Africa is a continent. And I'm sorry. I just...can't. Like there are posters on this board who differ with me on race relations but they are at least coming from SOME kind of knowledge base about American history. I don't have words for that statement really.

Regardless of how America has or has not treated African Americans, there's not denigrating anything with the term "African American." Are Italian-Americans forced to not celebrate columbus day and wave Italian flags as they do so. Should we ask Irish Americans to stop getting drunk on St. Patricks day and splashing eveyrone with green paint? Do Italians, Poles, Irish, Russian and other Americans have to actually have been to those nations in order for their celebration of that cultural history to be "acceptable" to you. Frankly, I kind of love all that about America. I get to sample (if watered down) alot of different cultures, histories, foods! What is the big deal. The label African American isn't hurting you or anyone else.


Look in a mirror when it comes to showing others respect. Why can't African Americans decide how they want to be called. If you are a black American and you dont want to be called African American..then don't. However, you seem to think it's "disrespectful" for African Americans to look back on a cultural legacy and say "I like that, that's kind of cool, I identify with it." Disrespectful to whom? I really don't get it Lost.

Also, nearly every African American person I know who has been to Ghana (the primary tourist location for African American travelers to Africa) said they had a wonderful time many had deeply emotional experiences. And then they came back to America and went back to their jobs (I might add that African Americans who can afford to go to Africa tend to have well paying jobs).

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Yesterday, John McCain actually said that if he’s president he’ll take on, and I quote, 'the old boys’ network in Washington.' I’m not making this up. This is somebody been in Congress for 26 years, who put seven of the most powerful Washington lobbyists in charge of his campaign. And now he tells us that he’s the one who’s gonna take on the old boys' network,” he said. “In the McCain campaign that’s called a staff meeting!- Obama, 9/17/2008

I think that captures much of it. I certainly saw it at the polls here in PA as a Judge of Elections and in all the talk surrounding the primary.

Women and blacks have been voting for white males for POTUS for as long as they have been able to vote. This time, though, both blacks and women--and especially black women--were often put in a tough situation for one very important reason--neither a woman or a black man have ever had a genuine chance like this to become the POTUS before. Pardon the crude analogy, but it presents a 'cherry popping' event for those who have never seen one of their own identity make it to the highest office of the nation. Indeed, Jews were very excited when Lieberman was on the VP ticket in 2000. Catholics were very excited and motivated when JFK posed the first chance for a Catholic to become POTUS. I think once the threshold gets crossed for the first time much of this will go back to normal.

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Around 200,000 Irish immigrants served in the Union and Confederate armies in the American Civil War, often forming their own regiments and, at times, fought each other. At Fredericksburg, the Union’s Irish Brigade faced the Irish McMillan's Guards of Cobb's 24th Georgia entrenched in a sunken road behind a stone wall. Ordered to make a suicidal charge, it became one of the most famous events of the Civil War. The re-enactment portrayed in the movie Gods and Generals:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qVCxEupPag

What a candidate's ideals are and plans to implement those ideals are more important to me than their religion, their gender, their ethnicity, etc. I think MLK would agree with me, too.

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I am an American. That's the way most of us put it, just matter of factly. They are plain words, those four: you could write them on your thumbnail, or sweep them clear across this bright autumn sky. But remember too, that they are more than just words. They are a way of life. So whenever you speak them, speak them firmly, speak them proudly, speak them gratefully. I am an American. ...a tradition

That is the position of many for sure and in a perfect world, it should be.

Then again, in a perfect world, there wouldn't be a perfect uniterrupted chain of over 200 year history of white males having served as POTUS. And in that unbroken chain, all but one recent POTUS was a Protestant, almost all were WASP ethnically, and far more often than not they were rich and/or well connected. And that pattern is no accident--it was very intentionally created in past law and/or societal bias. For many Americans who don't fit that mould, they want just a little piece of the POTUS action for themselves for once.

I'm not saying it's right in an objective sense to allow characteristic bias to play a role, but it's understandable given the history as explained for a woman and/or black person to want to finally see one of their own characteristic finally make it to the White House. It's the end dream of a long multi-generational struggle to see such a thing occur.

I'm quite sure they also know that some whites and/or men in society are still opposed to seeing a woman or black in office and/or put more stringent requirements on them than they would for one of their own for whom they cut more slack.

I'm not sure what MLK would think. I would think he would agree with what you said in principle given his "I have a dream" speech. Then again, CMS is correct--whilst today he gets lauded as a hero, at the time a large percentage of white people mostly hounded him as a radical, a socialist, a reverse bigot, a 'threat,' etc, despite the existence of Jim Crow and other bias, etc. Even elements of the government kept files and investigated him because he was considered a 'dangerous element' if you will. I think MLK would have loved to see Obama where he is now, but I have a sneaking feeling he'd also like to see that dream come true too by seeing a viable black person elected to break the barrier. But, only his spirit knows.

