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  #121 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2009
Joint Chiefs of Staff Member

 
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Re: Obama picks Sotomayor for Supreme Court

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doctor Who View Post
So this woman is one of the more liberal judges on the second appelate court. She has stated at a Duke University gathering that she believed the court is there to "set policy". That will come back to haunt her.

She has also stated that personal experiences "affect the facts that judges choose to see." "I simply do not know exactly what the difference will be in my judging," she said in a speech in 2002. "But I accept there will be some based on my gender and my Latina heritage."

That statement screams "I won't be applying the law equally." Not exactly what you want from a judge much less a Supreme Court judge.

I'm not sure that I see her being confirmed. From the vetting reports I have seen, she may have some trouble with some of the moderate Democrats. Also, the report that Republicans will not filibuster because she is Hispanic and Dems will use that against them would be hypocritical on their (dems) part.

Obama picks Sotomayor for Supreme Court - White House- msnbc.com

I disagree with your interpretation.

She did not say the court was there to set policy, but the reality was that the court does set policy in real life practice.

And having a particular gender/race bias experience does NOT mean she would be applying the law unequally, but that she would know more first hand about how harmful it is when law is applied unequally, and would be more careful to avoid that.

For instance, in the CA case where the courts just ruled against gay marriage, a more sensitive judiciary would realize that it is the function of the courts to protect minorities from mob rule.
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  #122 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2009
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re: Sotomayor chosen as SC nominee (academic discussion)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cosmic Zamboni View Post
Judge Sotomayor seems to think that her experience as a Latina woman gives her a superior perspective in judicial matters than that of a white male. At least that is what she said in her 2002 remark, "I would hope that a wise Latina woman with the richness of her experiences would more often than not reach a better conclusion than a white male who hasn't lived that life."

I am a white male. I was born into abject poverty in Appalachia in the 1950's. My family lived in two rooms with no running water, and outhouse, bare wood floors, heated with coal picked up from along side the railroad tracks. In the 1960's I watched TV as people like me and my family were made fun of by Hollywood in shows like "The Beverly Hillbillies". We struggled to do better, never collecting a dime of welfare although my parents were grateful for the surplus commodities that were distributed in the community.

Has Judge Sotomayor experienced any of these things? Can she relate to the notion that a white male such as myself might have risen out of poverty to become well educated and a financially successful professonal? Would she ever bring herself to look beyond my whiteness and my maleness? I find myself wondering these things about her. Female-ness and Hispanic-ness tell me nothing in particular about this woman because I have an adopted daughter of Mexican origin genetically, and she shares nothing in the way of common experience with this judge just because of her gender or skin color.

This woman seems trapped in a time warp in which minority people cannot seem to see outside of the minority discrimination box they have painted themselves into from the comments she has made. It is troubling.


Of course not all white males are spoiled and insensitive; but you have to admit that the majority are, and judges like Scalia are representative of privilege.
An example is where Scalia dissented on the ruling agains the Texas sodomy laws. He said that if you make homosexuality legal, there will be no way to prevent gay marriage.
And one should ask whether or not that is the real activism and danger, when judges promote the bias of the majority.

At least by increasing awareness of minorities, there is far less likelihood of abuse as there is now.
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  #123 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2009
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re: Sotomayor chosen as SC nominee (academic discussion)

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheHighForester View Post
Ashkenazi constitute most of the surviving Jews of Europe. They are descended from Jews who lived in medieval Germany and who gradually migrated toward the East in fairly large numbers. Through centuries of residence and intermarriage in Europe, they ceased to be ethnically identifiable with the Jews who inhabited ancient Israel and who were "dispersed" by the Romans. And while they possess "cultural" characteristics which distinguish them from their immediate neighbors, it is not accurate to say that their culture has much in common with the Jews of the Near East. While they "maintain their separate cultural identity," it is not a "Jewish" cultural identity.

In general I agree.

Small point in that the Ashkenazi probably started as Khazars in the Crimea, and later migrated west to Germany.

Quote:
Khazar : Any member of a confederation of Turkic-speaking tribes that established a commercial empire in European Russia in the late 6th century. A people of the northern Caucasus region, the Khazars allied with the Byzantines against the Persians in the 7th century and warred with the Arabs until the mid-8th century. Their empire extended westward along the Black Sea, and they controlled trade routes and exacted tribute from their neighbors. The ruling class adopted Judaism and maintained close relations with the Byzantine emperors. The Khazar empire began to decline in the 10th century and was crushed by Kiev in 965.
Khazars: Information from Answers.com

And a Jewish/Hispanic connection is reasonable because the Sephardi were the second largest branch of the Diaspora, and were rooted in the Iberian Penninsula.

