Blacks are better cooks?

I was referring to the economic class distinction where worker bees claim economically disadvantaged are prone to making poor decisions and get what they deserve regardless of existing, defined sociodemographic structures.

It is hard to work to change laws when the masses have been brainwashed by a lifetime of lies, half truths and propaganda from the media, the schools and the government.

Just look at some of the claims about marijauna from the reefer madness campaign. Many people actually believed those outrageous lies and the damage done by that campaign is still affecting public opinion.

Of course thinking people already know that the war on drugs is a scam. We have had at least two DEA agents tell us the CIA is directly involved in the drug trade and has been for many years.

We throw people in prison for many years for selling heroin, yet in US occupied Afghansitan, we look the other way while the poppies grow which supply over 90% of the world's heroin.

So, what has the war on drugs accomplished? It has corrupted police, courts and politicians. It has increased all crime associated with drug use, theft, burglary, armed robbery and especially violent crime, it has given an income to scumbags who care nothing about human life, it has given an income to gangs, it has led to impure drugs which have killed many people and it has sent millions of people to jail and prison, where they can become bitter, hardened criminals. ALL OF THIS AND IT ONLY COSTS 50 BILLION A YEAR, WOW, WHAT A BARGAIN.

Basically, the war on drugs has taken every single problem associated with drugs use and made them worse.

What is really sad is that the easiest place to get drugs is usually any public high school. How can you stop drugs, when our government can't even keep them out of our prisons, or our schools?

Of course the sheeple refuse to consider legalization. We can't do that, legalizing drugs would make things worse. Idiots.

americano..how many or, better yet what percentage of the prison pop. are jailed for lack of insurance, drunk driving and non payment of child sppt.?

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No individual can plan his own existence in their view.

So the state planners must arrogate to themselves the right to manipulate any sector of the economic system if the good of “society” or the “general welfare” is paramount.

Ipso- if the rights of the individual get in the way, the rights of the individual must be sublimated.

The Road to Serfdom
FA Hayek (interpretation)


Mortgage Backed Security survivor

Don't know, but you excluded drug offenders, an equally foolish morality judgment yet significant percentage of prison populations.

okay drug offenders, so lets see, first time drug offenders..... and as far as the issue, do we have a number ? Or are we just taking the concept of 1 in 100 and expounding based on...?


lets see, a test case...put some pot in your pocket....whats the deal in orgeon, whats personal use wieght?..carry 3 times the amount..... do something to get stopped turn against a light, run a stop sign.......plead poverty get a court appointed lawyer if its necesarry.lets see how long you spend in jail.....any examples would be helpful as well...


my morality ( I say societal trainiing) judgments don't seem to be getting any tractions nor do I see any refutation, other than economic “injustice” and the old alcohol tobacco strawman.......

__________________
No individual can plan his own existence in their view.

So the state planners must arrogate to themselves the right to manipulate any sector of the economic system if the good of “society” or the “general welfare” is paramount.

Ipso- if the rights of the individual get in the way, the rights of the individual must be sublimated.

The Road to Serfdom
FA Hayek (interpretation)


Mortgage Backed Security survivor

those points are valid, to be sure. And why is that, regards the schools?

__________________
No individual can plan his own existence in their view.

So the state planners must arrogate to themselves the right to manipulate any sector of the economic system if the good of “society” or the “general welfare” is paramount.

Ipso- if the rights of the individual get in the way, the rights of the individual must be sublimated.

The Road to Serfdom
FA Hayek (interpretation)


Mortgage Backed Security survivor

Our sheriff says non-payment for child support are short-term county prisoners and they they're classified as a Class C felony with no breakdown as to offense without reviewing each prisoner. On the cost side incarceration would not be insignificant but the social side, loss of assets, job and work potential would be the real issue. I don't have any numbers for that.

Driving offenses currently account for 3.7% of Oregon's prison population. With 13,707 prisoners in 2006, that would be 507 inmates. At $26k per prisoner per year $132k. Given the prison records, most will become public wards or cronic criminals in one manner or another after release.

