If people are leaving prison in a state of anger capable of committing heinous crimes, wouldn't that indicate that prison reform is failing?

__________________

This just creates a vested interest in keeping the prison population high from those who profit from such captive labor.

What prison reform? USA dropped "rehabilitation" as a substantive goal many years ago.

The first mission of our prisons should be punishment.

Rehabilitation, while important, should never replace punishment as the primary goal in our prison system...

__________________



For those who have fought to defend it, freedom has a taste the protected will never know...



If it wasn't for double standards, liberals would have no standards at all...

Why?

What does punishment as a primary goal accomplish?

__________________
Whan they come, Ah sall staun mah grun
Staun mah grun, an be na afraid.
Thochts ae hame tak awa mah fear
Sweat an bluid hide mah veil o tears.

Excites the sado's -
some people get giddy at the thought of someone being hurt.

__________________

That is not all that it would create, no. But that would be one effect, yes.

The profit margin however in such a system would be low, possibly baseline. The institution has to feed, house and clothe the inmates, employ the guards, maintain the premises and grounds, ect ect. I doubt the very basic production that the inmates would create would be lucrative.

If you're suggesting as I think you are, a scenario where elements of the government conspire to imprison people to profit from a defacto slave-camp I really must say I don't see it as feasible. People would more than likely notice their fellow citizens getting 10 years for jaywalking.

__________________

THE GOVERNMENT HAS SENT ME

Yes it is, I've already mentioned the horrific expense of universal solitary. I've already mentioned the shocking mental health effects it would have. I've already mentioned it would fail to create a reformed criminal, in fact rather the opposite.

What I haven't mentioned yet, because I thought it would be bleeding obvious, is that it's totally inhumane.

As for your concerns about the problems of criminals falling into gang-behavior and learning how to become more effective scourges on society, I recognise this problem and my proposal was similar to yours. Smaller groups, meeting in productive enviroments only. As my view in this respect reflects your own, please let me know what you think about the aproach I posted on page one. It seems to be a common consensus that something needs to be done about negative prisoner interaction, and the more debate towards a solution, the better.

__________________

THE GOVERNMENT HAS SENT ME

It punishes the offender.

What's most frightening is that you actually felt a need to ask such a question...

__________________



For those who have fought to defend it, freedom has a taste the protected will never know...



If it wasn't for double standards, liberals would have no standards at all...

I'm really trying to discuss the issue, but thanks for just brushing me off.

What benefit does punishment (we should probably define that term) have?

Is the simple removal from society, and the loss of freedom sufficient to meet your standard of punishment?

__________________
Whan they come, Ah sall staun mah grun
Staun mah grun, an be na afraid.
Thochts ae hame tak awa mah fear
Sweat an bluid hide mah veil o tears.

Actually they choose long-termers and lifers to do skilled labor work such as printing.
So - many of the forms you get, post office fliers etc. have been printed by murderers, child rapist etc. - otherwise they wouldn't be there for life.

__________________

The government cannot give without first taking.

IMO our prison system is too soft.
Since 1960 our prisons have implemented milder punishments and yet the number of crimes and the number of violent crimes have increased.

But the question I'm pondering is; Can these increases be a cause of our prison system or is our society just producing more criminals?
Either way, it's my opinion that we are too soft on crime.

Edit: forgot the link.
U. S. Crime Statistics Total and by State 1960 - 2005

__________________
Anyone who thinks freedom comes cheap, please put the blindfold on and stand against the wall.

IT IS TIME for Americans to take back the country and start a new government.

Wow.

USA has the largest prison population per capita on the planet. The USA imprisons more of its citizens and for longer time periods than any other nation on the globe.

USA has draconian anti-drug laws.

USA has more severe criminal punishments than any other western nation.

USA has a higher crime rate than any other western nation.

USA has longer prison sentences than any other western nation.

And you say the US is soft on crime? That's absurd.

Everyone else in the western world is more soft on crime and has less crime and less prisons.

Like I said, wow. Talk about an inarticulate debate!

USA has more prisons and uses them more than anyone else.

Prisons train and harden criminals.

Ergo, USA anti-crime policy creates more crime.

The simplest thing in the world is to be a critic.

Can you offer anything in the way of a solution?

__________________



For those who have fought to defend it, freedom has a taste the protected will never know...



If it wasn't for double standards, liberals would have no standards at all...