W Virginia keeps distance from Obama - U.S. Politics Online: A Political Discussion Forum

Lost Soul · #1 (**permalink**) 05-12-2008

Quote:

W Virginia keeps distance from Obama
By Andrew Ward

Published: May 11 2008 20:13 | Last updated: May 11 2008 20:13

Like most people in Mingo County, West Virginia, Leonard Simpson is a lifelong Democrat. But given a choice between Barack Obama and John McCain in November, the 67-year-old retired coalminer would vote Republican.

“I heard that Obama is a Muslim and his wife’s an atheist,” said Mr Simpson, drawing on a cigarette outside the fire station in Williamson, a coalmining town of 3,400 people surrounded by lush wooded hillsides.

A landslide victory for Mrs Clinton in West Virginia will do little to improve her fading hopes of winning the Democratic nomination, because Mr Obama has an almost insurmountable lead in the overall race.

But Tuesday’s contest is likely to reinforce Mrs Clinton’s argument that she would be the stronger opponent for Mr McCain in November, and raise fresh doubts about whether the US is ready to elect its first black president.

Occupying a swathe of the Appalachian Mountains on the threshold between the Bible Belt and the Rust Belt, West Virginia is a swing state that voted twice for George W. Bush but backed Democrats in six of the eight prior presidential elections.

No Democrat has been elected to the White House without carrying West Virginia since 1916, yet Mr Obama appears to have little chance of winning there in November. Recent opinion polls indicate that Mrs Clinton would narrowly beat Mr McCain in the state but Mr Obama would lose by nearly 20 percentage points.

West Virginia is hostile territory for Mr Obama because it has few of the African-Americans and affluent, college-educated whites who provide his strongest support. The state has the lowest college graduation rate in the US, the second lowest median household income, and one of the highest proportions of white residents, at 96 per cent.

A visit to Mingo County, a Democratic stronghold in the heart of the Appalachian coalfields, reveals the scale of Mr Obama’s challenge – not only in West Virginia but in white, working-class communities across the US. With a gun shop on its main street and churches dotted throughout the town, Williamson is the kind of community evoked by Mr Obama’s controversial comments last month about “bitter” small-town voters who “cling to guns or religion”.

“If he is the nominee, the Democrats have no chance of winning West Virginia,” said Missy Endicott, a 40- year-old school administrator. “He doesn’t understand ordinary Americans.”

Ms Endicott was among roughly 500 people who crammed into the Williamson Fire Department building on Friday to attend a rally by Bill Clinton, the former president. He told them his wife represented “people like you, in places like this”, and urged voters to turn out in record numbers on Tuesday to send a message to the “higher-type people” who were trying to force her out of the race.

Local leaders said Mr Clinton was the most important visitor to Williamson since John F. Kennedy passed through during the 1960 election campaign. Mr Kennedy’s victory in the West Virginia primary that year was a crucial step towards proving his electability as the first Catholic president. Nearly five decades later, the state appears less willing to help Mr Obama break down barriers to the White House.

None of the 22 Democrats interviewed by the Financial Times at the Clinton rally would commit themselves to voting for Mr Obama if he became the nominee, and half said they definitely would not. The depth of opposition is particularly striking considering that Mingo County is one of the most Democratic places in West Virginia, having cast about 85 per cent of its votes for the party in the 2006 midterm elections. If Mr Obama cannot win there in November, he has little chance of carrying the state.

Most people questioned said they mistrusted Mr Obama because of doubts about his patriotism and “values”, stemming from his cosmopolitan background, his exotic name and the controversy surrounding “anti-American” sermons by Jeremiah Wright, his former pastor. Several people said they believed he was a Muslim – an unfounded rumour that has circulated on the internet for months – despite the contradiction with his 20-year membership of Mr Wright’s church in Chicago. Others mentioned his refusal to wear a Stars and Stripes badge and controversial remarks by his wife, Mich*elle, who des*cribed America as “mean” and implied that she had never been proud of the US until her husband ran for president.

Conservative commentators have questioned Mr Obama’s patriotism for months and the issue is expected to be one of the Republicans’ main lines of attack if he wins the nomination. “The American people want a president who loves their country as much as they do,” said Whit Ayres, a Rep*ub*lican strategist. Obama supporters believe patriotism is being used as code to harness racist sentiment.

Josh Fry, a 24-year-old ambulance driver from Williamson, insisted he was not racist but said he would feel more comfortable with Mr McCain, the 71-year-old Vietnam war hero, in the White House. “I want someone who is a full-blooded American as president,” he said.

FT.com / World / US & Canada - W Virginia keeps distance from Obama

This coming from a democratic stronghold citizens. Six out of the last eight elections the state has gone to democrats.

This is really bad news for Obama because has stated, you cannot win the WH without this state.