Quote:
A descendent of the Jews who lived in Spain and Portugal during the Middle Ages until persecution culminating in expulsion in 1492 forced them to leave.

{Medieval Hebrew səpāraddî, Spaniard, from səpārad, Spain, adoption of Hebrew səpārad, placename of disputed location (mentioned at Obadiah 20).}
Sephardi: Definition from Answers.com

Sepharic basically means Spanish Jew.
But it is interesting that the Sephardim are much closer both racially and culturally to ancient Israelites than Ashkenazi are, although Ashkenazi out number the other.
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  #124 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2009
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re: Sotomayor chosen as SC nominee (academic discussion)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Imperator View Post
uhm she walked back when she said it, in the vid.....before she was chosen. She knew what she was saying was verboten.
Yes, but what she said was the truth, or at least the way it is supposed to be.
You can't have things like public referendum establishing constitutional amendments, without careful judicial restriction; or else you have mob rule.
She was not saying that is how she wanted it, but simply what is and has to be.
The only thing that ever protect the minority from the majority in a democracy, is the judiciary.
Otherwise the poor would make laws to take all the money from anyone who tried to become wealthy, until everyone was equally poor.
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  #125 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2009
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re: Sotomayor chosen as SC nominee (academic discussion)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maat222 View Post
Yes, but what she said was the truth, or at least the way it is supposed to be.
You can't have things like public referendum establishing constitutional amendments, without careful judicial restriction; or else you have mob rule.
She was not saying that is how she wanted it, but simply what is and has to be.
The only thing that ever protect the minority from the majority in a democracy, is the judiciary.
Otherwise the poor would make laws to take all the money from anyone who tried to become wealthy, until everyone was equally poor.
Welcome to the land of double standards. IF say; Scalia had said what she said, using ‘white male’ in place of ‘Latina women’, well we know what would have happened, her exclusionary or say, separate mindset, are her words, no one made them up, anyway, Scalia never would have gotten near the door of the senate let alone a nomination. But once again, identity politics and protected speech for some ala Orwell and the well worn phrase, some animals are more equal than others. That’s some message to send.

Thankfully she has many years on the bench from which I am sure everything from here to the day shes confirmed will be parsed.
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  #126 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2009
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re: Sotomayor chosen as SC nominee (academic discussion)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mudwhistle View Post
Portugal is connected to or part of the same land-mass as Spain where all Latinos have their roots. It's almost like claiming everyone of Welsh decent is not British. Portugal - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Portugal is also derived from Latin like Spanish is as well.

You want the MSM to be right so much you're willing to stick your neck out for them it seems.
are you familiar with Jewish-ness?

apparently not.
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  #127 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2009
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re: Sotomayor chosen as SC nominee (academic discussion)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maat222 View Post
Yes, but what she said was the truth, or at least the way it is supposed to be.
You can't have things like public referendum establishing constitutional amendments, without careful judicial restriction; or else you have mob rule.
She was not saying that is how she wanted it, but simply what is and has to be.
The only thing that ever protect the minority from the majority in a democracy, is the judiciary.
Otherwise the poor would make laws to take all the money from anyone who tried to become wealthy, until everyone was equally poor.
Except that isn't the point she was making. What you are describing is judicial review and not policy making (which is what she described). What she said is a clear violation of the seperation of powers.
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  #128 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2009
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Re: Obama picks Sotomayor for Supreme Court

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maat222 View Post
For instance, in the CA case where the courts just ruled against gay marriage, a more sensitive judiciary would realize that it is the function of the courts to protect minorities from mob rule.
It is the court's function to rule according to the law regardless of how they feel about it
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  #129 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2009
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re: Sotomayor chosen as SC nominee (academic discussion)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maat222 View Post
Of course not all white males are spoiled and insensitive; but you have to admit that the majority are
Can you provide proof of that assertion?
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  #130 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2009
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re: Sotomayor chosen as SC nominee (academic discussion)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mudwhistle View Post
Portugal is connected to or part of the same land-mass as Spain where all Latinos have their roots. It's almost like claiming everyone of Welsh decent is not British. Portugal - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Portugal is also derived from Latin like Spanish is as well.

