaders, we want a safe home, keep the money we make, and shoot bad guys!"

----Denny Crane

If you insist on defending the terrorists as victims and using anti-semitic diatribes on Al Jazeera as your "source", there isn't much common ground, is there?

Indeed. Well said. Unfortunately it is not as exciting or as fascinating - or as comforting - as blaming Americans. But it is the truth.

About those kids arrested in Brampton a few months ago... this is supposed to support an argument?

Have you seen the kids they arrested? Have you seen a listing of the evidence and charges laid? Looks rather 'Mickey Mouse' to me. Yes these guys might be foolish idiots, and they might even be dangerous. But to believe that these guys might have pulled off a major terrorist attack is utterly laughable.

Indeed, this pattern is becoming increasingly common with these large scale publicity arrests in the USA. (Here in Canada, the Prime Minister was standing by for the immediate photo op the very day of the arrests just as the media goes into 24/7 saturation coverage mode).

Try reading up on these cases beyond the first day front page treatments. These cases start looking rather pathetic the more info you read about them (just to be clear, what looks pathetic is the media frenzy that surrounds these 3rd rate criminal cases that appear to be highly driven by the desire to have such cases to parade before the public).

Speaking of which, how many of those arrested by the Brits two months ago have actually had charges laid against them? I believe about half of them... but that's not what the front pages say the day of the arrests... (TERRORIST PLOT FOILED says page 1 in huge letters, a week later on pg47 at the bottom, it is noted that charges are dropped for lack of any evidence).

Whether they would have been succesful is beside the point, the issue is what MOTIVATES them.

And it is easy to dismiss the potential threat of those that are caught BEFORE they suceed. I have NO doubt that had we caught the 9/11 hijackers before they carried out their plans but had responsed in policy and action in the very same manner in which we did AFTER the attacks, people like you would have been denouncing the war on terror itself as an overreaction to a bunch of inept idiots who were not really a threat.

The true tragedy is that it requires such horror in order to slap some people across the face and realize a threat BEFORE it hits...and GREATEST tragedy is that there are some idiots out their who don't even get it after they've been slapped in the face with it.



And by the way, if the motives of the terrorists were U.S. foreign policies, why did Canada take steps in the wake of 9/11 to increase its aviation security, both international AND domestic?

__________________
"It's a good feeling to shoot a bad guy. Something you democrats would never understand. Americans are homesteaders, we want a safe home, keep the money we make, and shoot bad guys!"

----Denny Crane

So it is 'thought crimes' that you seek to punish? That is fascism pure and simple.

Or are you just assuming that you know who's guilty and who's not? (that is theocracy, pure and simple).

Your argument is entirely hypothetical and requires that I think and act like you would do under similar circumstances. That is a deeply flawed assumption that your argument is predicated upon.

The fact is that 5 years since 9/11 hasn't shown much evidence of secret terrorist cells around the world plotting destruction and mayhem. A few wannabee copycats certainly, but usually very young, amateurish and lacking the funding, planning and organisation that marked the real 9/11 attack.

On a scale of present danger, lightning striking me is a far greater concern than a terrorist attack. I like to keep some perspective.

No, the greater tragedy is to go around seeking violent revenge upon people who didn't perpetrate the offense. That policy has a tendency to produce even greater response down the road.

9/11 was caused by a long string of American actions in recent history. This doesn't say it is right or justified. Just that it is.

To pretend that 9/11 was caused entirely out of the blue by madmen who just woke up one day and said "lets hate the USA and kill a bunch of them" is the most absurd thing in the world. They had their reasons and you may not like those reasons or may disagree with those reasons, but that doesn't negate the validity of those reasonings to those people.