My god...whats going on? all those dolts running the show from both sides of the fence are not getting it done....…#49???? WTF is that?

The Iraqi conflict has already passed them up…….. They can do better than that ...come on you hebs, get out there and run some more sorties ( and troopers- stop trying for those head shots damn it, you are cutting down on the odds..center mass only)........you Rock throwers, switch to guns...we need a real bump in the numbers...IF the numbers don't rebound; someones going to bed with out their kreplach or musakhkhan....and will have to coach the Yankees next year.



Conflicts since 1950 with over 10,000 Fatalities*

1 40,000,000 Red China, 1949-76 (outright killing, manmade famine, Gulag)

2 10,000,000 Soviet Bloc: late Stalinism, 1950-53; post-Stalinism, to 1987 (mostly Gulag)
3 4,000,000 Ethiopia, 1962-92: Communists, artificial hunger, genocides
4 3,800,000 Zaire (Congo-Kinshasa): 1967-68; 1977-78; 1992-95; 1998-present
5 2,800,000 Korean war, 1950-53
6 1,900,000 Sudan, 1955-72; 1983-2006 (civil wars, genocides)
7 1,870,000 Cambodia: Khmer Rouge 1975-79; civil war 1978-91
8 1,800,000 Vietnam War, 1954-75
9 1,800,000 Afghanistan: Soviet and internecine killings, Taliban 1980-2001
10 1,250,000 West Pakistan massacres in East Pakistan (Bangladesh 1971)
11 1,100,000 Nigeria, 1966-79 (Biafra); 1993-present
12 1,100,000 Mozambique, 1964-70 (30,000) + after retreat of Portugal 1976-92
13 1,000,000 Iran-Iraq-War, 1980-88
14 900,000 Rwanda genocide, 1994
15 875,000 Algeria: against France 1954-62 (675,000); between Islamists and the government 1991-2006 (200,000)
16 850,000 Uganda, 1971-79; 1981-85; 1994-present
17 650,000 Indonesia: Marxists 1965-66 (450,000); East Timor, Papua, Aceh etc, 1969-present (200,000)
18 580,000 Angola: war against Portugal 1961-72 (80,000); after Portugal’s retreat (1972-2002)
19 500,000 Brazil against its Indians, up to 1999
20 430,000 Vietnam, after the war ended in 1975 (own people; boat refugees)
21 400,000 Indochina: against France, 1945-54
22 400,000 Burundi, 1959-present (Tutsi/Hutu)
23 400,000 Somalia, 1991-present
24 400,000 North Korea up to 2006 (own people)
25 300,000 Kurds in Iraq, Iran, Turkey, 1980s-1990s
26 300,000 Iraq, 1970-2003 (Saddam against minorities)
27 240,000 Columbia, 1946-58; 1964-present
28 200,000 Yugoslavia, Tito regime, 1944-80
29 200,000 Guatemala, 1960-96
30 190,000 Laos, 1975-90
31 175,000 Serbia against Croatia, Bosnia-Herzegovina, Kosovo, 1991-1999
32 150,000 Romania, 1949-99 (own people)
33 150,000 Liberia, 1989-97
34 140,000 Russia against Chechnya, 1994-present
35 150,000 Lebanon civil war, 1975-90
36 140,000 Kuwait War, 1990-91
37 130,000 Philippines: 1946-54 (10,000); 1972-present (120,000)
38 130,000 Burma/Myanmar, 1948-present
39 100,000 North Yemen, 1962-70
40 100,000 Sierra Leone, 1991-present
41 100,000 Albania, 1945-91 (own people)
42 80,000 Iran, 1978-79 (revolution)
43 75,000 Iraq, 2003-present (domestic)
44 75,000 El Salvador, 1975-92
45 70,000 Eritrea against Ethiopia, 1998-2000
46 68,000 Sri Lanka, 1997-present
47 60,000 Zimbabwe, 1966-79; 1980-present
48 60,000 Nicaragua, 1972-91 (Marxists/natives etc,)
49 51,000 Arab-Israeli conflict 1950-present
50 50,000 North Vietnam, 1954-75 (own people)
51 50,000 Tajikistan, 1992-96 (secularists against Islamists)
52 50,000 Equatorial Guinea, 1969-79
53 50,000 Peru, 1980-2000
54 50,000 Guinea, 1958-84
55 40,000 Chad, 1982-90
56 30,000 Bulgaria, 1948-89 (own people)
57 30,000 Rhodesia, 1972-79
58 30,000 Argentina, 1976-83 (own people)
59 27,000 Hungary, 1948-89 (own people)
60 26,000 Kashmir independence, 1989-present
61 25,000 Jordan government vs. Palestinians, 1970-71 (Black September)
62 22,000 Poland, 1948-89 (own people)
63 20,000 Syria, 1982 (against Islamists in Hama)
64 20,000 Chinese-Vietnamese war, 1979
65 19,000 Morocco: war against France, 1953-56 (3,000) and in Western Sahara, 1975-present (16,000)
66 18,000 Congo Republic, 1997-99
67 10,000 South Yemen, 1986 (civil war)


