Yes. Both parties have little roadblocks, I forget how the RNC handles their peasant revolts, to keep some 'renegade populist' from upsetting the Establishment apple cart.

I do wonder just why the Obama fanatics think Obama is some sort of maverick 'outsider', despite all evidence to the contrary; I would have thought that sort of image-making fluff would be too hokey for the 'new millenium', but obviously it works just as well now as it did 200 years ago.

In any case, as an outsider to both parties and having no personal interest whatsoever in which shill wins, as they're all the same to me, it would seem the DNC would run Hillary in the general election, not Obama. His base is the racist black vote, and 20 somethings. Is this really enough to win against McCain? I don't think so, and the DNC really doesn't want to lose all that cash flow and bribery into their pockets to the Republicans yet again. Hillary has the broader base.

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"The real question of life after death isn't whether or not it exists, but even if it does, what problems this really solves." - Ludwig Wittgenstein

"A day without sunshine is, you know, night."- Shannon

Drama, we need more Drama.

The only reason for all of this is Drama, to get the people to think that the people have a choice when it is the Board Rooms that have already made the choice for President 2008.

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Fear the Government

In that case, Obama won't be president. No one who is interested in the economy will choose a far-left candidate who is strongly anti-business and promotes enormous tax increases.

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"Our fears in Banquo
Stick deep; in his royalty of nature
Reigns that which would be fear'd: 'tis much he dares;
And, to that dauntless temper of his mind,
He hath a wisdom that doth guide his valour
To act in safety."

Macbeth 3:1

sorry wrong thread.

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Is our children learning? -George W. Bush

"I think—tide turning—see, as I remember—I was raised in the desert, but tides kind of—it's easy to see a tide turn—did I say those words?"—Washington, D.C., June 14, 2006

"[T]he illiteracy level of our children are appalling."—Washington, D.C., Jan. 23, 2004

I think that if there had not been months and months of scrutiny on the Democratic process and on the superdelegates it would've been easy for Hillary to work some kind of "backroom" deal at the convention. But the fact of the matter is that these issues are in public eye (as they should be) and it means superdelegates will have to be very transparent about who they support and why. Last night she seemed to be moving towards a more positive tone, because she knows that she has to. Last night Obama began his general election campaign against John McCain and I suspect he will start to ignore Hillary more and more if she attacks. She didnt have a game changing win in Pennsylvania. Every delegate advantage she makes up will be lost in North Carolina. As well as the popular vote because North Carolina is going to be a blowout for him. Most damning for Hillary is the growing sense that she is to blame for the negative tone of the race, rather than Obama. For Democrats who are feeling overwhelmed and fatigued by the process the frontrunner, Obama will seem like an increasingly attractive choice.

In a lot of ways Republicans should be concerned about the long Democratic primary. Does anyone know anything about McCain's plan for the economy yet? No, the media is just covering the Democrats. Democratic turn out is HIGH, every primary breaks previous records, Democrats are being registered in high numbers. Both campaigns are establishing huge volunteer networks in every state, it will not be hard to get those networks working together. Nearly every Hillary surrogate has pledged to work hard for Obama in Novemeber. Rendell will deliver PA and the OH guy will deliver that state. Florida may be lost, but Obama puts Colorado, Virginia, Missouri, Minnesota, and the Pacific Northwest in play in ways that Hillary does not.

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Yesterday, John McCain actually said that if he’s president he’ll take on, and I quote, 'the old boys’ network in Washington.' I’m not making this up. This is somebody been in Congress for 26 years, who put seven of the most powerful Washington lobbyists in charge of his campaign. And now he tells us that he’s the one who’s gonna take on the old boys' network,” he said. “In the McCain campaign that’s called a staff meeting!- Obama, 9/17/2008

Interesting post. You are certainly correct about the high turnout among Dems and the greater enthusiasm, and until this point McCain has been allowed allowed to remain quiet. Who wants to hear him when we can watch the Dems duke it out? Even I would rather watch the Dems.

But that won't last.

One thing I disagree with: Obama ignores Hillary Clinton at his peril.

The PA primary was a major blow to his campaign as it raises the question of electability. He HAS to address it. Ignoring her is like ignoring a ferocious pit bull with its teeth in your leg...

__________________
"Our fears in Banquo
Stick deep; in his royalty of nature
Reigns that which would be fear'd: 'tis much he dares;
And, to that dauntless temper of his mind,
He hath a wisdom that doth guide his valour
To act in safety."

Macbeth 3:1

Hillary also has problems of electability. Her negatives are through the roof. And even if she does win all of her attacks on Obama can and should be used against her. Experience? Compare hers to McCain's. Toughness? McCain was is being tortured for years. Change? Almost everything will be considered change after Dubya. And let's not forget this woman oozes insincerity and her speeches are dripping with lies.

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Is our children learning? -George W. Bush

"I think—tide turning—see, as I remember—I was raised in the desert, but tides kind of—it's easy to see a tide turn—did I say those words?"—Washington, D.C., June 14, 2006

"[T]he illiteracy level of our children are appalling."—Washington, D.C., Jan. 23, 2004

This is a media myth that doesn't hold water if you ask me. It questions his electability against an opponent where there is 98% agreement on policy. Therefore voters in ALL these primaries have been voting for the candidate most like them, who they identify with and who best represents their vision of the future. These are highly emotional, and mostly irrational, reasons for supporting or not supporting Hillary. This is why, annoyingly, we've been talking about dumb stuff like Bittergate or Bosnia sniper fire, these two don't have substantive policy issues.

