Originally Posted by Jason Marcel

You don't make any sense.

Under Bill Clinton, America increased the number of cops in America. Drastically.

I've never heard anyone ever say that if we build more roads, it will make traffic worse. Complete crap. Who'se ever said that?

Getting rid of Homeland Security should be done immediately. Could never have imagined that under a conservative president that they would expand the federal gov't to such a ridiculous degree that there is now a whole entire part of the gov't that is in business to help co-ordinate the CIA, the FBI, and FEMA and other huge federal agencies. Billions of additional dollars of taxpayers money being wasted on a venture that still isn't up and running and leaves people to wonder what it is they actually do.

Homeland Security before 9/11 would not have prevented it from happening. Good police and investigative work would have. It's that simple.

You can't call yourself a conservative any longer and be for huge gov't overreaching and expansion that is unnecessary and wasteful.

So you can say whatever you want Paleo, you're obviously a big gov't neo-liberal fascist who thinks that America ought to control every other nation instead of working with them. That's not a conservative ideal, and what this new generation of conservatives is doing is actually along the liberal-fascist lines.

Don't the neo-cons even know that they aren't new or conservative in any way?

Originally Posted by Slon

So what you're saying is we need to dump our beliefs? Doesn't that kind of defeat the purpose of getting into office?

Originally Posted by PaleoRepublican

Your beliefs are wrong, I have no problem with dumping Libertarians from the Republican Party.

Originally Posted by Slon

It's right to hold a gun to employers' heads in order to force them to hire the most incompetent person for the job?

Originally Posted by PaleoRepublican

I have no problem with dumping Libertarians from the Republican Party.

Originally Posted by PaleoRepublican

Libertarians and Democrats are both counter-intuitive through and through, "Well if we just get rid of the cops, it will make us safer."

Originally Posted by Steve

Every so often, amongst the rest of his posts which make no sense, Slon raises the art of the nonsensical post to its' apex...

Originally Posted by drgoodtrips

I've seen hardcore, self-described Libertarians espouse this point of view (it might make people with enough money to hire private security forces safer, but not the public at large). I think you'd be hard pressed to find a democrat say this - Democrats generally seem to support as many people receiving government paychecks as possible, and unions to boot.

The Libertarian and Democrat philosophy on government scope and size is diametrically opposed. As a non-libertarian Republican (I'm assuming, given what I've read of your posts here - correct me if I'm wrong), you're a lot more ideologically aligned with the Democrats than the libertarians are.

Originally Posted by drgoodtrips

I've seen hardcore, self-described Libertarians espouse this point of view (it might make people with enough money to hire private security forces safer, but not the public at large). I think you'd be hard pressed to find a democrat say this - Democrats generally seem to support as many people receiving government paychecks as possible, and unions to boot.

The Libertarian and Democrat philosophy on government scope and size is diametrically opposed. As a non-libertarian Republican (I'm assuming, given what I've read of your posts here - correct me if I'm wrong), you're a lot more ideologically aligned with the Democrats than the libertarians are.

Originally Posted by Slon

It's right to hold a gun to employers' heads in order to force them to hire the most incompetent person for the job?

Originally Posted by drgoodtrips

Actually, that makes sense all around. GWB and big-government social conservatives have made the current platform of the GOP an odd hybrid between liberal fiscal/foreign policy and conservative social policy. Some realignment may be in order - the values of the Christian "right" are more conducive to the Democrat platform anyway.

There doesn't seem to be much ideological difference between Republicans and Democrats anymore. It'll be interesting to see what sort of ideological realignment occurs. "Neoconservatives" could probably find themselves pretty comfortable with the far left if they could see fit not to squabble over inane issues like abortion and gay marriage.

Originally Posted by drgoodtrips

I've seen hardcore, self-described Libertarians espouse this point of view (it might make people with enough money to hire private security forces safer, but not the public at large). I think you'd be hard pressed to find a democrat say this - Democrats generally seem to support as many people receiving government paychecks as possible, and unions to boot.

The Libertarian and Democrat philosophy on government scope and size is diametrically opposed. As a non-libertarian Republican (I'm assuming, given what I've read of your posts here - correct me if I'm wrong), you're a lot more ideologically aligned with the Democrats than the libertarians are.

Originally Posted by Slon

Thing is, cops are not a replacement for private security. Cops don't have to protect you, legally. Traditionally and practically, their job is to enforce government-supporting laws and victimless crime legislation (such as speeding). In essence, it is to help the government and give you a hard time, not protect you. In other words, YOU are personally responsible for your protection (which can involve things like carrying a gun or personally paying for a guard), while police are legally responsible for busting you for bullshit offenses, giving you a hard time in general, and investigating your murder in the most incompetent manner possible hours/days/months/years after it happens.

Originally Posted by PaleoRepublican

There you go again, accusing Americans of being incompetent because Americans earn more then 50 cents an hour.

Originally Posted by Slon

First of all, I accused SOME Americans of being incompetent. Second, answer the question and stop dodging.