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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 09-17-2007
Si modo's Avatar
Si modo Si modo is offline
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Murder Suspect to Run For Parliament in Russia

Murder Suspect to Run For Parliament in Russia - washingtonpost.com

Quote:
Murder Suspect to Run For Parliament in Russia
Ex-KGB Figure Would Get Immunity as Officeholder
By Peter Finn
Washington Post Foreign Service
Monday, September 17, 2007; A14

MOSCOW, Sept. 16 -- The Russian accused by British authorities of murdering a former KGB agent with a radioactive isotope in London last November said he plans to run for parliament in December on the slate of a radical nationalist party that generally follows the Kremlin's wishes.
….

Members of parliament in Russia are immune from prosecution.
….

Lugovoy, also a former KGB officer, is accused of killing Alexander Litvinenko with polonium-210, a rare radioactive isotope, when the two met in London on Nov. 1. Britain has not released details of the evidence gathered against Lugovoy, and it is unclear how much material was forwarded to Moscow to press the extradition request.
….

In Russia, voters in parliamentary elections cast ballots for national parties that put forward lists of candidates, rather than for nominees in individual constituencies. If the Liberal Democratic Party wins more than 7 percent of the vote on Dec. 2, it will be assured representation in the next parliament. And as No. 2 on the party list, Lugovoy, who runs a private security firm, would be guaranteed a seat....
It seems as if this murder suspect will be a shoe-in for the Russian Parliament. Not only that, upon his election, he will be immune from any prosecution for the murder of the outspoken Putin critic, Litvinenko, using polonium. I guess he would also not be considered for extradition to Britian for trial.

Let’s see how many KGB buddies Putin can fit into his recently restructured government before Putin’s “end-of-term”.
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Old 09-18-2007
Alex16 Alex16 is offline
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Re: Murder Suspect to Run For Parliament in Russia

No more than Bush fits his neo con buddies into US government. Wanna link with names? It was a joke.
Hey, I got a question..

how many KGB buddies Putin already has in the government?

Litvinenko will only TRY to position himself with Duma. I doubt he will. LDPR party he affiliates with stands no chance in coming elections. Any other party with greater power doesn't want him.
No law can deprive a person of a political affiliation with one party or the other. Wheather he is only a suspect or found guilty. Can OJ Simphson bacome Republican? He is a murderer, for all I care. So, can he or he cannot?

At the same time I would like to see this board to eas up a little toward Russia. We can begin by doing away with statements like the one posted above my post and lean more toward question answer type of conversation. something along these lines:

"...The question to all Russians on this board...
I have heard that Mr. Litvinenko poised to become member of parlament via obtaining membership of one of prompt Russian political parties. Will this, in case he achieves his objective, protect him from possible procecution?.." and so on. Nice, right?

I, for one, will never stick my nose in Washington DC matters with statements of this, in opinion, offending nature.

Last edited by Alex16; 09-18-2007 at 04:24 AM.
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Old 09-18-2007
Si modo's Avatar
Si modo Si modo is offline
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Re: Murder Suspect to Run For Parliament in Russia

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex16 View Post
No more than Bush fits his neo con buddies into US government. Wanna link with names? It was a joke.
Hey, I got a question..

how many KGB buddies Putin already has in the government?

Litvinenko will only TRY to position himself with Duma. I doubt he will. LDPR party he affiliates with stands no chance in coming elections. Any other party with greater power doesn't want him.
No law can deprive a person of a political affiliation with one party or the other. Wheather he is only a suspect or found guilty. Can OJ Simphson bacome Republican? He is a murderer, for all I care. So, can he or he cannot?

At the same time I would like to see this board to eas up a little toward Russia. We can begin by doing away with statements like the one posted above my post and lean more toward question answer type of conversation. something along these lines:

"...The question to all Russians on this board...
I have heard that Mr. Litvinenko poised to become member of parlament via obtaining membership of one of prompt Russian political parties. Will this, in case he achieves his objective, protect him from possible procecution?.." and so on. Nice, right?

I, for one, will never stick my nose in Washington DC matters with statements of this, in opinion, offending nature.
If you think the OP is of an offending nature, you might want to get a thicker skin for this board.

But, let's try with the basics: He is a murder suspect. If elected, he will be immune from prosecution. If elected, he will not be extradited to the UK, where the murder occurred and where jurisdiction exists. According to the article, he has a good chance of being elected, or course, any before-election predictions are just that. He is a KGB cronie and a Putin supporter. Putin recently restructured the government. In the past, Putin has said he will not seek an additional term. Putin has recently hinted that he will.

And, you should be flattered that the world is talking about Russia; it means the country is important.

