Don’t say you have not been warned…..I have said before and will again- if he gets in watch out, clinton said in 91 when he was campaiging that anyone under 200K would not get a tax hike and would get a cut, we all knowhow that turned out........not only will Obama raise taxs, BUT when the Bush taxes cuts expire in 2010, and he will let them expire mark my words, watch out, if you’re single and making above 60K good luck, if you’re married making above 90K you are dead meat….

NON redundable tax credits are NOT a tax cut, he keeps calling them tax cuts, they are not, it is giving gov. money ( our money) to folks who have paid zero net taxs, and here it is in a nutshell, he’ll “spread it around”…




Obama to Plumber: My Plan Will 'Spread the Wealth Around'


Barack Obama told a tax-burdened plumber over the weekend that his economic philosophy is to "spread the wealth around" -- a comment that may only draw fire from riled-up John McCain supporters who have taken to calling Obama a "socialist" at the Republican's rallies.

Obama made the remark, caught on camera, after fielding some tough questions from the plumber Sunday in Ohio, where the Democratic candidate canvassed neighborhoods and encouraged residents to vote early.

"Your new tax plan is going to tax me more, isn't it?" the plumber asked, complaining that he was being taxed "more and more for fulfilling the American dream."

"It's not that I want to punish your success. I just want to make sure that everybody who is behind you, that they've got a chance for success too,"

Obama responded. "My attitude is that if the economy's good for folks from the bottom up, it's gonna be good for everybody ... I think when you spread the wealth around, it's good for everybody."


Obama to Plumber: My Plan Will 'Spread the Wealth Around' - FOXNews.com Elections

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No individual can plan his own existence in their view.

So the state planners must arrogate to themselves the right to manipulate any sector of the economic system if the good of “society” or the “general welfare” is paramount.

Ipso- if the rights of the individual get in the way, the rights of the individual must be sublimated.

The Road to Serfdom
FA Hayek (interpretation)


Mortgage Backed Security survivor

Were you not around during the Clinton years? "We all know how that turned out..." Yes, we do. It was a great time. Why are you so concerned with people making over $250,000 per year? A $250K/yr family and a $90K/yr family are in VASTLY different places in life. The $250Kers are not average, working-class Americans. Does that make you an elitist?

I - and pretty much everyone I know - would prefer not to have our wealth spread around.....

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"On my signal, unleash hell."

Are you below or above the 250K level?

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Nothing sways the stupid more than arguments they can't understand.
Cardinal de Retz

"My mother would have said that a woman voting for John McCain
is like a chicken voting for Colonel Sanders." - Cecile Richards, TX

this matters?



and mitch-


its called brackets and its called history, the point was IF you believed Clinton you got lied too, why should we believe Obama who is in an infinitely worse place vis a vis the economy?
Clintons cuts didn't appear and the marginal rates on everyone above 40K went up...when bush cuts expire it won't be just tax credits, it will be BRACKETS resetting....do you understand that difference?

as far as 250K and a 90K family being in vastly different places...uhm I beg to differ....by the time the 250k family gets soaked they are around AGI oh, 175K…the 90k family settles in at 75-80K….as an average lets say….out here in the valley, that difference means little.

__________________
No individual can plan his own existence in their view.

So the state planners must arrogate to themselves the right to manipulate any sector of the economic system if the good of “society” or the “general welfare” is paramount.

Ipso- if the rights of the individual get in the way, the rights of the individual must be sublimated.

The Road to Serfdom
FA Hayek (interpretation)


Mortgage Backed Security survivor

I could swear I've seen this in at least one other thread.

Yes, Obama actually said those words to a plumber (who apparently made over 250,000 per year)....spread the wealth.

So the Pavlovian response is for Obama detractors to stand up and yell..."Wealth Redistribution!! Wealth Distribution!!!".... "Wait! Socialism!!!"


The problem with this as a campaign talking point is that it's an oversimplification..... but worse, it's not helpful to McCain politically. Most people in this country make less than $250,000 and would actually not mind being the beneficiary of tax cuts while their wealthy bretheren get taxed more.

The cries of "It's not fair!" from people that make over a quarter million dollars a year are going to fall on deaf ears.... especially in this economy.

__________________

Congratulations President-Elect Obama

Mind your own business.

I shall just maintain this stance - my money is mine, go earn your own.

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"On my signal, unleash hell."

In my experience, a difference in income of $100K/yr after taxes is a significant difference in lifestyle. The difference between having a 2-car garage with an in-the-ground swimming pool and just a driveway with a backyard patio.

Not to mention, the difference between sending your children to high-quality public schools, and paying $12k/yr to send them to a private school of equal quality.

Apparently, Joe (the plumber) was not overly impressed by St Obaaaama's response. Oops. There goes a vote! Better get another few more 'voters' registered...

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"On my signal, unleash hell."

Well All I know that if your business increases profits by 2% and income tax goes up 1%. Then I still have more money in my pocket...

It's the economy stupid!

Ask any true business man that...

I'm curious - how much of Obama's personal wealth has he been re-distributing of his own accord? If this is actually what he believes, there's nothing stopping him from doing it with his own money today.

Matt

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De duobus malis, minus est semper eligendum

IMHO, It is not an oversimplification and the protestations will not fall on deaf ears. Having the federal gov't hand out money to people who do not pay taxes is by definition "income redistribution". It is not a "tax cut". There is no "grey area", there is no "nuance" - it is what it is. CAN WE EVER CALL A SPADE A SPADE?

Whenever I hear Obama supporters telling McCain people what "won't work for McCain" - I have to chuckle. Then I know it is a winning issue. Normal people want to earn a higher income, they aspire to it. They believe that one day they will be earning 250K or more and they don't want to punish themselves (or their "brethren") for being ambitious and succesful. IMHO, Americans instinctively recognize "income redistribution" (theft) is wrong and will not stand for it. The only way they'll go for it is if they are misled, like Obama is attempting to do.

Of course if you are a lazy, drug dependent, bum, that was raised in a welfare home, grew up eating government cheese, was indoctrinated in a gov't school, and registered to vote by ACORN......??? well, you'd probably go for it. In that case - vote for Obama!! He's gonna give you money!...Yee HAW!!!! .....

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I think at this point there needs to be a focus on an immediate increase in spending and I think this is a time when deficit fear has to take a second seat . . . I believe later on there should be tax increases. Speaking personally, I think there are a lot of very rich people out there whom we can tax at a point down the road and recover some of the money."
-- Barney Frank, October 20, 2008

Damn...that is just a..damning statement.
As one can tell from my avatar title...I am NOT for income redistribution.
Hearing Obama stand there and tell this guy that taking his hard earned money is good for him as well as the underachievers Obama wants to give it to is a weeee bit too much for me to take.

Well, his tax plan will raise taxes on him...

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"Jesus said: I have cast fire upon the world, and behold I guard it until it is ablaze."
Gospel of Thomas

It's not taxes...it is yet ANOTHER form of welfare forced donations.