There's nothing wrong with saying that. However, because you have the word Democrat next to your avatar, many people have a natural reflex to respond with hostility.

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"The nice part about being a pessimist is that you are constantly being either proven right or pleasantly surprised.”
- George Will

An old worn out argument.

We're there now....it's up to us to make things right. That means assuring that Iraq can stand on it's own feet again.

Do you want us to just say fuck it and leave?

Wouldn't be very smart............but then you most likely think it would teach us a lesson.

Problem is we've been learning lessons since 2003.

Maybe you think we should just nuke the fuckers from orbit.......?

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"These two entities, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, are not facing any kind of financial crisis,"

"The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies,

the less we will see in terms of affordable housing." - Rep. Barney Frank (D)

If our trainers do their jobs we won't have to worry about a draw-down being a problem because Iraq will have an effective military again....which seems to be the case now.

We can then stand-down most of our troops and just leave a few technical support people behind. Most of our equipment can be moved back to Kuwait just in case.

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"These two entities, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, are not facing any kind of financial crisis,"

"The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies,

the less we will see in terms of affordable housing." - Rep. Barney Frank (D)

I'm not even a democrat supporter mate (though i do like Obama) A social democrat is a political tag, like COmmunist and Socalist, which is on the right of Socalism-think the SPD in Germany/England.

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I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it. - Voltaire

There is no instance of a country having benefited from prolonged warfare. - Art of War, Sun-Tzu, Chapter 2, Paragraph 6

"An eye for an eye makes everyone blind"-Gandi

Thats what I hope will happen, but sadly I fear that the insurgents are just sitting back and know you can;t sustain the surge.

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I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it. - Voltaire

There is no instance of a country having benefited from prolonged warfare. - Art of War, Sun-Tzu, Chapter 2, Paragraph 6

"An eye for an eye makes everyone blind"-Gandi

An old unanswered argument, one to which you still have not given a good answer.

When you've taken a wrong turn, the right action is to turn around, not to keep going.

Or are you trying to say there's "light at the end of the tunnel"? Shall we, perhaps, resort to "Iraqization"? Or will it be necessary to destroy the country in order to save it?

Well said, sir.

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"Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God."
Matthew 5:9

An old argument that has been argued till we're blue in the face. Arguing about it isn't going to change a thing.

And another thing, you are under some strange assumption that it is the United States trying to destroy Iraq when in fact we are trying to save it from Al Qaeda and Iranian invaders.

But to people like you, that doesn't matter because it shouldn't have ever happened in the first place....according to you......which still doesn't prove anything nor change anything.

We could just leave.....like the Russians left Afghanistan.....leave the country in shambles and say...."sorry....my bag!! Let them fend for themselves!!" Which is why the Taliban ruled Afghanistan with an iron fist until we booted them back into the mountians of Pakistan.

But instead we're in the process of fixing what we broke.....which wasn't all that great in the first place.

Having been in that region myself and having seen what the Republican Guard did to it's neighbors I don't think the world is going to miss that government one single bit.

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"These two entities, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, are not facing any kind of financial crisis,"

"The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies,

the less we will see in terms of affordable housing." - Rep. Barney Frank (D)

You're right. Only electing Obama and Congressional Democrats will change a thing.

Considering that those "invaders" wouldn't be there if we were not there being invaders ourselves, that's not a very convincing argument.

However, I was not literally suggesting we were trying to "destroy Iraq." That was a reference to one of the most infamous statements from the Vietnam War: "We had to destroy the village in order to save it." We weren't literally trying to "destroy Vietnam," either, but such destruction is an inevitable consequence of invasion and occupation by a foreign power, such as ourselves.

The country will be in shambles when we leave regardless of when that happens; hell, it's in shambles now! But the sooner we do, the sooner that will be rectified. We are trying to do a job -- or at least pretending to try to do a job, I'm not sure we're actually trying -- that can't be done by us. That is always a recipe for disaster.

Well, at least you're admitting we broke it. I suppose that's progress. When you figure out that our presence is keeping it broken, and that there's no way WE can fix it, it has to be fixed by the Iraqis themselves, and they can't do that as long as we're there keeping the situation broken, then you will have finished coming to your senses on this matter.

