people have to condem palestine in order to be righteous enough to condem israeli settlements. that is my oppinion. anyone who solely focuses on israeli injustices against palestine is either woefully uninformed or incredibly bigoted.

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www.myspace.com/crusade7

Heh; but i hate the French...

Anyway i thought "De Trap" was your mouth...

The "We don't care" refference is to international law; which we don't care about. Its just your opinion i coudn't care less about, there are loads of worthwhile posters here to debate.

I guess I am not one of the "worthwhile posters" because I make arguments which you can't dream of challenging. So you are correct, it is not worthwhile for you to argue against someone like me, knowing that you would lose.

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If a neocon whines about big government wealth redistribution, just ask him what he thinks about the portion of that big government that sends aid to Israel.

Its not that i wouldn't dream of challenging you...its just you parrot all the crap of some of the other terror lovers here do...but its just that they're...well more fun and personable, and to be honest better debators than you. I'd rather debate them to be honest; i'd crush you too easily.

Go ahead and prove it then. Already, I can see you are resorting to ad hominem before you even start the debate.

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If a neocon whines about big government wealth redistribution, just ask him what he thinks about the portion of that big government that sends aid to Israel.

Obama, Clinton and McCain have already pledged their undying support for Zionism, despite the warnings of the Baker Report, the Israel Lobby paper and various high-profile and authoritative opinion such as Carter's 'Peace or Apartheid ' book.

Where is the voice of opposition to bankrolling Israel ? Surely, there must be a growing movement that recognises the folly of indefinite blind support ?

I don't know, moon, where is it? You pretend such in depth knowledge, so surely you can tell us?

Matt

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De duobus malis, minus est semper eligendum

I do ? You wouldn't like to link to any such claim, would you Larson ?

No, of course you wouldn't. You just like to see threads Larsonated.


Does America support ethnic cleansing, apartheid and the subjugation of minorities ? Why then, is there no high-profile dissenting voice ?

So it appears as thought Traveler's debating skills have failed even before he started debating.

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If a neocon whines about big government wealth redistribution, just ask him what he thinks about the portion of that big government that sends aid to Israel.

Moon,
It's simple demographics, you get more money and more votes being pro Israel than you get being Pro Islam.

On some issues, people can be on both sides, for example so much of the pro-choice vote goes Democratic on social justice issues, that it makes sense for the GOP to pro-life, because it gets the more money and votes out of whats left after the "would never vote Republican ever" demographic is taken out of the mix.

Anyway, these are all sideline issues, the only real big issue is money, everything else is posturing to get the votes to win the offices to get to hand out the money.

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“ The subjects of every state ought to contribute towards the support of the government, as nearly as possible, in proportion to their respective abilities; that is, in proportion to the revenue which they respectively enjoy under the protection of the state.”

Adam Smith , The Wealth of Nations 1776

"We have always known that heedless self-interest was bad morals; we know now that it is bad economics"
FDR's second Inaugural Address

Goober;
OK, but where is the principle, where is the opposition to more years of turgid Middle East war as a platform. Surely people can see that something is amiss when no candidates whatsoever represent the other side ?

In debate they are very keen to go on record as believing that 'both sides are in the wrong' and wearing their best Sunday-go-to-meeting suits of impartiality but there's not a squeak out of them not so much as even a fucking question as to why they won't have the opportunity to put their vote where their mouth is because NO PRO-ISLAM CANDIDATE EXISTS.

And that's the way they like it, Goober.

Israel is held to a standard that no country, especially America, would ever hold itself to. Would America just sit by while Canadians blow each other up and blow up Americans? I didn't think so.

As long as muslims kill each other, vote for terrorist groups to represent them, and have a unified goal of eliminating all Jews(something I don't think is reciprocated in the "mission statement" of Israel) than Israel has the moral authority and the backing of peace loving and progressive nations around the world.

Yes, it pisses me off when Israel responds disproportionally to getting attacked, as we saw in the conflict last summer. Hezbollah is a threat, Israel responded too harshly, but guess what? As long as muslim fanatics are out to destroy Israel, they have a right to defend themselves.

That's why there isn't a pro-Islam candidate running for president. Although there are a couple of muslims who serve in the Congress though.

And by the way, yes, I'm for moderate muslims, but the elephant in the room is that Islam isn't a "peaceful" religion. Kill people and get 72 virgins? As long as that's part of your personality cult, it can't be taken seriously by actual peaceloving people around the world. The nation of Islam treats women very poorly, it abandons rational thinking, it hates anything Jewish or different. Tell me how that's peaceful? This bullshit about all people's beliefs being sacred and this stigma about religions as though they are all "peaceful" is just nonsense. It's self-righteous indignation at it's worse. I just can't accept any longer that organized religions are "good" and "secular" people like me are lost or bad. Time to tear down that wall.

Jason Marcel;
Stupifying self-righteousness.

Israelis also kill each other, the assassination of the Israeli Prime Minister, by a Messianic hit-man, being a high-profile case in point. They also have a demonstrable tradition of voting for terrorist groups to represent them, the difference being that their terrorist groups are sanctioned by America.

Who the fuck are you to proclaim an Islamic 'mission statement' for the 'elimination of all jews' ? The best you'll be able to come up with is the so-called 'Charter', written in the 1980s and un-fucking-signed by anybody. You're a Zionist propaganda sucker.

Also, there are elements within the Knesset who do have a mission of ethnically cleansing all of Palestine so even your 'Charter' is in fact 'reciprocated'. The Zionist gameplan, since at least 1942, has been to cleanse Palestine by 'brutal compulsion' *

As for 'moral authority and the backing of peace-loving and progressive nations around the world', well, that's evidence in itself that you're simply disseminating misinformation of a pro-Zionist nature. EVERY country in the world, with the exception of Uncle Slam and a few bought-and-paid-for Pacific islanders has damned Israel on many, many voting occasions. Many countries do not even recognise the Israeli State.
You are talking baseless piddle. In fact, it's belief in piddle like this that is responsible for the unjust lurching of an insanely one-sided Middle East policy.


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