A friend who volunteers in a substance abuse charity says most ex-prisoners with a record of drunk driving who have served their prison and parole time are able to qualify for various welfare substance abuse assistance, food stamps and other goodies. Needless to say a prison record pretty well eliminates most employment opportunities as we don't have a car wash every other block.

As usual we're going at this problem backward, reactive rather than proactive. Until we concentrate our money and efforts on effective early education we'll soon be spending more money on prisons than education.

thank you for doing that leg work....interesting....

your last paragraph (my emphasis), is exactly what I was addressing Americano......the lessons learned not just on a law and order basis but what is "accepted" by society has and how to conduct oneself, taking personal responsibility which goes hand in hand with making good choices the last 20 years taken a real hit..as you allude, if we educate at the start this 3.7% would be 1.0%..Becasue as we know there will always be a segment of the pop. that will do what they are going to do no matter what....

and I have to ask what does that 3.7 % say regards the 1 in 100 hoopla...so using your number as an example, I don’t see this as a huge %...

I agree that once someone gets a felony and now in some cases certain misdemeanors on their records they have exponentially ,made things more difficult for themselves....that is onerous...if a guy has a felony based on non violent act such as child sppt., a dui, a low level drug defense ( pot, hash) having them raked over the coals for the rest of their lives, having to make this part of their job application process etc. is not valid.

Regards the cost they assume, for their incarceration, impounding etc....I wuld agree with a sliding scale payment...charging someone who makes 100K a year, 1,000 bucks to get their car back with the other assoc. costs is one thing, charging an individual who makes 40K a year the same, is not commensurate in my opinion. THOUGH, the cost to the county would be the same, re; processing tc...its a conundrum...

__________________
No individual can plan his own existence in their view.

So the state planners must arrogate to themselves the right to manipulate any sector of the economic system if the good of “society” or the “general welfare” is paramount.

Ipso- if the rights of the individual get in the way, the rights of the individual must be sublimated.

The Road to Serfdom
FA Hayek (interpretation)


Mortgage Backed Security survivor

That's my point. We've legislated our way into this dilemma of record incarceration for crimes against morality, let's legislate our way out by approaching reality on what constitutes a crime against persons and/or property. That seems to be a sacred political issue without much hope of rectification, which means the only thing that will change it is economic necessity.

Some people just don't get it.

Many people look at the world through their won experiences and through their own limited knowledge.

Let's look at marijuana laws. In my state, Ohio, marijuana laws are very lenient, but if you possess marijuana and paraphernalia, then you can lose your driver's license for 6 months, as well as face drug counciling. Still, this is very lenient compared to some other states. NORML has broken down all the state laws for people who are interested. One of the most oppressive states is Florida.....

Florida - NORML

Possession
20 g or less misdemeanor 1 year $1,000
More than 20 g felony 5 years $5,000

In Arkansas, your second conviction for possession of any amount of marijuana, no matter how small, is a FELONY.

Possession of just one ounce of marijuana is a felony in many states.

This is ridiculous and these laws prove how stupid the American people are. The fact that we allow such oppressive laws over a friggin plant clearly illustrates just how brainwashed the masses truly are.

You can see how your state compares to other states at the link below...

State By State Laws - NORML

OHIO is by far one of the most lenient states on marijuana, helping to prove that my fellow buckeyes are less brainwashed than the average American sheeple.

Here is a pretty good chart for offenses of the prison population for state correctional facilities. Check out the increase in drug offenses since 1980....

Bureau of Justice Statistics - Table on number of persons in custody of State correctional authorities by most serious offense

More.......

