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  #76 (permalink)  
Old 07-30-2007
Traveler Traveler is offline
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Re: Only 2 GOP Candidates Agree to YouTube Debate

Yeah every GOP President has won your state but the electoral college will never ever be gotten rid of, it can't be...its one of the foremost parts of our constitution and the founding of our democracy.

I don't mind the fact my state is gerrmandered, i'd always vote GOP and the state will always remain Red, this way it means i don't have to vote as i know which way my state is going.
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  #77 (permalink)  
Old 07-30-2007
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Re: Only 2 GOP Candidates Agree to YouTube Debate

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLastBoyScout View Post
Kind of hard for the Repub candidates to appear 'hip'. But here's there chance and they're opting out.

Perhaps their total lack of effort to reach out to young voters is what's disconnecting them from America's younger generation.
When Republicans try to appear hip, the results are a grisly failure. It's like when Democrats try to appear strong on defense; the words might be correct, but they don't really understand the way of thinking or the tone and attitude. It goes against the grain.

Does anyone in their right mind really believe Hillary or Obama would be an effective commander-in-chief? Does anyone in their right mind really think Mitt Romney would appear convincing doing the "I'm so young and free even though I am in my 50s" routine that Bill Clinton perfected?

There is a "perpetual youth" obsession in the US, and the left understand that. To me, it is sickening. But millions of people share it.

Republicans do very well with younger voters through policies. Right now Bush is exceptionally unpopular with younger voters. That is definitely a problem. But the idea that we are living in some sort of left-wing resurgence is fantasy-world thinking. The divisions in this country are still about the same - and if the Dems don't wake up to that fact, they will pay a price.,
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  #78 (permalink)  
Old 07-31-2007
White Rabbit's Avatar
White Rabbit White Rabbit is offline
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Re: Only 2 GOP Candidates Agree to YouTube Debate

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve View Post
You're out of your mind if you think I'm right-wing.
You wouldn't be the first to accuse me of such, though your impetus towards incivility when challenged does seem worthy of comment.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve
Why would you think that? Because I don't bow to the supposed majesty of liberalism?
No. Because you actually used the rightwing/partisan definition of liberalism and implicitly assumed others shared it (even acting surprised when another poster questioned it).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve
I'll tell you this: I think it's every bit as fucked up as the supposed majesty of conservativism...
That's called spin. That has nothing to do with the topic at hand - it is an attempt to divert the topic away.

Nothing personal. I'm just working with your posted words here.
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  #79 (permalink)  
Old 07-31-2007
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Re: Only 2 GOP Candidates Agree to YouTube Debate

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve View Post
Of course, and it takes no great effort to decipher this, you accused me of being partisan before I made that statement. Also, the question specifically asked about liberals. It wouldn't have made sense to talk about anything but liberals.
No, I addressed my statement to you based upon your post, quoted above where you made the typical rightwing partisan liberal attack. See post #71.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve
So, are you just going to dodge, or are you going to tell me where, in the statement you first repsonded to, where I was partisan?
I already answered this querry. See post #71.
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  #80 (permalink)  
Old 07-31-2007
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Re: Only 2 GOP Candidates Agree to YouTube Debate

Quote:
Originally Posted by White Rabbit View Post
You wouldn't be the first to accuse me of such, though your impetus towards incivility when challenged does seem worthy of comment.


No. Because you actually used the rightwing/partisan definition of liberalism and implicitly assumed others shared it (even acting surprised when another poster questioned it).


That's called spin. That has nothing to do with the topic at hand - it is an attempt to divert the topic away.

Nothing personal. I'm just working with your posted words here.
If you'd like to truly know how "right wing" I am, go find some of my posts regarding abortion, gay marriage, and prayer in schools. I think you'll find they're nowhere near the opinions of anyone who's "right wing"...
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  #81 (permalink)  
Old 07-31-2007
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Re: Only 2 GOP Candidates Agree to YouTube Debate

Quote:
Originally Posted by White Rabbit View Post
No, I addressed my statement to you based upon your post, quoted above where you made the typical rightwing partisan liberal attack. See post #71.


I already answered this querry. See post #71.
I'm really not trying to make you look silly.

You made this statement (which is the one I responded to) in post #60: And I've never seen you post anything that wasn't extremely partisan.

Basically, you accused me of being partisan before I said anything which was partisan. I expressed equal disgust with both parties. Somehow, I guess, you feel that doing so is showing deference to one party over the other.

That doesn't make a bit of fucking sense, but so be it.

And you still dodge my question which asked you which part what partisan.

Typical...
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  #82 (permalink)  
Old 07-31-2007
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Re: Only 2 GOP Candidates Agree to YouTube Debate

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim View Post
When Republicans try to appear hip, the results are a grisly failure. It's like when Democrats try to appear strong on defense; the words might be correct, but they don't really understand the way of thinking or the tone and attitude. It goes against the grain.
Perhaps the more important point I was trying to make is that the YouTube Audience is younger. The Repubs could reach out to them however they saw fit not necessarily including appearing to be hip. But opting out means they miss the opportunity to introduce themselves to the younger demographic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim View Post
Does anyone in their right mind really believe Hillary or Obama would be an effective commander-in-chief?
I think there's a lot of people that believe Obama would... I think there's a lot of people that believe Hillary would. I'm not a party to the latter, but I'm pretty sure there's a healthy portion of those people who are sane and intelligent.