All better now?
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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 09-18-2007
Alex16 Alex16 is offline
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Re: Murder Suspect to Run For Parliament in Russia

Feel better the 'world' --it's like the US, is spewing filth on Russia because it is important?? And I should feel flattered...How insulting...do us all a favor and do not talk about Russia in any way...why make us feel important? No need, really. I think I, and many others, can manage to live without your attention. Thank you.

Anyway, I doubt justice system is anything but existent in the UK in particular. That's one. Second, my friend, British are prejudice when it comes to affairs with Russia and you know it. Further down -- according to the reality, it will be up to electorate to pick candidates. LDPR is nowhere near and will be happy to take one or two seats in parliament. Litvinenko might take one of it or might not. And what do you suggest --- deny him a constitutional right to be a member of a political movement?

Now, the way you present your position makes me believe you have built your political outlook by reading Washington Post prints exclusively and THAT, in my opinion, is extremely impotent and leads to unbalanced and aggressive behavior.

p.s. I just love it the way you say: " according to the article.." Ha-ha-ha..you mean the one in Washington Post, right? Oh, yeah, that rag was making every Russian flattered for the past 60 years or so…mind you?
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Old 09-18-2007
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Si modo Si modo is offline
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Re: Murder Suspect to Run For Parliament in Russia

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex16 View Post
Feel better the 'world' --it's like the US, is spewing filth on Russia because it is important??...
"Spewing filth"? Nothing like totally inaccurate hyperbole to make you feel better, huh?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex16 View Post
And I should feel flattered...How insulting...do us all a favor and do not talk about Russia in any way...
Squelching free speech may be the Russain way, but not here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex16 View Post
...Second, my friend, British are prejudice when it comes to affairs with Russia and you know it....
Rather the British are prejudiced against murderers.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex16 View Post
And what do you suggest --- deny him a constitutional right to be a member of a political movement?...
Not at all. It is important news for all too consider.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex16 View Post
Now, the way you present your position makes me believe you have built your political outlook by reading Washington Post prints exclusively and THAT, in my opinion, is extremely impotent and leads to unbalanced and aggressive behavior....
Reading the Washington Post leads to aggressive behavior?
__________________
I am an American. That's the way most of us put it, just matter of factly. They are plain words, those four: you could write them on your thumbnail, or sweep them clear across this bright autumn sky. But remember too, that they are more than just words. They are a way of life. So whenever you speak them; speak them firmly, speak them proudly, speak them gratefully. I am an American. ...a tradition
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Old 09-18-2007
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MilleVanille MilleVanille is offline
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Re: Murder Suspect to Run For Parliament in Russia

Quote:
He is a murder suspect. If elected, he will be immune from prosecution. If elected, he will not be extradited to the UK,
He won't be extradited even without immunity, because Russian constitution doesn't let to extradite Russian citizens. Brits know that very well, that's why they point at Lugovoj.

Brits had even asked Russia to change its constitution!

Actually it is obvious that it were british secret services who killed Litvinenko.
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Old 09-18-2007
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Re: Murder Suspect to Run For Parliament in Russia

Quote:
Originally Posted by MilleVanille View Post
He won't be extradited even without immunity, because Russian constitution doesn't let to extradite Russian citizens. Brits know that very well, that's why they point at Lugovoj....
If so, then educate us and post a link to the part in your constitution that indicates that. I rarely take one's word as fact without support (also, it's in the forum rules). Source?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MilleVanille View Post
Actually it is obvious that it were british secret services who killed Litvinenko.
If true, then he should have no problem standing trial in the correct jurisdiction.
__________________
I am an American. That's the way most of us put it, just matter of factly. They are plain words, those four: you could write them on your thumbnail, or sweep them clear across this bright autumn sky. But remember too, that they are more than just words. They are a way of life. So whenever you speak them; speak them firmly, speak them proudly, speak them gratefully. I am an American. ...a tradition
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Old 09-18-2007
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MilleVanille MilleVanille is offline
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Re: Murder Suspect to Run For Parliament in Russia

Quote:
If so, then educate us and post a link to the part in your constitution that indicates that. I rarely take one's word as fact without support (also, it's in the forum rules). Source?
Article 61

1. A citizen of the Russian Federation may not be deported from Russia or extradited to another State.

Chapter 2. Rights and Freedoms of Man And Citizen | The Constitution of the Russian Federation

Quote:
If true, then he should have no problem standing trial in the correct jurisdiction.
correct jurisdiction ... is just an illusion...
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Old 09-18-2007
Si modo's Avatar
Si modo Si modo is offline
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Re: Murder Suspect to Run For Parliament in Russia