In November however, it's a whole different ball game. Does anyone seriously believe that Obama will not win PA in the general? Or New York, California the other true blue "big states" that Clinton has won? If McCain's argument is "Im going to do 4 more years of Bush economy because Obama said "bitter' or because of Obama's church and Obama is laying out specific policy proposals to attack the recession more Americans are going to vote Democratic." Yes the PACs will make Obama seem unpatriotic they will, as he predicted, play the Wright clips over and over and over again. Meanwhile gas prices will continue to go up, inflation will go up and people will start to look at their pocketbooks.

Remember even WITH swift boating and a good economy Kerry lost a number of states by less than 5% points, including Ohio. Thats all about turnout my friend and Democrats are going to be turning out big time in November for Obama. Particularly young people and African Americans and women.

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Yesterday, John McCain actually said that if he’s president he’ll take on, and I quote, 'the old boys’ network in Washington.' I’m not making this up. This is somebody been in Congress for 26 years, who put seven of the most powerful Washington lobbyists in charge of his campaign. And now he tells us that he’s the one who’s gonna take on the old boys' network,” he said. “In the McCain campaign that’s called a staff meeting!- Obama, 9/17/2008

yes, many good points.

The main reason I would pick Hillary is she has already been through the Lee Atwater/Karl Rove smear cycle. this isn't the case with OBama yet, and there is no telling what kinds of idiotic stupidities he has been involved in that are yet to be revealed; so far just the known stuff is enough to sink him with the majority of independents, and the 'Vote For Obama! Because He's Black!' isn't really much of reason to run on against McCain, outside of the Democratic Party echo chamber. He is after all the Favorite Son of the Chicago Democratic Machine, and the " He's Different!!!' meme is a laughable and naive spin at best.

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"The real question of life after death isn't whether or not it exists, but even if it does, what problems this really solves." - Ludwig Wittgenstein

"A day without sunshine is, you know, night."- Shannon

Ajax, America is not ready for a black, muslim fathered president who spent 20 years eagerly listening to hate disguised as religion. What people say in public and what they do in the privacy of the voting booth are two very different things. That is why the SD's will give Hillary the nomination if she ends up close enough to the boy wonder.
I gare-on-tee!

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I look forward to the crow you'll be eating Chassis.

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Yesterday, John McCain actually said that if he’s president he’ll take on, and I quote, 'the old boys’ network in Washington.' I’m not making this up. This is somebody been in Congress for 26 years, who put seven of the most powerful Washington lobbyists in charge of his campaign. And now he tells us that he’s the one who’s gonna take on the old boys' network,” he said. “In the McCain campaign that’s called a staff meeting!- Obama, 9/17/2008

*chuckle*

I am a big McCain supporter. You don't have to sell me on him.

And yes, Hillary Clinton has many negatives. But she is turning out to be far more formidable than I expected.

Part of the reason is because Obama is so much further left than he had first portrayed himself. In comparison, she is moderate. And that means she may have some appeal for people who would never think of voting for a true leftist like Obama.

__________________
"Our fears in Banquo
Stick deep; in his royalty of nature
Reigns that which would be fear'd: 'tis much he dares;
And, to that dauntless temper of his mind,
He hath a wisdom that doth guide his valour
To act in safety."

Macbeth 3:1

We'll see soon enough. Personally, I see Hillary winning the nomination in a smoke filled back room convention deal with the 'so called' super delegates. She is not going to give up before the convention and she shouldn't. Obama has not "closed the deal". That is very telling.

Either way, I think that Hillary or Obama both lose to McCain in the General election, and by a pretty good margin.

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I think at this point there needs to be a focus on an immediate increase in spending and I think this is a time when deficit fear has to take a second seat . . . I believe later on there should be tax increases. Speaking personally, I think there are a lot of very rich people out there whom we can tax at a point down the road and recover some of the money."
-- Barney Frank, October 20, 2008

Hey, no prob, I'm one of the very few on this forum that can admit when I've been whooped. You may get a plate yourself.

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Now that the PA primary is over, I believe I can safely announce that Hillary Clinton will not be the next president. Here's my reasoning.

Obama currently leads her in both delegate count and popular vote. He has not, however, secured the majority of delegates needed to clinch the nomination. If Hillary had managed a huge blowout win in PA, sufficient to catch up with Obama in either or both of those measures, then she could have legitimately argued to the superdelegates that she should be supported as the choice of the majority of Democrats.

Since she did not, Obama remains the front-runner. Theoretically, it remains possible that Clinton could pull off a smoke-filled-room deal, but if she did, it would brand her in the eyes of most Democrats (indeed, of most Americans) as an illegitimate choice foisted on the voters by the party machine.

That happened to the Republicans in 1912. Theodore Roosevelt, after sitting out for a term, ran against the incumbent president William H. Taft. Roosevelt won most of the primaries, but the party bigwigs still tossed the nomination to Taft -- TR had never been popular with them, being a liberal reformer in what was already becoming increasingly a party of corporatist conservatives; they could have won the election by backing him but it would have been self-defeating considering the reasons they were motivated to win in the first place. Roosevelt stomped out of the GOP convention, formed a third party, ran on that ticket, and actually beat Taft in the general election, but lost to Democrat Woodrow Wilson.

I can't see Obama doing what Roosevelt did, but such a "theft" (as it will be seen) of the nomination by Hillary would hurt her campaign badly in the fall. If she does that, we will see a McCain presidency.