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  #196 (permalink)  
Old 12-10-2007
PaleoRepublican PaleoRepublican is offline
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Re: What is wrong with Ron Paul?

Quote:
Nope, I did not deny the Holocaust. Please don't lie.
"Holocaust denier" is a cliche used to mock people who reject common knowledge.

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I guess you really don't know what slavery is.
Slavery is an organized institution which screws a bunch of people so the top 1% can make a buck. The 'foreign cheap labor' agenda.

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Since you embrace all economic-slavery arguments then you should also agree that "the negro slavery of the south is more humane then the wage slavery of the north."
No, I shouldn't, because your argument is totally retarded, having nothing in common, and totally baseless. Perhaps you should wait until the meth high wears off before posting?
You should agree with it, southern Democrat free-traders use to use this line 150 years ago, in defense of slavery.

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So what exactly am I guilty of?
Selling your country out for a buck.

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Even black slaves earned money, they just didn't earn much. Brush up on your history.
Prove it.
Behold, the 'holocaust denier' thinks the slaves didn't earn money.

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Quote:
People who say the constitution should be interpreted, also say it is a living document. Libertarians and Democrats say that.
You still have not proven your claims about me.
Actually people who say the Constitution 'should' be interpreted also say it is a living document. Libertarians and Democrats say that the most. Like you.

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You deny that all nations on the planet throw up tariffs, for their own selfish interests.
Another dishonest and baseless statement.
Show me one nation which unilaterally decides to remove all tariffs and import restrictions. You deny reality.

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Quote:
You deny the basic reason NAFTA and WTO exists. Countries don't uniltaterally and suicidally lower their tariffs to zero.
More lies.
Show me one nation which unilaterally decides to remove all tariffs and import restrictions. You deny reality.

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If you think business can hire any foreigner they want, then they would make naturalization laws and unilaterally regulate foreign commerce.
Argument does not connect. Irrational.
The powers of naturalization, international trade, and tariffs belongs to Congress. YOU LIBERTARIANS think that companies should be able to hire whoever they want, trade with whoever they want, and not pay any tariffs. You free-traders think Companies have extra-Constitutional rights, over Congress.

You have a problem with the Constitution, you have a problem with the US.

Quote:
Quote:
You disagree with the wisdom of the founding fathers, therefore you disagree with the Constitution.
Statement based on unproven premises.
You deny what you said earlier.

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You constantly bash Americans for earning too much money, being lazy and unproductive, then turn around and praise Communist CHina.
Where have I praised communist China?
You free-traders have nothing but glowing love for China. How wonderful China is. How great it is to do business in China. How much $$$$$ you can make off the cheap labor there.

You deny your motives.

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Slavery doesn't necessarilly need shackles and a bullwhip, it can be a banker and a billy club.
Look up "slavery."
Definitions of slavery on the Web:

work done under harsh conditions for little or no pay
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

Describes when some individuals are owned by others as their property.
Glossary of terms (Chinese Communist citizens are the property of the Communist state)

the system of one person "owning" another
Kentucky Civil War Vocabulary Words (I just 'owned you', slave.)

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Quote:
Free trade is a necessary requirement for slavery, which is proof that free-traders want to bring slavery back.
Logical fallacy.
Then why did the Southern states secede under threat of a higher tariff from Lincoln? You deny reality. You deny logic. You deny common sense. You deny what you say 1 minute earlier.
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  #197 (permalink)  
Old 12-10-2007
PaleoRepublican PaleoRepublican is offline
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Re: What is wrong with Ron Paul?

February 26, 2007
Free Trade and Funny Math

By Patrick J. Buchanan

Quote:
To the devout libertarian, free trade is not a policy option to be debated, but a dogma to be defended. Nowhere is this more true than at that lamasery of libertarianism, the Cato Institute.

But with America running the worst trade deficits in history, the monks are having a hellish time of it. Hence, like the neocons who cherry-picked the intel to stovepipe to Scooter to bamboozle us into believing national survival hung on invading Iraq, they feed us irrelevant truths and deny us the whole truth.

Case in point—the Feb. 22 column in The Washington Times by one Daniel Ikenson, "associate director at the Cato Institute's Center for Trade Policy Studies." Bewailing the "barrage of hyperbole and misinformation about trade and its relationship to jobs and economic growth," Ikenson assured us, with impressive statistics, that globalism is working out wonderfully well for America.

"The Census Bureau data show that U.S. export growth was phenomenal in 2006, increasing by 14.5 percent. ... Exports to Europe increased by 15.2 percent and to China by nearly 32 percent. The growth in exports to Japan was a slower 7.5 percent, but it grew. Since 2001, U.S. exports have increased by more than 42 percent."

Wow. Phenomenal indeed. And it does sound like we are cleaning those foreigners' clocks. But Ikenson ignored the other side of the ledger.