Indeed it won't, but it won't miss the one we're propping up, either. Sometimes, really in the majority of wars, there aren't any good guys. And sometimes the only winning move is not to play.

TSGracchusReally? They had control for almost two years now. The promise (lie) to the voters is still fresh on their lips to start pulling the troops out. Yet they allowed the surge with put more troops in Iraq (btw which is a good thing and props to them for it)



This is pure BS and you know it. Are you forgetting the war between Iraq and Iran in the 80's? Iran was rebuilding, the proof we see in Iraq everyday, where Iraq was talking big but their military was still feeling the effects of a sanction progress and the military defeat in 91. I was in Kuwait city (we 82nd secured the airport to make way for reinforcements). We destroyed the Republican Guard and the majority of their armour as they retreated back into Iraq. Iran was waiting in the fold for a chance to invade. Iran uses 60% of its oil and imports 40%. With the Iraq oil fields, Iran could become self efficient.

This is crap. We have started rebuilding Iraq inter-structure because it was in ruin because of Saddam neglect. One street there would a Grand Palace and on the next would be abandoned schools, housing, clinics and shops. We reopened schools that were closed for years and the kids was being taught by women from the community or by tribe elders.


Its was in shambles when we got there. 12 years of sanctions does that to a country. We have rebuilt more than we have destroyed.

This is pure ingorance from someone that has never stepped foot in a country they think they know everything about. You should stop before I start posting personal pictures the rebuilding and new structures being built by our engineers.



More clueless rant from someone who is just spouting off about something they have read about without seeing it first hand. Not all your fault as good news out of Iraq is seldom reported by the MSM because good news equals bad ratings and high polling for Bush.


What would you know about war? Just because I read a book about plumbing does it make me a master plumber?

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Bote OBAMA BIN BIDEN, OTAY!!




I say what many think but fail to say but would like to.

I'm not going to waste any more time talking to somebody who's only rational for arguing about the Iraq Conflict is worn out stereotypes about American Imperialism.

I've argued this point too many times to do it again because it proves nothing and solves nothing. Until you folks learn that you can't base everything off of claiming that the invasion was illegal...which it wasn't....you can't win......and we only end up going in circles if we continue this.

The point is now that we're there it is up to us to be responsible and fix what we broke......not leave a mess....like you want us to. That would be unbelievably irresponsible and would only give people like you something else to brow-beat us about.

Your belief that the sooner we leave the sooner the carnage can begin is a horse-shit answer and not even worth talking about. We'd only end up doing it to save a few bucks....which the Dems will end up spending on worthless entitlements or friggen Global Warming anyway.

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"These two entities, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, are not facing any kind of financial crisis,"

"The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies,

the less we will see in terms of affordable housing." - Rep. Barney Frank (D)

This is the only nation that can rebound from a disaster and put people lives back together a a reasonable short period. LA after a terrible earth quake has rebuilt and you cannot even tell what was destroyed.

New Orleans is coming back strong after one of this country worst hurricanes.

Back in 89 I was home on leave when Hugo (cat 5) hit my home town. The next morning you couldn't even see a tree standing or recognize landmarks because they were gone. The National Forest (Francis Marion) which was hit the hardest, now has trees growth and they are actually logging some of the border property next to the park.

So to claim that we cannot rebuild Iraq is laughable. Considering the new construction by both the military and private contractor popping up all around Iraq just proves your lack of first hand knowledge of what is really going on in country.

I believe you are bright enough to seek out the truth if you would let your common sense control your rabid anti war stance to see the truth of the many good and positive steps towards a new and free Iraq.

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Bote OBAMA BIN BIDEN, OTAY!!




I say what many think but fail to say but would like to.

The only nation...?

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"Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God."
Matthew 5:9

The only nation....Willing To Do It....

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"These two entities, Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, are not facing any kind of financial crisis,"

"The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies,

the less we will see in terms of affordable housing." - Rep. Barney Frank (D)

that being your opinon then I see no reason to disuss it any further with you. your mind is made up.

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Obama-e fungis nati homines....