In 1999, the Sentencing Project reported that between 1980 and 1997, drug arrests tripled in the United States. In 1997, four out of five drug arrests (79.5%) were for possession, with 44% of those arrests for marijuana offenses. Between 1980 and 1997, while the number of drug offenders entering prisons skyrocketed, the proportion of state prison space housing violent offenders declined from 55% to 47%.7

Fully 76% of the increase in admissions to America's prisons from 1978 to 1996 was attributable to non-violent offenders, much of that to persons incarcerated for drug offenses.8 Data like these prompted retired General Barry McCaffrey, Director of the Office of National Drug Control Policy, to refer to America's prison system as an "American gulag."9 And indeed, with an incarceration rate second to only Russia's, the drug czar's choice of language is fitting.10

The hammer of incarceration for drug offenses has by no means fallen equally across race or age categories, with young, African American men suffering unprecedented rates of incarceration for drug offenses. According to the Sentencing Project, nearly one in three (32%) black men between the ages of 20 and 29 were under criminal justice control in 1995.11 A recent report by the Building Blocks for Youth Initiative found that black youth were admitted to state public facilities for drug offenses at 48 times the rate of white youth.12

From 1986 to 1991, while the number of blacks imprisoned for violent offenses rose by about the same amount as whites (31,000 and 33,000, respectively), the number of blacks imprisoned for drug offenses increased four times as much as the increase for whites (66,000 vs. 15,000).13 This occurred at a time when survey data showed that five times as many whites were using drugs as blacks.14 The consequences of mass incarceration affect individuals and whole communities. The Sentencing Project and Human Rights Watch has reported that by 1998, 1.4 million African America men, or 13% of the black male adult population, had lost the right to vote due to their involvement in the criminal justice system.15

This growth defies not only historical US prison populations, but international incarceration rates as well. America's imprisonment of drug offenders dwarfs the incarcerated drug populations of all of Europe. In fact, America has 100,000 more persons behind bars just for drug offenses (458,131), than the European Union has for all offenses (356,626),21 even though the EU has 100 million more citizens than the US (Graph 3).

In 1998, there were some 22,670 drug offenders in the New York State prison system, about one-third of all prisoners. Over 90% are there because of two mandatory sentencing laws that were passed in 1973 known as the Rockefeller Drug Laws. It costs New York State over $680 million a year to keep these nonviolent drug offenders in prison. By way of comparison, since 1988, the state has reduced its annual budget for higher education by $615 million.33 According to data cited in the Commission's report, fully 6,834 of prisoners incarcerated in New York for drug offenses were never convicted of a violent felony. Ninety-one percent of the 8,521 drug offenders sentenced to state prison in New York were either convicted of possession or one of the three lowest level drug offenses.34 As noted above, a higher percentage of New York's prisoners are committed for drug offenses than any other state.

Poor Prescription: The Costs of Imprisoning Drug Offenders in the United States

Some years back I contacted the warden of a prison here in Delaware. She said that about EIGHTY PERCENT of the population of that prison (which is constantly overcrowded, BTW) is there for drug violations. That leaves 20% for the rest of them, violent offenders and all the rest.

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Not a day goes by that I don't see something that reinforces my belief that people are idiots.

If there are 300+ million residents in the U.S, then 2,3 million is hardly one out of 100. That is not to mention that at least 10% of your population propably belong in the slammer, so I guess you to need build far more "warehouses".

__________________

It all comes down to this on election day: Are you a racist, or do you look down on spastics?

The war on drugs is idiotic since it mostly punishes wictimless crime.

Better to use the resources getting all the scumfucks away from society, and God knows that America has its fair share of scumfucks.

__________________

It all comes down to this on election day: Are you a racist, or do you look down on spastics?

No one has posted on this thread for 2 weeks, then you write a totally worthless post and waste my valuable time.

Of course, considering what it says in your sig, it is pretty obvious most of your posts are likely to be worthless.

Oh man, I couldn't agree more.

When computer hackers get caught, they end up getting hired by IBM and others. When people who've been caught cheating at casinos, counting cards and using electronic devices and whatever, they get hired by the casinos and paid well.

Why not use that strategy when it comes to drugs? You get caught with cocaine? Alrighty then, now you have to lead us to the bigger fish or then we come down on you.

But it's hard. Americans are brainwashed by the shit they see on tv and the crap their politicians say. On one hand the American people are very cynical of their gov't, but on the other, they just fall in line like little kids when the gov't beats any kind of "War on Whatever" drum. I just don't get it.