It is clearly a liberal policy no matter how you slice it. Education is a "State" issue, not Federal. The federal government should be limited strictly to it's 'enumerated powers' and Congress rightfully may exercise only those powers that are stated in the Constitution, limited by the Bill of Rights and the other protections found in the Constitutional text. Any others?

__________________
"My friends, we live in the greatest nation in the history of the world. I hope you'll join with me as we try to
change it." -- Barack Obama

(bolding added)

This remark--respectfully and with constructive intent--makes me ask maybe the person with the race issue may be yourself--"If this is the black ideology in this country, during this time, during this generation, then how can the entire country trust a Presidential candidate, who is supposed to represent [b]ALL[/B." Now it's all blacks?

American Churches are still filled to the brim with people and I highly doubt agree with 100% of every pastors' words or church dogma that was said in them in a 20 year period. I'm not one who does that, and I don't know any who do.

I can fully understand what Obama said what he said on Wright, as McCain himself says about people like Hagee and others. Both have condemned things they have heard said that they didn't like, and still recognised the greater goods in the people themselves and the overall messages they have carried.

I give Obama and McCain much credit on that. I even find it to be Christian in deeds beyond the words.

I'm mentioning McCain in the same breath because, to date, he has similarly run a classy affair. When he caught one of his campaigners creating a YouTube video designed to cast Obama--through Wright--as Farrakhan (a person Obama even denounced), Malcolm X, the lyrics of Public Enemy the rap group, etc, McCain fired him and apologised, saying his campaign wasn't going to those sewers. When talk radio conservative Bill Cunningham did the stump speech stressing 'Hussein,' McCain renounced it and him. Cunningham then went on FOX and his show to trash McCain and endorse Hillary.

The amount of race baiting on Obama, IMO, out there that I've seen has been horrendous.

What I am about to say below is not intended to put any words in your mouth. They are my own. But, I hope they provide food for thought.

For example, he's now a black nationalist due to Wright.

Funny how he was a secret Muslim beforehand, right? Attended a madrassah, right? At least that is what the turban photo was supposed to show and--of course--his name being Barack Hussein (yep, a Muslim tyrant) Osama (yep, a Muslim terrorist) . . . oops . . . Obama (not a real American with a name like that anyway), used a Qu'ran or something else besides the Bible to swear into his Congress seat, won't pledge allegiance, etc.

Obama is vicariously liable for every word his former minister ever said, and anything he said that was controversial automatically voids all other words and lifelong considerations. Funny how that doesn't seem to apply to anyone else in, let's say, the 'churches were whites go.'

Now, it's his new minister that is being framed as a black nationalist too, ad nauseam and Obama is vicariously liable for him too.

Obama isn't allowed to speak of himself, only his critics and enemies can do that for him.

And of course, the double standard reigns that no controversial thing must ever be said or else all who attend are in total agreement, all churches where 'white people go' exempted.

But, Obama is a liar about his Christianity anyway because he didn't go to the same minister on Easter, even though Easter hadn't occurred. That's because he's really a radical secret Muslim.

IMO, no white person would ever tolerate this crap. I wouldn't. And I think it may be his doom in this election--not that his platforms are disagreeable to those who vote against him, but that prejudice did him in too.

__________________
James Hoban. Irish Architect. Member of the Royal Dublin Society. Hoban designed and built the White House and based it upon the top exterior and interior two floors of Leinster House, then known as Kildare House, which is now the current Irish Parliament building. He was also a supervisory architect of the US Capitol Building.

Yeah see, Alex you definitely have opinions. But you are rapidly becoming the minority. America has had laissez faire and tax cuts for 8 years. The economy has suffered.

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If you stop trying to bring the Bible into the classroom, I'll stop secretly sneaking biology textbooks into the pews on Saturday nights. Deal?

If the flag is precious to YOU, then don't burn YOURS.

The MSM is who believes Obama. They claim that Obama's speech was the best, simply the best ever. They refuse to cover the story anymore and because most of America uses the MSM as their news source the story is going away. All they had to do was get him to shut his mouth for awhile so it would die down.

Using Hillary as a foil doesn't prove anything ether. The only difference between the two of them where honesty is concerned is Hillary can't get away with her lies anymore. Obama still can.

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“The only thing standing between Joe Biden and the presidency is his mouth.”