That the U.S. trade deficit in 2006 rose to an all-time record of $764 billion. That the deficit in goods hit $836 billion. That the deficit with China rose 15 percent, from $203 billion in 2005 to $233 billion in 2006, the largest trade deficit ever recorded between two nations. That the deficit with Japan rose to $88 billion, the largest ever between us.

Under Bush, the U.S. trade deficit has set five straight world records, as has the U.S. trade deficit in autos, parts and trucks. So reports Charles McMillion of MBG Services, who has for years tracked the decline and fall of American manufacturing.

For manufactured goods, our trade deficit rose to $536 billion, from $504 billion. In Bush's six years, America has run a total trade deficit of $2.6 trillion in manufactured goods, as 3 million U.S. manufacturing jobs have disappeared and wages in that sector have fallen 3 percent in three years.

Query to Ikenson: If these numbers represent a successful trade policy, what would a failed trade policy look like?

Recall NAFTA. In 1993, we had a trade surplus with Mexico. Some of us warned it would be gone with the wind if NAFTA passed. And NAFTA did pass, through the collaboration of Clinton Democrats with Gingrich Republicans, over the opposition of the American people.

Since 1994, we have run a trade deficit with Mexico every year. In 2006, it hit a record $60 billion. Grand total: almost $500 billion in trade deficits with Mexico since NAFTA. Mexico now exports more than 900,000 vehicles to the United States every year, while the United States exports fewer than 600,000 cars and trucks to the entire world.

This is success?

Where did Mexico get an auto industry? Is it good that our auto industry is being exported? Has the price of a new car plunged because Mexicans get paid a fraction of what U.S. autoworkers earn?

"In 2006, the U.S. economy grew by an additional 3.4 percent," writes Ikenson. True, and China's economy grew by 10 percent—and by 140 percent over the last 10 years, tripling the growth in the United States. Not only are we shipping factories, technology, equipment and jobs to China, we are exporting our future to China.

Nor should this shock any student of history. For contrary to free-trade mythology, every nation that has risen to pre-eminence and power—Britain before 1860, the United States from 1860-1914, Germany from 1870-1914, postwar Japan, China today—has pursued a mercantilist or protectionist trade policy.

Economic nationalism is the policy of rising powers, free trade the policy of declining powers. For great powers have ever regarded trade as an arena of struggle in the clash of nations. It is no accident all four presidents who made it to Mount Rushmore were protectionists.

"Thank God I am not a free trader," wrote Theodore Roosevelt. "Pernicious indulgence in the doctrine of free trade seems inevitably to produce fatty degeneration of the moral fibre."

Think Teddy might have had a point, Mr. Ikenson?

Probably not. For libertarianism is an ideology, and evidence that contradicts the dogma of an ideology is to be disregarded or denied. For the dogma cannot be wrong.

Indeed, should Ikenson awake from his dogmatic slumber and decide that free trade is failing America, he would not last long as associate director of the Cato Institute's Center for Trade Policy Studies. The folks who fund Cato are not paying to have dogma debated, but defended. For if the dogma be untrue, then the ideology, the whole system of beliefs, the faith itself, is called into question. And we can't have that.

Last edited by PaleoRepublican; 12-10-2007 at 03:17 AM.
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  #198 (permalink)  
Old 12-10-2007
PaleoRepublican PaleoRepublican is offline
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Re: What is wrong with Ron Paul?

Ron Paul's (free-trader) spam machine is actually more involved:

Ron Paul Poll Experiment Results | Malagent's Domain
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  #199 (permalink)  
Old 12-10-2007
PaleoRepublican PaleoRepublican is offline
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Re: What is wrong with Ron Paul?

Karl Marx delivered this address before the Democratic Association of Brusels, 9 January, 1848

Quote:
... Besides this, the protective system helps to develop free trade competition within a country. Hence we see that in countries where the bourgeoisie is beginning to make itself felt as a class, in Germany for example, it makes great efforts to obtain protective duties. They serve the bourgeoisie as weapons against feudalism and absolute government, as a means for the concentration of its own powers and for the realization of free trade within the same country.

But, in general, the protective system of our day is conservative, while the free trade system is destructive. It breaks up old nationalities and pushes the antagonism of the proletariat and the bourgeoisie to the extreme point. In a word, the free trade system hastens the social revolution. It is in this revolutionary sense alone, gentlemen, that I vote in favor of free trade.
Karl Marx / On the Question of Free Trade
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  #200 (permalink)  
Old 12-10-2007
PaleoRepublican PaleoRepublican is offline
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Re: What is wrong with Ron Paul?

Ron Paul isn’t interested in opening foreign markets, the only thing Ron Paul is interested in is removing all US trade barriers.