That's a pretty stupid question really.... I mean Were you in your right mind when you voted for George Bush?...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim View Post

There is a "perpetual youth" obsession in the US, and the left understand that. To me, it is sickening. But millions of people share it.
You act as if this is either a new phenomenon or one that's localized to the U.S. The quest for the fountain of youth has been around for thousands of years and it's currently a media obsession in just about every country of the world.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim View Post
Republicans do very well with younger voters through policies. Right now Bush is exceptionally unpopular with younger voters. That is definitely a problem. But the idea that we are living in some sort of left-wing resurgence is fantasy-world thinking. The divisions in this country are still about the same - and if the Dems don't wake up to that fact, they will pay a price.,
The left has a lot of leverage these days, but rather than being earned, it was handed to them by the incompetence of the Republican leadership. The Bush administration has given the far left so much ammo that they've nearly wet themselves with excitement.

It's not some kind of resurgence, but there's a good chance we'll see a Democratic president this time around.
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  #83 (permalink)  
Old 07-31-2007
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Re: Only 2 GOP Candidates Agree to YouTube Debate

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLastBoyScout
I think there's a lot of people that believe Obama would... I think there's a lot of people that believe Hillary would. I'm not a party to the latter, but I'm pretty sure there's a healthy portion of those people who are sane and intelligent.
I think Hillary can handle the c-in-c role. Her dedicated work on the Senate Armed Services Committee has been quite remarkable. Her competence on military issues is quite impressive.

I'd say Hillary would be able to match or beat any challenger on the table on actual knowledge of military issues. I'm talking about someone that doesn't need to be prepped by a flunky to answer a question.

And after G.W. Bush's handling of that function, it certainly would be hard to actually be a worse c-in-c than G.W. Bush. The US military has been dangerously weakened by short rotations under Bush's command.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLastBoyScout
The left has a lot of leverage these days, but rather than being earned, it was handed to them by the incompetence of the Republican leadership. The Bush administration has given the far left so much ammo that they've nearly wet themselves with excitement.
A very good observation.

I agree completely which is why I'm afraid that the Democratic Party just miight actually nominate a real lefty (like Edwards) or a total neophyte that they want to believe is a real lefty (like Obama).

If one polls Daily Kos members (for example) where the place is overrun with Democratic party activists and card-carrying members of the Democratic party, you'd find that Edwards is favored by about 65% of them with Obama at 25% and Hillary at 5% and the rest less than that. That is totally un-representative of the Democratic Party membership at large.

The Democratic Party has spent many years tacking back to the center and now are poised to profit from that. A hard tack to the left would be the worst possible outcome.

As far as I see the Democratic Party, Hillary is a strong centerist in the Clinton tradition (which means the rightwing of the Democratic party) and the rest of the party is all far to the left of that point.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TheLastBoyScout
It's not some kind of resurgence, but there's a good chance we'll see a Democratic president this time around.
Again, I agree. The election belongs to the Democratic candidate to lose. If they don't screw it up, they will very likely win it. This is not due to any upsurge in the vitality, popularity or energy of the Democratic party, but to the toxic government style and general incompetence of the Bush administration. Of that, I have no doubt. Many of the same kind of idiots who nominated Dukakis some 20 years ago still mostly run the party.
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  #84 (permalink)  
Old 07-31-2007
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Re: Only 2 GOP Candidates Agree to YouTube Debate

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve View Post
You made this statement (which is the one I responded to) in post #60: And I've never seen you post anything that wasn't extremely partisan.

Basically, you accused me of being partisan before I said anything which was partisan.
That point was derived from your posts in other threads.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve
I expressed equal disgust with both parties. Somehow, I guess, you feel that doing so is showing deference to one party over the other.
My feelings have nothing to do with it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve
That doesn't make a bit of fucking sense, but so be it.
The part you just declared to be nonsense was your own inferrence, not mine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve
And you still dodge my question which asked you which part what partisan.
I pointed out the post in this thread that was the relevant answer to your question (twice). That you may perhaps disagree does not negate this fact.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve
Typical...
An underwhelming point. Indeed, likely as not, it is another one that requires one agreement with your definitions to make sense.
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  #85 (permalink)  
Old 07-31-2007
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Re: Only 2 GOP Candidates Agree to YouTube Debate

Quote:
Originally Posted by White Rabbit View Post
That point was derived from your posts in other threads.


My feelings have nothing to do with it.


The part you just declared to be nonsense was your own inferrence, not mine.


I pointed out the post in this thread that was the relevant answer to your question (twice). That you may perhaps disagree does not negate this fact.


An underwhelming point. Indeed, likely as not, it is another one that requires one agreement with your definitions to make sense.

So many words, yet you say so little.

I've got plenty of posts here which express opinions which would never be confused as "conservative" or "left wing". Perhaps, then, you'd be kind enough to explain exactly how I'm "partisan" when I criticize libs and conservatives...
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  #86 (permalink)  
Old 08-01-2007
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White Rabbit White Rabbit is offline
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Re: Only 2 GOP Candidates Agree to YouTube Debate

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve View Post
So many words, yet you say so little.

I've got plenty of posts here which express opinions which would never be confused as "conservative" or "left wing". Perhaps, then, you'd be kind enough to explain exactly how I'm "partisan" when I criticize libs and conservatives...
Sorry, the subject doesn't interest me nearly as much as it does you.
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  #87 (permalink)  
Old 08-01-2007
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Re: Only 2 GOP Candidates Agree to YouTube Debate

Quote:
Originally Posted by White Rabbit View Post
Sorry, the subject doesn't interest me nearly as much as it does you.
You also possess the absolute inability to back up something you say...

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