Quote:
Originally Posted by MilleVanille View Post
Article 61

1. A citizen of the Russian Federation may not be deported from Russia or extradited to another State.

Chapter 2. Rights and Freedoms of Man And Citizen | The Constitution of the Russian Federation
Thanks for the link.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MilleVanille View Post
correct jurisdiction ... is just an illusion...
Please, enlighten us as to how the UK is not the correct jurisdiction.
__________________
I am an American. That's the way most of us put it, just matter of factly. They are plain words, those four: you could write them on your thumbnail, or sweep them clear across this bright autumn sky. But remember too, that they are more than just words. They are a way of life. So whenever you speak them; speak them firmly, speak them proudly, speak them gratefully. I am an American. ...a tradition
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  #10 (permalink)  
Old 09-19-2007
Alex16 Alex16 is offline
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Re: Murder Suspect to Run For Parliament in Russia

Because, when it comes to affairs with Russia, British politics show huge sign that spells 'prejudice'. Jurisdiction in our case is not an exception. You know, they go hand to hand? It's a long story, bud. In other words - British court cannot be trusted on this premise.
Hell, British investigation team even covered up deaths of it's own citizens..Remember Dr Kelly?

'Kelly was Murdered' Says UK Intelligence Insider

yepp, it's all politics.

And, yeahh, before I got ‘enough skin for this board’, I’ll make last attempt to make it a two way conversation – you did not answer my question as How many ‘KGB cronies’ are there in Putin’s government you know of? Would love to see the link or two, btw.

Last edited by Alex16; 09-19-2007 at 01:38 AM.
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Old 09-19-2007
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Anselme Anselme is offline
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Re: Murder Suspect to Run For Parliament in Russia

murder suspect and might be elected... Russians citizen don't care about electing a criminal? I mean, I would never vote for someone who might be a number 1 suspect criminal, I think in the first place, he will never present himself, and try to prove himself innocent... Strange Russia...
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Old 09-19-2007
Alex16 Alex16 is offline
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Re: Murder Suspect to Run For Parliament in Russia

He-he..well, US citizens elected a criminal, didn't they? Ok. ok, it was a bad, bad joke..I admit..Just couldn't help it.
Anyway, Anselme -- look, there is a difference between a suspect and a convicted criminal, right? And what for christ sake does this mean -- 'suspect criminal'? Is it something like 'mother-to-be' or something?
Besides, who said he will be elected?
My point, comrade, was that it is of no ones power to deny him a constitutional right to be affiliated with any political party of his choise. Russia does that and next moment Washington Post spin brigade regords another load of venom but his time on violation of constitutional rights in Russia. You know what I'm saying?

Anselme, you sound like a good person. Really. And in good command of english. Why won't you read web sites who give a little different side of every story than Murdoch does? I won't give you any particular links for you should find them yourself. You will thank me later on, I promiss, and you are welcome!

Last edited by Alex16; 09-19-2007 at 12:01 PM.
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Old 09-19-2007
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White Rabbit White Rabbit is offline
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Re: Murder Suspect to Run For Parliament in Russia

Heck, if the media is to be believe, a murder suspect is President of Russia.

What's the big deal?

Criminal behavior in government legislatures is a rather common phenomena.
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Old 09-19-2007
Alex16 Alex16 is offline
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Re: Murder Suspect to Run For Parliament in Russia

White Rabbit, Is this what you have been made to get accustomed to ---so at the end you say 'What is a big deal'? Just roll your eyes and conclude: 'What is a big deal? Every government does it...a common phenomena, if you will.."
Just re phrase, please, what you just said, for crying out loud. Take your time, please. 'coz it's spineless as to what was it...from where I sit, though.

Last edited by Alex16; 09-19-2007 at 01:29 PM.
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Old 09-19-2007
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White Rabbit White Rabbit is offline
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Re: Murder Suspect to Run For Parliament in Russia

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex16 View Post
White Rabbit, Is this what you have been made to get accustomed to ---so at the end you say 'What is a big deal'? Just roll your eyes and conclude: 'What is a big deal? Every government does it...a common phenomena, if you will.."
Just re phrase, please, what you just said, for crying out loud. Take your time, please. 'coz it's spineless as to what was it...from where I sit, though.
For crying out loud, leave your vacuous innuendos and insults out of it. I concluded nothing.

I march to my own drummer and make my own decisions. No one makes me accustomed to anything. And I have a long history of studying history and politics.

And I'm not justifying anything. I'm asking a question? What's the big deal?

Criminal politicians are a dime a dozen to begin with and probably darn near a majority in Russia, so I don't see much of an issue here.

I don't expect democracy from Russia - or impartial court cases. And yes, I have a very 'low bar' for judging Russian behavior.

(Here's hoping that Putin takes a third term! Best ruler of Russia since Peter! Progress is slow, but apparently on the right long term trend - all hail the magnificent Putin!)

Btw, if Russia really was a democracy, then this issue would be none of your business. The voters have every right to elect a criminal (or alleged criminal) to represent them.
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