Ron Paul thinks it saves the consumer money to purchase items made by cheap foreign labor. Ron Paul is wrong. Consumer items from China are just as expensive as ‘Made In America’. I still haven’t seen one example of how ‘Made In China’ is drastically cheaper then ‘Made In America’, especially at the cost of high paying manufacturing jobs.

The Chinese government through internal taxes and export tariffs on outgoing goods, marks up the price. (They get to purchase a 1st world military in the process, real stupid. Really really stupid and shortsighted.)

The company in China which manufactures the goods, marks up the price.

The warehouse which receives the items at the docks, marks up the price.

Meanwhile Joe 6-pack Republican wonders why taxes on the rich would hurt the American worker if capital is only used to invest in foreign countries and foreign workers.

Free-trade (with cheap labor as the only object) is destroying the Republican Party. Republican voters have already recoiled in horror, shouting with one voice, against Amnesty AND the guest worker proposal. The immigration issue is all about cheap foreign labor and Joe 6-pack knows it.
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  #201 (permalink)  
Old 12-10-2007
Slon Slon is offline
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Re: What is wrong with Ron Paul?

Quote:
Originally Posted by PaleoRepublican View Post
"Holocaust denier" is a cliche used to mock people who reject common knowledge.
Keep your retarded posts to yourself, please.
Quote:

Slavery is an organized institution which screws a bunch of people so the top 1% can make a buck. The 'foreign cheap labor' agenda.



You should agree with it, southern Democrat free-traders use to use this line 150 years ago, in defense of slavery.



Selling your country out for a buck.



Behold, the 'holocaust denier' thinks the slaves didn't earn money.



Actually people who say the Constitution 'should' be interpreted also say it is a living document. Libertarians and Democrats say that the most. Like you.



Show me one nation which unilaterally decides to remove all tariffs and import restrictions. You deny reality.



Show me one nation which unilaterally decides to remove all tariffs and import restrictions. You deny reality.



The powers of naturalization, international trade, and tariffs belongs to Congress. YOU LIBERTARIANS think that companies should be able to hire whoever they want, trade with whoever they want, and not pay any tariffs. You free-traders think Companies have extra-Constitutional rights, over Congress.

You have a problem with the Constitution, you have a problem with the US.



You deny what you said earlier.



You free-traders have nothing but glowing love for China. How wonderful China is. How great it is to do business in China. How much $$$$$ you can make off the cheap labor there.

You deny your motives.



Definitions of slavery on the Web:

work done under harsh conditions for little or no pay
wordnet.princeton.edu/perl/webwn

Describes when some individuals are owned by others as their property.
Glossary of terms (Chinese Communist citizens are the property of the Communist state)

the system of one person "owning" another
Kentucky Civil War Vocabulary Words (I just 'owned you', slave.)



Then why did the Southern states secede under threat of a higher tariff from Lincoln? You deny reality. You deny logic. You deny common sense. You deny what you say 1 minute earlier.
Well, since you have not proven anything yet, I'm going to ignore your posts. Things you have not proven but have said:

"Even black slaves earned money, they just didn't earn much. Brush up on your history."

"the free-traders think the Constitution should be "interpreted", it is a "living document." "

"You deny that all nations on the planet throw up tariffs, for their own selfish interests."

"You deny the basic reason NAFTA and WTO exists."

"You disagree with the wisdom of the founding fathers,"

"You...then turn around and praise Communist CHina."

Just some of the things you have not yet proven. Some you probably won't prove ever.
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  #202 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2007
PaleoRepublican PaleoRepublican is offline
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Re: What is wrong with Ron Paul?

YouTube - ABC News Coverage of 'The Great NAFTA Debate,' 1993

^^^^Who the free-traitors sleep with: Algore.
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  #203 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2007
Jason Marcel's Avatar
Jason Marcel Jason Marcel is offline
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Re: What is wrong with Ron Paul?

What's wrong with Ron Paul is that he is an inconvenience to the neo-con wing of the Republican Party, who utter words of peace and limited gov't and fiscal responsibility, while they chart the way for aggressive wars, the largest expansion of the federal gov't in decades and have doubled the debt, which should clock in at around $10 trillion by January 2009. Meanwhile Ron Paul has backed up his words with action his entire career.

He's such a splendid find this primary season, the only candidate who doesn't make you feel like you must settle for the lesser of two evils.

Of course Ron Paul wouldn't be able to downsize the gov't as much as he'd like, but to stop the illegal wars and do away with the torture prisons, while getting troops out of Germany and Japan and elsewhere to secure our own borders first, and then getting rid of the Dept. of Homeland Security would be a pretty successful year for all of us. Those moves would make us safer while it would reduce our out-of-control spending.