Sheriff · #2 (**permalink**) 05-12-2008

For the first time sine 1916, one candidate will get the nomination without WV.

Quote:

Hillary who? Obama acts likes it's over - Carrie Budoff Brown and Kenneth P. Vogel - Politico.com
When the election returns filter in Tuesday from West Virginia, Sen. Barack Obama won’t be there. Nor will he leapfrog ahead to a later primary state, as he usually does on election nights.

Exercising his new-found role as the likely Democratic nominee, Obama will instead travel to Missouri, a general election swing state, to begin laying the groundwork for November. He will do the same next week in Florida, raising money and setting out on what aides describe as a fence-mending bid in the orphaned state.

The travel schedule is just one mark of a candidate eager to shift from primary to general election mode.

Obama and his aides repeatedly told reporters this weekend that the primary is not yet over. But the signs of change were everywhere during the senator’s first campaign trip after a big win in North Carolina and a narrow loss in Indiana nudged him closer than ever to the Democratic nomination.

In a two-day swing through Oregon, Obama purged Sen. Hillary Rodham Clinton from his stump speeches, addressing his Democratic rival only when asked by voters. Obama instead focused solely on Sen. John McCain, the presumptive Republican nominee.

With the race moving beyond the confines of the Democratic Party, the tone of introductory speeches at events has turned increasingly partisan. At a town hall meeting Friday, Rep. Peter DeFazio (D-Ore.) signaled a bare-knuckles approach, raising McCain’s involvement in the 1980s "Keating Five" banking scandal just minutes before Obama took the stage.

Hillary has lost. Period.

Rakkasan · #3 (**permalink**) 05-12-2008

as a ex service memenber you signature photo is unacceptable

MattLarson · #4 (**permalink**) 05-12-2008

Yeah, isn't it interesting that he decries using the troops for political purposes, while using the troops for political purposes?

However, don't expect him to man up and change it. If anything, your complaining about it will just cause him to become more offensive on the subject.

Matt

Mrs. M · #5 (**permalink**) 05-12-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rakkasan

as a ex service member your signature photo is unacceptable

I find it very offensive as well. But as we know, Rak, not everyone on this forum respects those of you that have risked your lives for this country.

iamwhatiseem · #6 (**permalink**) 05-12-2008

I don't see any candidate addressing the economy in an effectual manner...including Obama.
Obama's "economic fix" seems only to be to give stuff to the poor, which will not improve the economy at all.

Middle class families, such as mine paying 43% of our income in taxes (includes all payroll, excise and property taxes) is a HUGE, HUGE...H U G E detriment to the economy.
Add paying $3.75 a gallon for fuel, and about $500 a month for food....there is nothing left for spending money on goods that are the key to a sluggish economy.
Add in health care cost and premiums ($3300 so far for us this year) - and all a middle class family can do is pay bills, and TRY to save for kids college.

I have not bought a single unnecessary item since christmas...not even a DVD movie.
And I won't be for sometime......take my family and spread it across the entire nation - and you have the current economic mess.
Obama offers nothing but rhetoric to fix this.

mabus · #7 (**permalink**) 05-12-2008

Haha, my post got deleted. Was the picture of the fat guy too offensive? Damn, why must so many people hate fat guys.

Well, all this doesn't change the fact that this here:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lost Soul

This is really bad news for Obama because has stated, you cannot win the WH without this state.

Is still a major logical fallacy.

Johnny K · #8 (**permalink**) 05-12-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lost Soul

This is really bad news for Obama because has stated, you cannot win the WH without this state.

Yessiree...

... without WV's whopping 5 electoral votes Sen Obama might as well fold up his tent and go home!

iamwhatiseem · #9 (**permalink**) 05-12-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by mabus

Haha, my post got deleted. Was the picture of the fat guy too offensive? Damn, why must so many people hate fat guys.

Well, all this doesn't change the fact that this here:

Is still a major logical fallacy.

The post was deleted because the photo didn't seem relevant to the discussion whatsoever.

Imperator · #10 (**permalink**) 05-12-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamwhatiseem

I don't see any candidate addressing the economy in an effectual manner...including Obama.
Obama's "economic fix" seems only to be to give stuff to the poor, which will not improve the economy at all.

Middle class families, such as mine paying 43% of our income in taxes (includes all payroll, excise and property taxes) is a HUGE, HUGE...H U G E detriment to the economy.
Add paying $3.75 a gallon for fuel, and about $500 a month for food....there is nothing left for spending money on goods that are the key to a sluggish economy.
Add in health care cost and premiums ($3300 so far for us this year) - and all a middle class family can do is pay bills, and TRY to save for kids college.