- Michele Malkin

So anything short of a retraction of all the federal education/research funding, legislation, and standards (which have been in action to some degree for over a hundred years)..... is considered to be liberal?

I'd say that no one in congress, the senate, or the white house could be considered to be conservative in this regard.

Defining things in such an idealized and polarized way seems to explain the apparent anger you hold. Hell, if your pissed at Obama, you must plain hate the Federal government and politics in general.... there's a lot of dissent inherent in that stance.. What are you......Anti-American?

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Screw Change!! Let's have a Seamless Transition of Power and Policy.. John McSame in 2008!

__________________
We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile....

Either a policy expands government powers or it doesn't. Essentially any program that is not specifically enumerated by the Constitution documents and the bill of rights is by definition "liberal", because it requires a 'liberal' interpretation of those documents in order to be deemed lawful. A true conservative understands that government is a necessary evil, not some benevolent surrogate parent for the populace. We are a Republic of 50 'individual' states. The federal government was designed to operate within a very strict area. The individual states were left to decide the rest as they saw fit. That way, if an individual state chooses to elect representatives that increase taxes, spending and entitlement programs, it will suffer as the taxpaying businesses and residents of the overburdened state leave for greener pastures in the neighboring states. This competition between states is good and necessary to preserve limited government. We were never intended to have a Federal Government that confiscates so much of the wealth of the nation each year. The Federal government has become so large it is proposterous. They spend so much money that they really cannot even keep track of it anymore.

The Federalist Society and The Heritage Foundation are two conservative organizations that I respect.

So, we have a choice in November - a liberal democrat will do what a liberal democrat always does - increase and expand government. McCain probably will do the same, but to a lesser extent. Therefore I will vote for McCain.

__________________
"My friends, we live in the greatest nation in the history of the world. I hope you'll join with me as we try to
change it." -- Barack Obama

so, in the heat of a moment he said something that was incorrect, uhm, no he said something he regretted as it was bad form, alie, or just bad tate?
Is that correct?

and we forgive him...yes?



cool, then we are getting somewhere.



here there the words of the Obamites....

the words of the prophets are written on the subway walls….

so, the people bowed and prayed and gave thx for the Obama…

__________________
We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;
For he to-day that sheds his blood with me
Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile....

With all due respect. You're not going to infer that I am a racist.

It was the author of the message that I was addressing "whom" was stating: That ALL black inner city churches preach this kind of hate "at least" 2% of the time in their churches. I didn't say that, another did. By the way, I don't believe it.

My representation to ALL means that Barack Obama needs to be representative of ALL, which means Everyone in this country. As common sense would tell us, he can't be representative of all, if he is a 20 year member of a racist, separatist church. Regardless if it is a white church or a black church.

Let's be honest here:

If the shoe were on the other foot, & Hillary Clinton was just found to be a 20 year member of a white racist church. And we had her pastor all over T.V. making the same comments. And lets say she had the lead in the popular vote & the delegate vote, just as Obama has. The super delegates would be running toward Barack Obama right now, & her party would be calling for her to drop out of the Presidential race.

This is the double standard in this country. Just as you quickly & without regard to what or whom I was addressing, tried to infer that I was a racist. Barack Obama, in your mind, gets away with actually being a 20 year member of a racist-separatist church, simply because he is black.

To add to your lenghty comment: There were no notable racial issues in this campaign, until we all got to hear Obama's 20 year pastor, sound off.

I don't see how you could say I am "pissed" at Obama. I'm not pissed at anyone. In fact Obama is a very likable man. I simply disagree with his views, voting record and his proposed policies. Yes, I sincerely hope that he is not elected as POTUS, but if he is, I will hope that he does well for the country. For me, that means less interference in our lives, so I will most likely be disappointed.

PS- I've never described 'honest' debate about America or it's policies as "anti-american". Obama's mentor talking about 'chickens coming home to roost' or "white mans greed" is not honest debate, it is demagoguery.

__________________
"My friends, we live in the greatest nation in the history of the world. I hope you'll join with me as we try to
change it." -- Barack Obama

OK. Thank you for illustrating your ideology.

I would characterize that as radical federalism. By that standard almost every federal government policy conceivable is liberal.

Is there any modern politician in America that conducts himself as a conservative by your definition? If you could put anyone in as president, who would it be? Ron Paul?

