Thread: Ireland approves civil partnership bill.

Originally Posted by Hafke

I'm thrilled about same sex couples getting at least some legal protections - although it'd be full marriage if it was up to me.

Not so sure about the provisions for unmarried opposite sex couples. Why not just get married?

Partnership is a civil entity - not a religious one - The Irish Times - Wed, Jun 30, 2010

BBC News - Civil partnership bill backed by Irish politicians

Of course, the Catholic heirarchy are claiming that this is worse for society than clerical child abuse, that government employees shouldn't have to perform them (in which case they have the option of not taking the fucking government job) and that society is falling apart. The loony edge of the Evangelicals are whining as well. Overall, though, no one seems all that bothered.

Your celebration is pre-mature.

The Dail in the Irish Republic has passed a bill recognising civil partnerships between same-sex couples.

The Civil Partnership and Cohabitation Bill passed without a vote. The legislation will now go to be ratified by the Seanad, the upper chamber.

This bill must still get through the Seanad.

Originally Posted by Steerpike

Your celebration is pre-mature.

This bill must still get through the Seanad.

It's gonna happen, or at least that's how it looks from here.

I hope it goes through. It's a step in the right direction.

Originally Posted by Hafke

It's gonna happen, or at least that's how it looks from here.

Perhaps, but it is not a "done deal."

It is best to wait until something is a "done deal" before acting like it is. This thread should have been delayed until the results had actually occurred. If this bill doesn't, for whatever reason, pass the Seanad, then your "jumping the gun" will appear to be unwise.

However, so long as you brought this up (by making the thread).

Why was no vote taken in the Dail when there were politicians who were critical of the legislation?

BBC News - Civil partnership bill backed by Irish politicians

The bill was supported by all parties in the Dail, although individual politicians have criticised the legislation.

Originally Posted by Steerpike

Why was no vote taken in the Dail when there were politicians who were critical of the legislation?

That speaks volumes, doesn't it?

Originally Posted by Revere

That speaks volumes, doesn't it?

That would depend on why there was no vote taken in the Dail. This may be proper procedurally based on the Irish Constitution. My question was not implied criticism. It was seeking to understand the process.

..and the question is still unanswered.

Originally Posted by Steerpike

That would depend on why there was no vote taken in the Dail. This may be proper procedurally based on the Irish Constitution. My question was not implied criticism. It was seeking to understand the process.

..and the question is still unanswered.

I'll criticize, then. They didn't have the balls to take a stand one way or the other. That's not directed at one side or the other.

That's a far worse breakdown in moral fabric than voting it in.

Originally Posted by Revere

I'll criticize, then. They didn't have the balls to take a stand one way or the other. That's not directed at one side or the other.

That's a far worse breakdown in moral fabric than voting it in.

Are you sure it was a question of not having "the balls to take a stand" and not procedural?

Originally Posted by Steerpike

Are you sure it was a question of not having "the balls to take a stand" and not procedural?

Yeah, I'm sure.

Originally Posted by Revere

Yeah, I'm sure.

Can you quote the appropriate passage from the Irish Constitution to back this claim up?

Originally Posted by Steerpike

Can you quote the appropriate passage from the Irish Constitution to back this claim up?

I don't care about the Irish Constitution. If civil partnership was the moral imperative we're being told it is, lawmakers would have the guts to vote on it out in the open.

Works the same way in the US.

If they don't, they're cowards.

Originally Posted by Revere

I don't care about the Irish Constitution. If civil partnership was the moral imperative we're being told it is, lawmakers would have the guts to vote on it out in the open.

Works the same way in the US.

If they don't, they're cowards.

Whilst I understand where you are coming from, if the process is not the same as under the United States Constitution (and it appears that it is not the same) as this bill is regarded as passing the Dail, then it is possible that while some lawmakers would be willing to vote one way or the other, the process may have dictated otherwise.

If process is dictating against individual votes in the Dail, then members of the Dail can't be reasonably faulted for not voting.

Originally Posted by Steerpike

Whilst, I understand where you are coming from, if the process is not the same as under the United States Constitution (and it appears that it is not the same) as this bill is regarded as passing the Dail, then it is possible that while some lawmakers would be willing to vote one way or the other, the process may have dictated otherwise.

If process is dictating against individual votes in the Dail, then members of the Dail can't be reasonably faulted for not voting.

The government dictates the process. They can do what they want, particularly on something this polarizing.