*All figures rounded. Sources: Brzezinski, Z., Out of Control: Global Turmoil on the Eve of the Twenty-first Century, 1993; Courtois, S., Le Livre Noir du Communism, 1997; Heinsohn, G., Lexikon der Völkermorde, 1999, 2nd ed.; Heinsohn, G., Söhne und Weltmacht, 2006, 8th ed.; Rummel. R., Death by Government, 1994; Small, M. and Singer, J.D., Resort to Arms: International and Civil Wars 1816-1980, 1982; White, M., “Death Tolls for the Major Wars and Atrocities of the Twentieth Century,” 2003.

This grisly inventory finds the total number of deaths in conflicts since 1950 numbering about 85,000,000. Of that sum, the deaths in the Arab-Israeli conflict since 1950 include 32,000 deaths due to Arab state attacks and 19,000 due to Palestinian attacks, or 51,000 in all. Arabs make up roughly 35,000 of these dead and Jewish Israelis make up 16,000.

These figures mean that deaths Arab-Israeli fighting since 1950 amount to just 0.06 percent of the total number of deaths in all conflicts in that period. More graphically, only 1 out of about 1,700 persons killed in conflicts since 1950 has died due to Arab-Israeli fighting.

(Adding the 11,000 killed in the Israeli war of independence, 1947-49, made up of 5,000 Arabs and 6,000 Israeli Jews, does not significantly alter these figures.)


In a different perspective, some 11,000,000 Muslims have been violently killed since 1948, of which 35,000, or 0.3 percent, died during the sixty years of fighting Israel, or just 1 out of every 315 Muslim fatalities. In contrast, over 90 percent of the 11 million who perished were killed by fellow Muslims

__________________
No individual can plan his own existence in their view.

So the state planners must arrogate to themselves the right to manipulate any sector of the economic system if the good of “society” or the “general welfare” is paramount.

Ipso- if the rights of the individual get in the way, the rights of the individual must be sublimated.

The Road to Serfdom
FA Hayek (interpretation)


Mortgage Backed Security survivor

Interesting information there. Thanks for sharing.

Yeah, right. That's wishful thinking. I think it's safe to assume that this conflict will make it into the top ten of your list when the tallying is finally done.

You know I highly doubt that. The highest estimates to this point is 100k. While that is truly a scar on America and I wish it would end tomorrow. I dont think you will actually see a ten-fold increase in the violence. The fact of the matter in looking at the numbers show that the last 6 months, casualties have gone down. There is nothing to indicate your logic in that claim is realistic.

The highest estimate? Hardly. The highest serious estimate was the Lancet study, and it was way higher than 100k.

The site Iraqi body count says between 75-82thousand civilians dead from violence. Another roughly 4 thousand Iraqi security forces and a smilar number of coalition casualties. Unless you can provide a better link, I will certainly look at it. I will say now that I wont accept the overall number of Iraqis who have died since the invasion. That is a common number used to mark otherwise natural deaths, and raise it to irrelevant numbers. The OP by his information provided for only violent casualties. The numbers of 650,000 simply arent realistic and is accounted for by flawed measures.
Iraq Body Count
Among many other sources count the actual violent deaths in Iraq to be between someone of 82k-150k. That is still a tenth of what you suggest could end up being the final toll.
I am as against this war and am consistently looking for solution to it, but the reality if the high end numbers are based on not was a violent death. But deaths as a result of ongoing violence such as lack of proper medical facilities etc. If one were to take a reaslitic objective view of casualities that have resulted from humans actually killing other humans, the number settles in at somewhere in the 100-150k number. Again still in the area of 10% of what would justify being in the top 10 of conflicts in terms of casualties since 1950

Again, I dont justify in any way the ongoing casualty count. But to assume it will increase by a tenfold number is implausible at this rate.

According to these numbers,

Why, because your gut tells you so? You are not likely to find more respectable sources than the Lancet.

We could just throw numbers around for a few dozen posts but I'll abstain. Not to worry, we'll know soon enough.

Ill just point out it was you who used the figure of 75K to justify your post.

One can argue which deaths should be counted in terms of an actual death toll. That is another story for another time.

Your suggestion would indicate a ten fold increase in casualties. While I know the situation is dire there. I just think that is not likely in my mind. To be honest it is quite sad that we even need to have a discussion on how many lives will be lost as a result of the conflict. It shouldnt have happened in the first place.

I was simply pointing out in my original post. Was that your statement given the evidence you used to justify it, is unlikely. That would indicate a 10fold increase in casualties.