You want the MSM to be right so much you're willing to stick your neck out for them it seems.
What about Jews? Did their language, culture, and ethnicity come from Latin as well?
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  #131 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2009
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re: Sotomayor chosen as SC nominee (academic discussion)

According to NBC News, during the years that Sotomayor has served on the federal bench, first as District Court Judge and more recently as a member of the Court of Appeals, more than 400 of her decisions have been reviewed by higher courts. Of those 400, only three have been overturned--all on "technical" grounds. If the NBC report is accurate, that would suggest that her "judicial philosophy" is has not led her to make decisions which are at odds with the prevailing view among other federal jurists, or the US Supreme Court. I think that the Republican attention-seekers are going to have a hard time getting anything concrete from her past judicial performance to use against her, and they will alienate not only Hispanics but virtually everyone else who believes in giving the nominee a fair hearing if they are not VERY careful.
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  #132 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2009
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re: Sotomayor chosen as SC nominee (academic discussion)

Quote:
Originally Posted by mudwhistle View Post
Portugal is connected to or part of the same land-mass as Spain where all Latinos have their roots. It's almost like claiming everyone of Welsh decent is not British. Portugal - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Portugal is also derived from Latin like Spanish is as well.

You want the MSM to be right so much you're willing to stick your neck out for them it seems.
There are quite a lot of Welsh and Scots who insist that they are NOT British.
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  #133 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2009
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re: Sotomayor chosen as SC nominee (academic discussion)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mrs. M View Post
Are you saying that there aren't any Hispanic Jews?????
There aren't that many, most of them left when Ferdinand and Isabella started burning them alive.

Besides, as this applies to Cardozo, the name comes from Portugal, from where his ancestors fled to Holland (King John of Portugal wanted to marry Ferdinand and Isabella's daughter, Ferdinand asked him if he was a good Christian, so King John had a big Bonfire and threw in 4000 Jews, proving he was a good Christian, Ferdinand let him marry his daughter).
So Cardozo could be considered Dutch, except his family(still Jewish) went from Holland to the British Colonies around 1740.
All this time the family stayed Jewish, lived in jewish neighborhoods, went to temple, ate kreplach, not chourico.


OTOH, Cardozo's ancestors would have had to pass through Spain at some time to get to Portugal, but if you're going to do that, then why not call him African-American, after all, his ancestors did come from Africa.

And from now on, I'm Trojan, if anyone asks..............
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  #134 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2009
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re: Sotomayor chosen as SC nominee (academic discussion)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maat222 View Post
Of course not all white males are spoiled and insensitive; but you have to admit that the majority are, and judges like Scalia are representative of privilege.
An example is where Scalia dissented on the ruling agains the Texas sodomy laws. He said that if you make homosexuality legal, there will be no way to prevent gay marriage.
And one should ask whether or not that is the real activism and danger, when judges promote the bias of the majority.

At least by increasing awareness of minorities, there is far less likelihood of abuse as there is now.

Where the hell did you learn that one? This is one of the most ridiculous statements I've read.
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  #135 (permalink)  
Old 05-27-2009
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re: Sotomayor chosen as SC nominee (academic discussion)

Quote:
Originally Posted by goober View Post
There aren't that many, most of them left when Ferdinand and Isabella started burning them alive.

Besides, as this applies to Cardozo, the name comes from Portugal, from where his ancestors fled to Holland (King John of Portugal wanted to marry Ferdinand and Isabella's daughter, Ferdinand asked him if he was a good Christian, so King John had a big Bonfire and threw in 4000 Jews, proving he was a good Christian, Ferdinand let him marry his daughter).
So Cardozo could be considered Dutch, except his family(still Jewish) went from Holland to the British Colonies around 1740.
All this time the family stayed Jewish, lived in jewish neighborhoods, went to temple, ate kreplach, not chourico.


OTOH, Cardozo's ancestors would have had to pass through Spain at some time to get to Portugal, but if you're going to do that, then why not call him African-American, after all, his ancestors did come from Africa.

And from now on, I'm Trojan, if anyone asks..............
I know the history, thank you.
I was responding to this comment:

Quote:
Originally Posted by mechadave:

Can't you ever admit that you were wrong?

Jews aren't Hispanic by any stretch of the imagination. Get off of it.
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