How ironic that this Republican, pitted against Hillary let's say, would actually be able to take the high ground by saying she voted for the war, not him. He would invalidate all the arguments that people have against the neo-con controlled Republican Party at the moment.
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  #204 (permalink)  
Old 12-14-2007
Steve's Avatar
Steve Steve is offline
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Re: What is wrong with Ron Paul?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Marcel View Post
How ironic that this Republican, pitted against Hillary let's say, would actually be able to take the high ground by saying she voted for the war, not him. He would invalidate all the arguments that people have against the neo-con controlled Republican Party at the moment.
And he would still get his ass kicked.

Only in your scenario, he's get his ass kicked by a girl...
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  #205 (permalink)  
Old 12-15-2007
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trobinett trobinett is offline
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Re: What is wrong with Ron Paul?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slon View Post
I see people calling RP a nut much of the time, but why do they think that? Why do so-called "conservatives" shrink from the idea of electing a small-government republican?
Americans like WINNERS, Ron Paul isn't one.
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  #206 (permalink)  
Old 12-15-2007
Slon Slon is offline
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Re: What is wrong with Ron Paul?

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Originally Posted by trobinett View Post
Americans like WINNERS, Ron Paul isn't one.
I guess you have a point. To be a winner in America, one often has to be a piece of shit liar like Bush.
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  #207 (permalink)  
Old 12-16-2007
PaleoRepublican PaleoRepublican is offline
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Re: What is wrong with Ron Paul?

Quote:
I see people calling RP a nut much of the time, but why do they think that? Why do so-called "conservatives" shrink from the idea of electing a small-government republican?
Quote:
Originally Posted by trobinett View Post
Americans like WINNERS, Ron Paul isn't one.
Or, Paulites are too stupid to realize that in order to shrink the goverment, you have to physically remove Democrats from office. In order to do that, you don't piss off tens of millions of Americans by shipping their jobs overseas and turning them into Democrat voters for life.
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  #208 (permalink)  
Old 12-16-2007
PaleoRepublican PaleoRepublican is offline
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Re: What is wrong with Ron Paul?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Marcel View Post
... getting rid of the Dept. of Homeland Security would be a pretty successful year for all of us. Those moves would make us safer while it would reduce our out-of-control spending.

Only a nut would think getting rid of policing powers would make people safer.

This is the same nutty arguments I have heard Democrats make on transportation, "Well if you build more roads, it will just make traffic worse, more cars will drive the roads." Then the morons vote against any transportation funding, and force feed all the money into light rail.

Libertarians and Democrats are both counter-intuitive through and through, "Well if we just get rid of the cops, it will make us safer."
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  #209 (permalink)  
Old 12-18-2007
Jason Marcel's Avatar
Jason Marcel Jason Marcel is offline
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Re: What is wrong with Ron Paul?

Quote:
Originally Posted by PaleoRepublican View Post
Only a nut would think getting rid of policing powers would make people safer.

This is the same nutty arguments I have heard Democrats make on transportation, "Well if you build more roads, it will just make traffic worse, more cars will drive the roads." Then the morons vote against any transportation funding, and force feed all the money into light rail.

Libertarians and Democrats are both counter-intuitive through and through, "Well if we just get rid of the cops, it will make us safer."
You don't make any sense.

Under Bill Clinton, America increased the number of cops in America. Drastically.

I've never heard anyone ever say that if we build more roads, it will make traffic worse. Complete crap. Who'se ever said that?

Getting rid of Homeland Security should be done immediately. Could never have imagined that under a conservative president that they would expand the federal gov't to such a ridiculous degree that there is now a whole entire part of the gov't that is in business to help co-ordinate the CIA, the FBI, and FEMA and other huge federal agencies. Billions of additional dollars of taxpayers money being wasted on a venture that still isn't up and running and leaves people to wonder what it is they actually do.

Homeland Security before 9/11 would not have prevented it from happening. Good police and investigative work would have. It's that simple.

You can't call yourself a conservative any longer and be for huge gov't overreaching and expansion that is unnecessary and wasteful.

So you can say whatever you want Paleo, you're obviously a big gov't neo-liberal fascist who thinks that America ought to control every other nation instead of working with them. That's not a conservative ideal, and what this new generation of conservatives is doing is actually along the liberal-fascist lines.

Don't the neo-cons even know that they aren't new or conservative in any way?
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  #210 (permalink)  
Old 12-18-2007
Slon Slon is offline
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Re: What is wrong with Ron Paul?

Quote:
Originally Posted by PaleoRepublican View Post
Or, Paulites are too stupid to realize that in order to shrink the goverment, you have to physically remove Democrats from office. In order to do that, you don't piss off tens of millions of Americans by shipping their jobs overseas and turning them into Democrat voters for life.
So what you're saying is we need to dump our beliefs? Doesn't that kind of defeat the purpose of getting into office?
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