I have not bought a single unnecessary item since christmas...not even a DVD movie.
And I won't be for sometime......take my family and spread it across the entire nation - and you have the current economic mess.
Obama offers nothing but rhetoric to fix this.

just wait till 2010 and the brackets start moving......43%? Dude.....bend over, wayyyyyy over. Obama makes me luagh, as far as the old classwarfare "giving to the poor", go read up on the new brackets if the tax cuts expire.
EVERYONE, will get whacked and I aint talking 2-3% here, not even close.

personally-
My wife and I take a 3 week vacation every year. We go to Hawaii or Europe, etc. This year, our vacation got jacked by fuel prices and the Euro both.
We’ll probably take 10 days go to S. Barbara and leave it at that. My wife and I both work very hard and under a great deal of stress, more than the norm I ‘d say, by a mile.
This pisses us off to no end. We could pony up the extra, but that’s BS, its half protest and half just getting mad at spending about 20% more now, than we have had too before.

Johnny K · #11 (**permalink**) 05-12-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamwhatiseem

I don't see any candidate addressing the economy in an effectual manner...including Obama.
Obama's "economic fix" seems only to be to give stuff to the poor, which will not improve the economy at all.

Middle class families, such as mine paying 43% of our income in taxes (includes all payroll, excise and property taxes) is a HUGE, HUGE...H U G E detriment to the economy.
Add paying $3.75 a gallon for fuel, and about $500 a month for food....there is nothing left for spending money on goods that are the key to a sluggish economy.
Add in health care cost and premiums ($3300 so far for us this year) - and all a middle class family can do is pay bills, and TRY to save for kids college.

I have not bought a single unnecessary item since christmas...not even a DVD movie.
And I won't be for sometime......take my family and spread it across the entire nation - and you have the current economic mess.
Obama offers nothing but rhetoric to fix this.

Interesting way of seeing it, iamwhatiseem. I see pretty much the same situation, and then hear McSame promising to keep doing the same things BushCo. has done, that got us where we are today, circling the bowl.

I always thought the best description of insanity was:

Doing the same stupid things that got you in trouble before, over again, and expecting different results.

mabus · #12 (**permalink**) 05-12-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamwhatiseem

The post was deleted because the photo didn't seem relevant to the discussion whatsoever.

Are you sure? But maybe ... the guy was from West Virginia.

Sorry just kidding.

I am still wondering what this thread is about. "Obama has lost the presidential election because some people from West Virginia don't approve him", or what? I'm irritated, since when do the right-wingers uphold a fighting spirit made in France? With this fighting spirit, "Operation Iraqi Freedom" already would have been over before it began.

And yes, I know, that would have been awesome.

iamwhatiseem · #13 (**permalink**) 05-12-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Imperator

....This pisses us off to no end. We could pony up the extra, but that’s BS, its half protest and half just getting mad at spending about 20% more now, than we have had too before.

Damn straight.
I run a multi-million$ company, my wife is an AP manager making fairly decent wages.
Yet I feel like we are working a couple lower level jobs making $10 an hour.
Our vacation this year is reduced to renting a cabin in TN for a week...nice but hardly a vacation that I would like to have considering my daughter is a junior in high school - we only have a couple years left with her - I would like to go somewhere better than that - but I cannot fork over $3-$4k this year...no way, and I am NOT borrowing it.
Thank goodness we live within our income including the ability to put monies in investment and retirement, and for both kids education. I don't have to worry about meeting bills, unlike many others. However all the disposable income we use to have is eaten up by the things in my first post ---- and this is what is killing the economy, and nothing that does not include addressing this problem will help the economy one iota.

TheLastBoyScout · #14 (**permalink**) 05-12-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lost Soul

FT.com / World / US & Canada - W Virginia keeps distance from Obama

This coming from a democratic stronghold citizens. Six out of the last eight elections the state has gone to democrats.

This is really bad news for Obama because has stated, you cannot win the WH without this state.

That sounds like a Hillary argument. Are you basically saying that Hillary is correct?

pramjockey · #15 (**permalink**) 05-12-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by iamwhatiseem

I don't see any candidate addressing the economy in an effectual manner...including Obama.
Obama's "economic fix" seems only to be to give stuff to the poor, which will not improve the economy at all.

Middle class families, such as mine paying 43% of our income in taxes (includes all payroll, excise and property taxes) is a HUGE, HUGE...H U G E detriment to the economy.
Add paying $3.75 a gallon for fuel, and about $500 a month for food....there is nothing left for spending money on goods that are the key to a sluggish economy.
Add in health care cost and premiums ($3300 so far for us this year) - and all a middle class family can do is pay bills, and TRY to save for kids college.

I have not bought a single unnecessary item since christmas...not even a DVD movie.
And I won't be for sometime......take my family and spread it across the entire nation - and you have the current economic mess.
Obama offers nothing but rhetoric to fix this.

43%?

I'd say that it's time to be looking for a new accountant, if you really are middle class.

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