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Around 200,000 Irish immigrants served in the Union and Confederate armies in the American Civil War, often forming their own regiments and, at times, fought each other. At Fredericksburg, the Union’s Irish Brigade faced the Irish McMillan's Guards of Cobb's 24th Georgia entrenched in a sunken road behind a stone wall. Ordered to make a suicidal charge, it became one of the most famous events of the Civil War. The re-enactment portrayed in the movie Gods and Generals:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qVCxEupPag

Lost Soul:

Just to put things in perspective, I'm an English/Irish/Scottish/French American (also part black and part Cherokee, but never mind that). I've never been to Europe, and my white ancestors have been here since 1640. (My black ancestors for about the same amount of time, and of course my Cherokee ancestors much longer.)

Since I look like a white guy, blue eyes and everything, I don't really have a problem with considering myself a European-American, which is mostly true. That doesn't mean that I put Europe before America, it's just a true statement about my ancestral heritage, or a big chunk of it anyway. You're an African-American in the same way. It says some things about your ancestral heritage. Unless you, like Obama, are actually descended from an immigrant from Africa, it probably means that your ancestors were brought here as slaves. It means that your family has dealt with some of the toughest conditions ever imposed on Americans, and survived. To call you an African-American is simply to recognize and acknowledge that reality. It doesn't mean you were born in Africa, or that you want to live there, or even that you've ever been there. (You say you have, but I would imagine most African-Americans have not.)

If I'm willing to use the European-American tag, and someone with a more definite, less mixed source of ancestral heritage wouldn't hesitate to call himself or herself an Irish-American or an Italian-American or a Japanese-American or whatever, why is the African-American tag a problem for you?

As they are for most people, I'm sure.

If Obama were a far right wing conservative who wanted to raise troop levels in Iraq, creep the mission into Iran, raise taxes on the working class, and increase subsidies to big business, I doubt he would be getting anything near the support he's getting from the black community.

He's not just a black politician, but a black politician with a message that resonates.

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...Old Europe, a once-dominant region now reduced to sucking at the geopolitical teat of America... they spent the better part of the last millennium conquering the world and taking the good stuff home with them... And what do they get for their troubles? Ungrateful colonies demanding their independence. And after you taught them how to play cricket!...

-Jon Stewart

Why is it the only some blacks that demand to be called African Americans? My white friends don't scream and whine telling everyone to call them English Americans or Italian Americans. They are just Americans. Why is it only black that must be called African when if your trace everyones history back we all come from Africa. How would you feel if a white man walked up to you and demand you call him a African American? Like most blacks, they would be offended because everyone knows only a black person can be a African American.

Its petty and demeaning to this country to put another continent before America. Why don't we all just call yourselves North Americans? Pretty stupid if you ask me. No one is asking us to give up our culture, just only put America, the country you were raised and that has provided for you first.

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Bote OBAMA BIN BIDEN, OTAY!!




I say what many think but fail to say but would like to.

That's also true. In the last Governor's election in PA in 2006, Lynn Swann, the black conservative GOP candidate, got almost no crossover votes from blacks. The usual 90 percent of blacks voted for Ed Rendell, the Democratic incumbent Governor for re-election who is white. The same pattern happened in neighbouring MD where black conservative Michael Steele lost to the white Democratic candidate for the open Senate seat in the 2006 election. In a black on black race in the last 2006 election, Obama crushed GOP conservative Alan Keyes in the IL Senate race.

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Around 200,000 Irish immigrants served in the Union and Confederate armies in the American Civil War, often forming their own regiments and, at times, fought each other. At Fredericksburg, the Union’s Irish Brigade faced the Irish McMillan's Guards of Cobb's 24th Georgia entrenched in a sunken road behind a stone wall. Ordered to make a suicidal charge, it became one of the most famous events of the Civil War. The re-enactment portrayed in the movie Gods and Generals:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7qVCxEupPag

Because Africa has not given me a damn thing to show any loyalty. I would rather be called a South Carolinian than African. I sure in the hell don't call my sons African. They are more white than black anyways. I am half black half Jew. My wife family is Irish and Italian. But we are Americans. Even my liberal family on my father side will not call themselves African Americans. Seeing that we come from a long line of military, I guess the military got it out of us and it was passed down. I watched my grandfather on my mother side slap the piss out of his son one day when he called himself a Jewish American. Afterwards he told his son Israel is where they came from but they are ALL AMERICAN and damn proud of it. BTW, he is where I got my conservative values.

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Bote OBAMA BIN BIDEN, OTAY!!




I say what many think but fail to say but would like to.

THANK YOU--for acknowledging that. I get so tired of African Americans referring to themselves in that way. Just saying that-separates us. I don't refer to myself as Irish American. WE are all Americans. Most of us born in this country. No one else refers to their long past country of origin first, then the country they were born in. I imagine most blacks in this country, have never been to Africa, & would certainly have no desire to relocate there.