__________________


Screw Change!! Let's have a Seamless Transition of Power and Policy.. John McSame in 2008!

So because of a couple snippets over a 20 year period--longer in Wright's case--this is the conclusion. I'm just trying to get an exchange over why. I am glad you don't see yourself as racist. I don't believe you are in the way most use the term (bigot), but there are subtle things we all see or miss by our experiences that lead to bias. I've even caught them in me too. It's generally fallacious for anyone, myself included, to claim they are absolutely free of biases, noticed or unnoticed.

Explain to me why, then, are you not equally bashing and applying the same strict policy towards the large number of evangelicals who say such highly controversial things, including blaming Americans' behaviours as bringing on 9.11, Katrina, etc, as God's wrathful response, attacking gays, liberals and all sorts of Americans and blaming them for American tragedies through heaven's wrath, etc:

YouTube - The Religious Reaction to the 9/11 Attacks

YouTube - John Hagee says God sent Katrina

McCain and/or other GOPers have long expressly courted the very people or kinds of people in these videos. You'll be running out of people to vote for, or even neighbours, if such a view is applied to everyone equally as Obama.

I'm not anti-homosexual for example. I don't believe it should be outlawed and punished. Churches may differ on their views, but the Catholic one certainly condemns it. Yet, by going to the Mass (I was raised in the Quaker and Catholic churches), I don't believe all Catholics are strongly anti-homosexual or even any kind of anti-homosexual on a personal level. Opinions will range across the map on it. I know plenty of Baptists. I'd be hard pressed to assume most agree with leaders like those in the video who find homosexuals to be abominations and that they are actually a reason God made 9.11 happen to the US.

The fact, I believe, is that people attend churches and do alot of discriminating about the things they hear. Had Obama endorsed those controversial comments of Wright, that would be a much different story. I couldn't vote for a person who endorsed them. He's also repudiated Farrakhan's endorsement when called to do so, and that's even better than watching McCain seek and then reaffirm, over objections in the public, the endorsements of anti-Catholic bigot Hagee and other firebrands. But, McCain when, in courting the religious right, to state his own mind that he does not agree with many controversial things they have said too. I accept that. John McCain, like Obama, are allowed to speak their own minds on matter of faith as well as social policy. Nobody speaks for another by a proxy. Everyone speaks for themselves. That is the kind of fairness I am speaking about.

__________________
James Hoban. Irish Architect. Member of the Royal Dublin Society. Hoban designed and built the White House and based it upon the top exterior and interior two floors of Leinster House, then known as Kildare House, which is now the current Irish Parliament building. He was also a supervisory architect of the US Capitol Building.

Well, I was just getting a little smarmy and sarcastic.. sorry for that.

I think the thing about Obama's pastor is that he's just a citizen..... yes, he has a long-term close relationship with Obama, but Obama hasn't demonstrated that he believes in any of the whacked out views that Wright expressed in the video clips.

One can characterize Obama's relationship with his pastor as:

1)- Something to fear... ie. Obama secretly embraces the wacko ideals and might impugn the government and our country (or maybe just "Whitey") from within.
2)- A political miscalculation that questions his ability to obfuscate things from the American public.
3)- An honest relationship that Obama never intended to deny or run away from just for the sake of political expediency.


I, personally am not afraid of any of those characterizations as I don't see the first as realistic, and the second 2 I actually view as assets to character and honesty.

__________________


Screw Change!! Let's have a Seamless Transition of Power and Policy.. John McSame in 2008!

First you wrote: This is essentially an appeal to not use labels. You are upset that people like me are calling Obama a liberal, and you want us to stop, ostensibly, for our own good.


Then after I briefly outlined my political views you respond.
SO apparently labels are only OK to use when applied by you? But calling Obama, (who is a liberal democrat) a liberal democrat (gasp!) is divisive? You must suffer from political schizophrenia.

As for you question - I did like Ron Paul on domestic issues, but he is too far out in left field with regards to foreign policy. We've allowed ourselves to get entangled in a lot of thorny situations in the world that will require delicate actions rather than the hasty withdrawal that Paul suggests. So I am left with John McCain. McCain is far from perfect, he is simply the lesser of two evils.

__________________
"My friends, we live in the greatest nation in the history of the world. I hope you'll join with me as we try to
change it." -- Barack Obama